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smeagolsfree

Is Nashville Ready for new upscale apartements DT

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I was talking to William over the weekend and we were discussing the fact that many of the apartments DT have converted to condos. I said back before the first of the year that Nashville is prime for some high-rise apartments.

Has anyone heard any rumors or have any thoughts of good development property for this to happen? IMO, the area around Church in the gay district would be prime for new apartments. There are a number of vacant lots and warehouses in this area.

How much are we talking about as far as construction cost to build a new mid rise quality building? I noticed there was an apartment community in Franklin that just sold for 68 million. A number of Nashville apartment properties have sold over the past year for record prices. This makes me believe we are on the verge of an apartment boom with home prices rising and interest rates going higher as well..

Thoughts??????

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Would've been nice to have some of those affordable apartments in Siggy. But the rich overpowered the "poor" in this situation. LOL!!

To answer your question though Ron, no I haven't heard anything. I have heard that if there was to be new apartment construction DT, it would most likely be south of Broadway as that neighborhood is shaping up to be a prime apartment/condo spot.

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You know that rumor about apartments has been floating out there wrt Giarratana and his Church Street property. However, the market lately hasn't favored apartments (w/ low interest rates and low rents).

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I was talking to William over the weekend and we were discussing the fact that many of the apartments DT have converted to condos. I said back before the first of the year that Nashville is prime for some high-rise apartments.

Has anyone heard any rumors or have any thoughts of good development property for this to happen? IMO, the area around Church in the gay district would be prime for new apartments. There are a number of vacant lots and warehouses in this area.

How much are we talking about as far as construction cost to build a new mid rise quality building? I noticed there was an apartment community in Franklin that just sold for 68 million. A number of Nashville apartment properties have sold over the past year for record prices. This makes me believe we are on the verge of an apartment boom with home prices rising and interest rates going higher as well..

Thoughts??????

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:unsure: I think that maybe units at the $100 - 125 sq ft price would work. We would move for a unit of 1500 sq ft "two bedroom and an office" for $1700 per month. I would rather invest in stocks than play the real estate game right now.

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Somehow the city needs to get involved to make sure there are affordable yet quality rental units in the downtown core. If everything is private and seeks the same "upscale customer" then our downtown will be void of the day-to-day life that young professionals bring.

Something in the 15 story range would be very good. I saw 2 great towers in Indy a couple of weeks ago - they're from the 1960's or 1970's but the style was classic if not a wee bit mod too. Something like that could only be good for downtown.

I agree, the Church Street corridor would be another good place for apartments.

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How about just new apartments, period? Why does everything have to be upscale? I looked into renting at the Stahlman, a wonderful property, but my salary is above their cut-off to be eligible for the "lower-income" apartments. From what I understood, I'd have to make under $34,000 to be eligible for an $805 one bedroom.

I know it's the trend all across the country, but a lot of young professionals are not making that much money, work in the city, and do not want to have to commute from some bland apartment complex way down one of the interstates. I wish the city would create more incentives for developers to build attractive, affordable rental properties for the teachers, librarians, police officers, etc. who serve the city but are increasingly being priced out of the very areas in which they work.

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I think developers will continue to find it difficult to make apartment deals work as long as condo prices continue to escalate or even maintain their footing. If that trend begins to reverse itself (as it seems to be at the V) apartment rents continue to escalate then I think you could see more developer interest in luxury apartments. Chas Sysk wrote an article a few weeks ago that was discussed at length on UP. It pointed out that developers are watching the new project resales very closely to try and determine pricing equilibrium, if you will. Although it wasn't mentioned in the article, land sellers also pay close attention to these selling prices and typically get quite "proud" of their dirt when they see even a few condos breaking the $400/sf mark. Unfortunately, even when some of these sales turn out to be outliers and not indicative of the true fundamental price support for condos they don't generally reduce the asking prices for the land. Hence, these prices tend to get pushed up much quicker than they get adjusted down. I mention this because the phenomenon generally contrains the availability of land for apartment deals...not indefinitely but certainly in the short term (3 -18 mos).

On a somewhat related point I wonder whether this board may be placing too much of a priority on affordable housing. :stop: I know some of you may crucify me for this (and perhaps the topic should have it's own thread) but why do so many seem indifferent or even offended by the development of projects (sans ST) that cater to the wealthy ? Aside from addressing this demographic's housing needs (which seems appropriate) there are many other benefits that may be going unnoticed or at least under appreciated. Luxury projects in Nashville as in other markets generally allow the architects and builders more freedom to use durable/sustainable materials, bury overhead lines, improve streetscapes, pay for more appealing archictectural features and even attract top retail and restaurant tenants to their ground floor retail space (which all urban projects should have IMO). Just because everyone may not be able to afford to live in the condos above doesn't mean the public space at the pedestrian level doesn't still have incredible utility to everyone, unless, of course, we think a means test should apply to the cost of a drink, a steak and/or a pair of jeans as well.

Frankly, given the diversity of urban housing choices we seem to have already in downtown, East Nashville, Germantown, Rutledge Hill, 8th Ave and 12th Ave, I think there exists a good mix of housing options and that we probably need more (as a percentage) at the upper end to attract the kind of retail and restuarant life that everyone seems to be longing for. Unpleasant as it may seem to some, all retailers want to know about is rooftops AND income levels. And like it or not neither of those numbers are very compelling in our core. For those that travel frequently I'd also ask whether it's New York, SF, Baltimore, Portand or Charlotte, when you picture that wonderful cadre of shops and cafes beneath residential and office do you generally experience it beneath affordable housing or do some of the more enjoyable outdoor experiences come beneath some of the more high-end projects ? Something to think about. BTW, I'm not trying to incite a class warfare discussion here. To the contrary I think lots of housing choices can and should harmoniously co-exist (like Laurel House and Terrazo presumably will). But given the topic of this thread and our recent discussions about developer quality and material choices I thought this might be an appropriate place to render a comment. Please accept it in the constructive spirit with which it was intended.

EDIT: I should have also mentioned that incredible land demand from the hotel sector has also pushed up land prices and together with demand for condos has contributed to making it hard for developers of urban luxury apartments to make the numbers work. So, even if the condo sector cools a bit the hotel bidding wars will need to pass for land prices to get realistic again for apartments.

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Oh, I'm not offended. I'm tickled to death with projects like the Signature Tower. It's fun to live vicariously through others, and I'm looking forward to the collateral assets that will come with downtown affluence.

At the same time, though, gentrification often results in bland-ification.

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Thanks for the response Jeeper. That is insight I have not thought about before and makes a lot of sense. We are just now starting to build more condos in the DT area and we cant expect the whole shortage in available units to correct itself overnight. This is going ot take some time. It only makes sense that the upscale units would be build first as that is where the money is.

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I agree, great points made by all. I think that as far as restaurants and shops go, I would expect more brand name shops in the luxury buildings and a more eclectic types in the less expensive developments. Not only would it give those places more character, but would pull money from the more expensive markets.

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Check out this apartment project in San Antonio. It will have over 200 market rate apartments (what does that mean?) and 30K ft2 of retail. From what I can tell, it's a brand new project, but looks like it was built in the 1920s with art deco.

Would this look good in The Gulch?

http://www.thevistana.com/

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^ Something like that seems like it would work perfectly in the Gulch or along the Church Street corridor through Baptist Hospital up to Elliston Place. When one considers everything else that's going on around Midtown, the Church Street corridor in particular seems primed for some new residential growth with first floor retail.

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