People talking about Grand Rapids

[GRDadof3]

It would make sense. MI has no-fault which makes it automatically higher, factor in possibly higher winter related accidents and look at the other cities, all large and know for car thefts and brake-ins. Although I would think this hardly has people talking about Grand Rapids, its along the same lines as cities with the most snowfall, cloudiest, most car-deer accidents, ect. 

 

"No-fault" means that insurance companies can't go after the other insurance company for damage to an automobile in an accident. My insurance covers me, your insurance covers you. Some even say that it saves money because there aren't as many court cases and tort costs involved with insurance companies suing each other or filing claims against each other, in non no-fault states. Plus, the benefit of just dealing with your own insurance company instead of two insurance companies is worth any added expense, if there is one.

 

16 states are no-fault, similar to Michigan.

 

All debates aside, this site called nerd wallet claims that their methodology is a typical 26 year old male, driving a 2012 Toyota Camry with 100/300/50 liability and a $500 collision decuctible, pays $4042/year. I find that really hard to believe. I'm not 26 so I don't know, but we don't pay nearly that much. Two of us, two fairly new cars, no accidents for over 10 years, full coverage, $2034/year.

 

I guess that's why I'm calling nerd wallet's bluff.

[organsnyder]

I'm fairly close to their benchmark demographic: male under 30, 2009 Civic, similar levels of comprehensive coverage (though even higher limits) with the same deductible, and my policy costs less than $1000 annually. The policy is from Auto-Owners, through an old-fashioned agent - not a discount/no-frills offering.

Edited February 6, 2014 by organsnyder

[GR8scott]

As far as No-fault, i've lived in 3 other states where my insurance was always considerably lower than MI and have no accidents. I suppose if you suck at driving no-fault might save you money but the way I understand it, its not as rewarding of good driving as in non-no-fault states. Back to the topic.....this is hardly a reason for people talking about Grand Rapids. probably more recognition from the contestant that moved on in American Idol last night from GR! (OK I really dont watch it but it was on and noticed the guy singing from GR) 

[dbrock1046]

I work in the automotive business and can easily say Insurance is the number one factor that causes us to lose a sale. I cannot even count how many times customers have been quoted greater than $300 for startup and payments of between $150-$200 a month for the insurance, and this is after calling between three to four agencies that we deal with. From what I have understood and read, Michigan has be teetering between the number one and number 2 position for highest cost of insurance in the nation for over a year now. To here the quoted number of 3000 a year for insurance isn't that far fetched at all. In my opinion it is insane compared to other states!

 

http://www.mlive.com/business/index.ssf/2013/03/report_michigans_car_insurance.html

[dadr]

As far as No-fault, i've lived in 3 other states where my insurance was always considerably lower than MI and have no accidents.

 

Agree. I just moved to Michigan from another no fault state, had a totally clean record, and the insurance on my 13 year old and 6 year old cars instantly DOUBLED. This is with the same insurance company. I moved to a nice, safe neighborhood, am not driving very many miles and even pared back some coverages. It is not winter weather/accident/pothole related because I lived in Minneapolis which is no different than GR in that regard.

 

I think it is all because of the unlimited lifetime medical payments. That needs to change significantly.

 

I work in the automotive business and can easily say Insurance is the number one factor that causes us to lose a sale.

 

This is true for me - I'm afraid to buy a new car because the difference in insurance from my 13 year old beater might be $1000 a year! I honestly think it impacts car sales. People are more likely to defer buying a new car because of the exorbitant insurance costs. Of all states, Michigan - the automotive state - should realize this and fix it.

[organsnyder]

Higher medical costs won't (or shouldn't) make insuring a new car more expensive. Auto insurance is divided into two parts: personal loss & property damage (PLPD - the mandatory part) and collision/comprehensive. Medical costs are paid from the PLPD part, which isn't based on the cost of the vehicle. In fact, a new vehicle often should lower the PLPD cost, as it will include more safety features than an older vehicle.

