Granby Tower

[mikeas]

Townhomes were covering the parking garage

Well if it gets built hopefully ground level retail or restraunts will reside there instead. I was hoping that traingle lot would have still been open for development. Who wouldn't want a triangular condo/apartment/office?

[vdogg]

The parking garage would still be covered. The space where the townhomes were is being converted to retail and office.

[Sky06]

I think some of you are reading too much into the Pilot's references to the "financiers." It sounds to me that there is one prospective lender (and they are prospective until things are finalized) and that Gaddams is in negotiation with "them." We often say "them" to refer to one company. Unless I'm mistaken, it sounds not as if he's out there fishing around but that the "financiers" refer to a specific company. So on that point, no one is lying.

[vdogg]

I think some of you are reading too much into the Pilot's references to the "financiers." It sounds to me that there is one prospective lender (and they are prospective until things are finalized) and that Gaddams is in negotiation with "them." We often say "them" to refer to one company. Unless I'm mistaken, it sounds not as if he's out there fishing around but that the "financiers" refer to a specific company. So on that point, no one is lying.

I'll actually agree with you on this point, cause thats the way I read it too. I think it's the same lender,whether that lender will bite is another question. The changes to the make-up of the project is most likely a direct result of this lenders involvement, likely because they were refusing to finance the project in its original form. I wouldn't be surprised to see other changes if this makes it through the process.

[spiker3]

I think some of you are reading too much into the Pilot's references to the "financiers." It sounds to me that there is one prospective lender (and they are prospective until things are finalized) and that Gaddams is in negotiation with "them." We often say "them" to refer to one company. Unless I'm mistaken, it sounds not as if he's out there fishing around but that the "financiers" refer to a specific company. So on that point, no one is lying.

I could see that, looking at it now. 'Prospective' made it go the other way for me, adding in plural, lenders. However, negotiations and changes in development, etc still point to the same lie about financing being around the corner for the last three months. Granted i don't much about commercial real estate practices, but after agreeing in principle to a deal you close roughly 30 - 90 days after that? That they're still negotiating and meeting with 'prospective lenders' at this stage flies in the face of the idea that they'll be closed and resumed in two weeks. I agree vdogg about the changes in the project also, and definitely feel more are coming. More changes = higher probability of success, so by all means. I am concerned about the excess of unsold condos at this point though as well....converting to apartments is a surefire way to go, hopefully the lender will see it that was as well. 40% sold isn't exactly heart warming (even with the bad publicity, there's plenty of people like first2sign who are buckled in for the long haul, so they're obviously out there)...what happens if a bank fronts the money and the building sits half empty? (i'm seriously asking, like what's happening in Miami? The loan defaults and the bank buys the building or what happens?)

[Former Resident of HR]

You all act like this the the end of the world as we know it. If the project falls through, there will be something else built there sooner than later. The economy has rises and falls and life goes on. There are plenty of spaces here and there that will eventually be turned into buildings, so at least DT Norfolk has turned the corner and is not going back to parking lots. I would not be surprised if that lot behind the Union Mission sprouts into a tall building (if not the entire site) eventually as well as some of the waterfront area near Harbor Park. We'll get there... eventually.

[spiker3]

You all act like this the the end of the world as we know it. If the project falls through, there will be something else built there sooner than later. The economy has rises and falls and life goes on. There are plenty of spaces here and there that will eventually be turned into buildings, so at least DT Norfolk has turned the corner and is not going back to parking lots. I would not be surprised if that lot behind the Union Mission sprouts into a tall building (if not the entire site) eventually as well as some of the waterfront area near Harbor Park. We'll get there... eventually.

Actually, we thought we had turned a corner, then we got confirmation of the proposed permanent parking lot at St Paul's quadrant...

And my thoughts boil down to this: after all the bs, lies, delays and excuses we've been put through for the last three years, come hell or high water Gaddams better get this done, one way or the other. If the lender says paint it pink then by God paint the building pink and tell them you love the color

[vdogg]

To add to this JPN, there is no guarantee that a structure that adds to Norfolks economic vitality would go on that lot. If the deal falls through, the feds could easily switch plans back to expanding the courthouse onto this lot, which is the cheaper plan. This would effectively kill northward expansion along Granby street and take valuable property off the tax rolls. End of the world? Certainly not. Significant and devastating to downtowns revitalization? Certainly.

[wrldcoupe4]

To add to this JPN, there is no guarantee that a structure that adds to Norfolks economic vitality would go on that lot. If the deal falls through, the feds could easily switch plans back to expanding the courthouse onto this lot, which is the cheaper plan. This would effectively kill northward expansion along Granby street and take valuable property off the tax rolls. End of the world? Certainly not. Significant and devastating to downtowns revitalization? Certainly.

Economic vitality? I can't speak for Norfolk, but the new Federal Courthouse expansion in Richmond when finished next year will be an economic blessing.

[vdogg]

Economic vitality? I can't speak for Norfolk, but the new Federal Courthouse expansion in Richmond when finished next year will be an economic blessing.

The feds take up a disproportionate amount of land in HR in general and Norfolk specifically. A federal courthouse does not generate the foot traffic and retail presence necessary to justify extending development across brambleton. The federal courthouse has existed there for many years and has done absolutely nothing to help that economically depressed section of downtown. I fail to see how an expansion will achieve any better.

[burt]

The feds take up a disproportionate amount of land in HR in general and Norfolk specifically. A federal courthouse does not generate the foot traffic and retail presence necessary to justify extending development across brambleton. The federal courthouse has existed there for many years and has done absolutely nothing to help that economically depressed section of downtown. I fail to see how an expansion will achieve any better.