 

I'm not disputing whether our rates are higher (I don't have the data to compare that), but it simply isn't possible, from an actuarial standpoint, for a more expensive vehicle to cost more to insure because of healthcare costs - unless the vehicle happens to also be less safe.

[arcturus]

Guess high insurance rates won't be a bullet point for the next Chamber of Commerce or Convention and Visitor's Bureau marketing piece.

[GRDadof3]

Agree. I just moved to Michigan from another no fault state, had a totally clean record, and the insurance on my 13 year old and 6 year old cars instantly DOUBLED. This is with the same insurance company. I moved to a nice, safe neighborhood, am not driving very many miles and even pared back some coverages. It is not winter weather/accident/pothole related because I lived in Minneapolis which is no different than GR in that regard.

 

I think it is all because of the unlimited lifetime medical payments. That needs to change significantly.

 

This is true for me - I'm afraid to buy a new car because the difference in insurance from my 13 year old beater might be $1000 a year! I honestly think it impacts car sales. People are more likely to defer buying a new car because of the exorbitant insurance costs. Of all states, Michigan - the automotive state - should realize this and fix it.

 

Interesting. I wonder why we don't pay that much? Because we're older and the lifetime health benefits aren't as long? I have heard there is legislation at the state that is trying to lower this.

[arcturus]

Partial explanation - MI ranks last in per capita spending on roads/bridges.

 

http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20140213/METRO05/302130103/Michigan-ranks-last-per-capita-spending-roads-bridges

[Jippy]

While the last place doesn't surprise me based on the condition of Michigan roads, the fact that we invest 25% less than 49th place is absolutely ridiculous. That fact suggests a much bigger political problem in this state, unwilling to invest in its own future economic growth. 

Edited February 14, 2014 by Jippy

[x99]

While the last place doesn't surprise me based on the condition of Michigan roads, the fact that we invest 25% less than 49th place is absolutely ridiculous. That fact suggests a much bigger political problem in this state, unwilling to invest in its own future economic growth. 

 

FWIW, Michigan ranks 6th in gas taxes in the nation, according to a table at the first Google link that popped up, http://taxfoundation.org/article/state-gasoline-tax-rates-2009-2013, so one has to wonder where the money is being funneled.  The catch is probably that in the gas tax ranking, they appear to include everything--sales tax on the gas, tank taxes, you name it.  By that math, a 20mpg auto going 10k miles a year should be kicking in close to $200.  I didn't check how much of that extra gas-related revenue actually makes it into the roads, but I bet it isn't all. 

 

Perhaps in additional to a small gas tax increase, part of the answer is rolling the other taxes and fees into the gas tax, and requiring that all of the money be spent on transportation-related expenses with some fixed percentage going to roads.  The catastrophic claims fund mentioned above is another area ripe for reform to (help) keep insurance rates in check. 

 

Here's another of my brilliant ideas:  Turn roads like M-6 and 696 into 85mph toll roads.  You pay a fee, you get to use the bypass and go faster.  I'd pay.

[RegalTDP]

 

Here's another of my brilliant ideas:  Turn roads like M-6 and 696 into 85mph toll roads.  You pay a fee, you get to use the bypass and go faster.  I'd pay.

 

 

I think people who want to drive 85 on the expressway pretty much already do so whenever they feel like it...  

[GRDadof3]

I think people who want to drive 85 on the expressway pretty much already do so whenever they feel like it...  

 

If I'm paying a toll to speed, I want to do 95 - 100.

[organsnyder]

Why so slow? Autobahn it! UNLIMITED!

 

The US is so backwards with our road systems. 

Only if we have German-style laws to match. For instance, Germany requires the use of winter tires during the winter months.

[Veloise]

It's also illegal to break down on the autobahn.

The roadbeds are thicker (up to 6 feet in some areas)

The corners and elevation changes are limited in angle. 

It's illegal to ride the left lane.

It's illegal to not merge right for a faster car coming up behind you (same in Michigan but no one cares)

It's a lot more expensive to get a license in Germany.

 

All these just prove my point that the US is third world in it's driving laws. 