The Fed CH in Richmond is a major Circuit Court of Appeals which generates a lot of trafic. But a new and/or expanded one in Norfolk certainly should be a boost to the area near Brambleton and Granby. It's always a bitter disappointment when highly expected construction does not occur, especially when it promises a signature "tallest in the city" tower. When the market improves, Gaddams or another developer will build on that valuable site. Meanwhile, a lot of cities are drooling in envy over TIDE, Residence Inn, Hampton Inn, The Hilton, Wachovia and a proposed Symphony Hall. Norfolk has a lot on its plate, and the dramatic turn-around it has experienced in the last decade and a half is staggering.

[NSUREDD]

I will not belive that this will be built until.................they put a News Three Web Cam at the top for a back drop during the Weather.........The first family moves out after two Christmas Holidays.................They start selling post cards with pictures of the tower on them at Waterside.............then I might belive that this thing will be built.

[vdogg]

Curious enough, they haven't broken down the last pile driver yet. I wonder if last week was a ploy by the contractor in order to get Gadams to pay them the money. Either that, or Gadams begged them to hold out until the end of the month in the hopes that he'll have financing.

[Sky06]

However, negotiations and changes in development, etc still point to the same lie about financing being around the corner for the last three months. Granted i don't much about commercial real estate practices, but after agreeing in principle to a deal you close roughly 30 - 90 days after that?

Help me out here. If someone says they expect something to be completed by a certain date, and that goal isn't met, they are lying? So if you tell your wife, brother, kid, that you expect to be home by 6 and you get stuck in traffic, there's a detour, a cop stops you, your car falls apart, etc. etc., you're lying? Hmm.

[Chesapeake Pirate]

Help me out here. If someone says they expect something to be completed by a certain date, and that goal isn't met, they are lying? So if you tell your wife, brother, kid, that you expect to be home by 6 and you get stuck in traffic, there's a detour, a cop stops you, your car falls apart, etc. etc., you're lying? Hmm.

Obviously, you make a right-on point. However, you are interfering with the grievers. Many are still in the anger stage.

[spiker3]

"July 2004

[Sky06]

"July 24, 2006

[spiker3]

Obviously there's no way for anyone besides Gaddams to know what's going on behind the scenes. Your adjectives are dead on. But who's to say what the reasons for the financial delays are? We have a commitment from a top 10 national lender and will resume construction soon, or somethin to that effect in September. That to me is lying, but yes it could be delays. My point is not that Gaddams is a liar. Or unethical, or disorganized or pie-in-the-sky. The point is he's bungled this project from the get go, and we're at three and a half years later, and if it were LTD or Armada Hoffler or anyone we'd have this project nearing completion at this point. Since being unable to obtain financing repeatedly, Gaddams is now trying to line up a Hampton Roads record $140+ million loan. The previous record? Westin, at $121 million. I fully support this project, in it's current form or new form or whatever form. I want the damn thing built...badly. I believe it will be built...at somepoint. We worry so much for this building because of the potential and reward and height and prestige, etc etc. The problem? We don't have this building, construction progress or reliable news because of Marathon Development and Buddy Gaddams.

[mistermetaj]

Obviously there's no way for anyone besides Gaddams to know what's going on behind the scenes. Your adjectives are dead on. But who's to say what the reasons for the financial delays are? We have a commitment from a top 10 national lender and will resume construction soon, or somethin to that effect in September. That to me is lying, but yes it could be delays. My point is not that Gaddams is a liar. Or unethical, or disorganized or pie-in-the-sky. The point is he's bungled this project from the get go, and we're at three and a half years later, and if it were LTD or Armada Hoffler or anyone we'd have this project nearing completion at this point. Since being unable to obtain financing repeatedly, Gaddams is now trying to line up a Hampton Roads record $140+ million loan. The previous record? Westin, at $121 million. I fully support this project, in it's current form or new form or whatever form. I want the damn thing built...badly. I believe it will be built...at somepoint. We worry so much for this building because of the potential and reward and height and prestige, etc etc. The problem? We don't have this building, construction progress or reliable news because of Marathon Development and Buddy Gaddams.

It took 5 years for Dominion Tower to get off the ground. Once the 5 year mark as passed, then I'll give up on Granby Tower.

[vtfan18]

Either way you look at it, their comments don't cast a great deal of confidence. We all understand being a developer is tough business with unexpectred turns but continually keeping people on the edge of their seats without following through on timelines, milestones, etc begins to make people wonder and second guess his ability to execute. But I agree with everyone else...we all want it built!

[vdogg]

As you all well know, the last of the pile drivers was broken down last week. This morning, in passing by, I saw that the site was surrounded by a bunch on empty flat bed trucks and the yellow crane was operating (I was shocked they were working in this weather). I don't know if they're taking more stuff away or not. I passed by at 11 so it is 'possible' that they had already dropped stuff off but it didn't seem like it.

[lil-bear]

One would think that if this project was dead, they would have a press conference and admit it!

But since they are still hanging in there and have not announced anything, there is no other

thing to do is wait and see what happens. I'm still being optimistic!

[erdogs]

Do they still have the webcam up? I couldn't find it on the GT website the other day.

[vdogg]

Do they still have the webcam up? I couldn't find it on the GT website the other day.

It's still up. The link is on the first page.

[erdogs]

It's still up. The link is on the first page.

Thanks, I don't know how I missed it.