A friend who's lived in Germany for a dozen years says that some of the above assumptions (including those upthread) are inacurrate:

 

The Autobahn (and other limited access freeways) do have speed limits in urban areas.

Your car is required to be in perfect operating condition, so a mechanical can warrant a ticket. A warning triangle and medical kit are required equipment.

If you come across a disabled motorist, you're required to stop and help (can be ticketed if you keep going).

The disabled motorist has to be indicating distress, and due to all the rest areas, it's illegal to stop for any reason.

He says the illegal to not merge right for a faster car coming up behind is incorrect in Germany. I am not finding a reference to this for Michigan.

A drivers license cost $2300, including the driver's ed class. It never expires.

If your car has visible rust, you'll get a ticket.

 

But wait, there's more.

Insurance: he had a van which cost about $400 a month.

Several cities require proof of a parking space before issuing a license tab.

Gas is about $9.40/gallon.

Edited February 19, 2014 by Veloise

[tamias6]

A friend who's lived in Germany for a dozen years says that some of the above assumptions (including those upthread) are inacurrate:

 

The Autobahn (and other limited access freeways) do have speed limits in urban areas.

Your car is required to be in perfect operating condition, so a mechanical can warrant a ticket. A warning triangle and medical kit are required equipment.

If you come across a disabled motorist, you're required to stop and help (can be ticketed if you keep going).

The disabled motorist has to be indicating distress, and due to all the rest areas, it's illegal to stop for any reason.

He says the illegal to not merge right for a faster car coming up behind is incorrect in Germany. I am not finding a reference to this for Michigan.

A drivers license cost $2300, including the driver's ed class. It never expires.

If your car has visible rust, you'll get a ticket.

 

But wait, there's more.

Insurance: he had a van which cost about $400 a month.

Several cities require proof of a parking space before issuing a license tab.

Gas is about $9.40/gallon.

 

This is the price to pay for a contry that reguards driving as a prevalige. I'm glad that europe has a more robust mass transit options esp if you are poor soul that can't afford the price of driving in Germany.

Edited February 19, 2014 by tamias6

[Veloise]

This is the price to pay for a contry that reguards driving as a prevalige. I'm glad that europe has a more robust mass transit options esp if you are poor soul that can't afford the price of driving in Germany.

TAMIAS RETURNS!!! Stick around, chipmunk!

[fotoman311]

So, this hit the AP wire today.  haha.

 

"GRAND RAPIDS, Mich. — It's soon expected to be OK to be willfully annoying in Grand Rapids."

 

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2014/03/04/us/ap-us-odd-ok-to-be-annoying.html?hp&_r=0

[wingbert]

So, this hit the AP wire today.  haha.

 

"GRAND RAPIDS, Mich. — It's soon expected to be OK to be willfully annoying in Grand Rapids."

 

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2014/03/04/us/ap-us-odd-ok-to-be-annoying.html?hp&_r=0

 

Does this mean that all this time the city could have just arrested Rob Bliss?  

 

 

I'm joking...  sort of.

Edited March 6, 2014 by wingbert

[GRDadof3]

Do this mean that all this time the city could have just arrested Rob Bliss?  

 

 

I'm joking...  sort of.

 

What's with the Rob hate? I like the guy.

[walker]

Technically I suppose this doesn't fit here because Grand Rapids isn't actually mentioned. 

 

So about this time last week I'm driving down a busy unfamiliar (to me) street in Los Angeles in a rental pick-up truck trying to maneuver in rush hour traffic and I glance up at a street banner and think HUH.  The banner was of the Calder we are all familiar with, La Grande Vitesse.  Seems the Los Angeles County Museum of Art (LACMA) is running a Calder exhibit and is using our Calder on their street banners.  I had my hands full and the camera was on the floor somewhere so I wasn't able to get a shot of it.  Later when driving down Wilshire Blvd near LACMA I had the camera ready as I figured there would be more Calder banners but all the street banners I saw were for the La Brea Tar Pits next door.  I tried to find an image of the banner on Google this morning but couldn't.  Here is a link to a story about the exhibit including an image of La Grande Vitesse but no mention of Grand Rapids:

 

http://www.lacma.org/art/exhibition/calder-and-abstraction-avant-garde-iconic

 

Just to drop another name, apparently Frank Gehry was involved in designing the exhibit.

 

Didn't visit LACMA this trip, I visited LACMA a couple of years ago and found it kind of boring.  I liked the neighboring tar pits much better.  But that’s just me I suppose. 

[RegalTDP]

Technically I suppose this doesn't fit here because Grand Rapids isn't actually mentioned. 

 

So about this time last week I'm driving down a busy unfamiliar (to me) street in Los Angeles in a rental pick-up truck trying to maneuver in rush hour traffic and I glance up at a street banner and think HUH.  The banner was of the Calder we are all familiar with, La Grande Vitesse.  Seems the Los Angeles County Museum of Art (LACMA) is running a Calder exhibit and is using our Calder on their street banners.  I had my hands full and the camera was on the floor somewhere so I wasn't able to get a shot of it.  Later when driving down Wilshire Blvd near LACMA I had the camera ready as I figured there would be more Calder banners but all the street banners I saw were for the La Brea Tar Pits next door.  I tried to find an image of the banner on Google this morning but couldn't.  Here is a link to a story about the exhibit including an image of La Grande Vitesse but no mention of Grand Rapids:

 

http://www.lacma.org/art/exhibition/calder-and-abstraction-avant-garde-iconic

 

Just to drop another name, apparently Frank Gehry was involved in designing the exhibit.

 

Didn't visit LACMA this trip, I visited LACMA a couple of years ago and found it kind of boring.  I liked the neighboring tar pits much better.  But that’s just me I suppose. 

 

 

 

I had been meaning to get to LACMA to catch this exhibit and finally got around to it today.  I had seen the banners all over the place for a while now.

 

 

 

This was one of the maquettes of La Grande vitesse that he constructed prior to making the actual piece.  It didn't turn out on the cellphone pic, but "AC69" is welded into the side.  It's one of the centerpieces of the exhibit, and it's at the very end.

 

 

 

They had several maquettes of larger public works that are located in other cities, and they all had a small accompanying picture of the real art piece on the label.

 

I'm sorry I didn't get close enough to read the label easier, but it says:

 

     La Grande vitesse

     (intermediate maquette), 1969

     Sheet metal, bolts and paint

 

Beneath the photo it says:

 

     La Grande vitesse, 1969. Sheet metal, bolts, and paint. 360 x 648 x 576 inches. Grand Rapids, Michigan.

 

While I was there, a docent was leading a tour through the exhibit, and I stuck around to hear what she had to say about La Grande vitesse.  She started by saying it means, "'The great swiftness,' or alternatively, the place it is associated with, 'Grand Rapids.'" She then told the story of how the city applied for the work through the NEA (Exact words: "The city was in the throes of building a new city hall in a rundown part of town").  After that, she spoke of how it was constructed, and then concluded with how the city adopted it as its symbol, that its image is ubiquitous in the city, that it inspired the annual Festival of the Arts, and that Calder's work helped make the "citizens of Grand Rapids proud of their city."  And that was the conclusion of the tour.

 

So that was GR's shoutout.  But all in all, a pretty neat exhibit.

[fotoman311]

Thanks for the info and photos, RegalTDP.

 

Would be an interesting grad student project to take an in-depth look at the differences in perception of this artwork by people who were here when it was installed, people who grew up here with it, and people who have moved to Grand Rapids with the piece already solidly embedded in the civic identity of the city.  Also could study differences in socio-economic and ethnic groups' interpretations of the sculpture.

 

At least, that's an article/master's thesis I would be interested in reading.  It might have a limited audience.

Edited April 21, 2014 by fotoman311

[walker]

Thanks a lot RegalTDP for the follow-up post.  Your photo of the banner along with your exhibit photos and review were great. 

[The ATX]

I was watching the Travel Channel last night, and their Museum Secrets (or some similar name) show featured a very nice shot of the skyline along the river before zooming in on the Ford museum.   The story was about the gun used by Squaeky Fromme in her failed assassination attempt.