Charlotte Knights AAA Ballpark in Third Ward

[HopHead]

If we get a mlb team honestly is charlotte big enough to support it.

Currently, I would say "no"... I think it's been mentioned here a few times, but Charlotte is still probably 10 years away from supporting another sports franchise, at least a major league one.

[monsoon]

1 down 1 more to go... The Florida Marlins just got the final approval to begin building their new retractable roof stadium in Little Havana: Marlins get approval. So, it would appear the only franchise that Reese would be able to argue relocating to Charlotte at this point would be the Tampa Bay Rays. Not sure where this battle is now in the area of Tampa politics, but hopefully if they get a new deal with the city of Tampa, we can move forward with getting our uptown (or near uptown) Knights stadium...

Well..... There is the problem of no money. The county is broke, the city is broke, and the Knights apparently don't have the money to do this deal either.

[JayGee]

I think putting the Knights Baseball Stadium at the Eastland Mall site would be an urban policy failure for Charlotte.

Here is why:

- The Baseball Stadium would have less jobs than Eastland Mall currently has.

- The Baseball Stadium would generate less local and state taxes than Eastland Mall currently does.

- Not a central location for something that is going to draw in people from all parts of the region.

The people on the Eastside don't need a political handout that isn't going to sustain the area long term.

Uh, you're making a comparison to Eastland Mall, which has one foot in the grave. It should be compared against alternative proposals.

[JayGee]

Currently, I would say "no"... I think it's been mentioned here a few times, but Charlotte is still probably 10 years away from supporting another sports franchise, at least a major league one.

I can't believe anybody honestly thinks the Charlotte sports market can support MLB, which at times well have 2 or 3 home games in one week, and during the week at that.

Reese's little temper tantrums have done nothing but delay the move to a better market for the Knights. MLB will be viable in Charlotte at some point, but now is not the time.

IMHO of course.

[Charlotte_native]

I can't believe anybody honestly thinks the Charlotte sports market can support MLB, which at times well have 2 or 3 home games in one week, and during the week at that.

Actually I think there have always been very few people who have wanted to believe this. Even Reece just wanted to build a stadium for future, not current, MLB. Of the many fallacies in his logic, the largest was no MLB team has expressed any interest in Charlotte including the Marlins.

[uptownliving]

Uh, you're making a comparison to Eastland Mall, which has one foot in the grave. It should be compared against alternative proposals.

I know...the Baseball Stadium would be worse for the area than the current Eastland Mall....that was my point.

I think that the Town Center plan that the City is working on will have a much more sustainable long term solution for Eastland Mall.

More info on that plan here:

http://www.charmeck.org/NR/rdonlyres/e7e4h...ng1219FINAL.pdf

[InitialD]

Seems this could decide the fate of the uptown stadium:

There are two specific items in Thursday

[hokiehigh]

That's good news. At least there is still a movement to move the team Uptown. As for MLB.... I don't think Charlotte can support a team right now. Let's prove we can support a AAA team and then maybe a MLB club will look harder at Charlotte.

[Charlotte_native]

That's good news. At least there is still a movement to move the team Uptown. As for MLB.... I don't think Charlotte can support a team right now. Let's prove we can support a AAA team and then maybe a MLB club will look harder at Charlotte.

In the long run, for me personally, I'd rather have minor league anyway. Far less expensive, easier for non-baseball fans to decide to just head out for a random game on a beautiful day, and an option for those that like sports but can't afford Bobcats or Panthers tix.

[JayGee]

In the long run, for me personally, I'd rather have minor league anyway. Far less expensive, easier for non-baseball fans to decide to just head out for a random game on a beautiful day, and an option for those that like sports but can't afford Bobcats or Panthers tix.

AAA is much more family/fun oriented. Only problem with the uptown location is that you will probably get raped on parking if you drive there. Pay $10 for a ticket and $20 for parking?

[Charlotte_native]

AAA is much more family/fun oriented. Only problem with the uptown location is that you will probably get raped on parking if you drive there. Pay $10 for a ticket and $20 for parking?

Perhaps it would get that expensive, I can't say, but during Panther games if you are willing to walk just 3 or 4 blocks you can park for $5 - $10. The really expensive lots are in the shadow of the stadium, but they also park all day and tailgate. Just guessing, but since you aren't talking about 70,000 people and these are often during work days and work hours, regular rates might apply?

[nonillogical]

AAA is much more family/fun oriented. Only problem with the uptown location is that you will probably get raped on parking if you drive there. Pay $10 for a ticket and $20 for parking?

there's tons of $5 parking that wouldn't change for a game day if you don't mind walking 3-6 blocks

ha, charlotte native beat me to it

Edited March 26, 2009 by nonillogical

[InitialD]

AAA is much more family/fun oriented. Only problem with the uptown location is that you will probably get raped on parking if you drive there. Pay $10 for a ticket and $20 for parking?

Parking for Checkers & Bobcats games is usually 5, 7, or 10 dollars at most.

[JayGee]

Well that's not too bad, then. Personally, I'd rather take the train anyway. I never drive downtown for a trade show anymore.

Kinda reminds me of when I lived in Brooklyn . . . . .

[New Name]

There is so much free onstreet parking (after 6pm) in this city if you know where to look for it.

[hokiehigh]

So, I was looking at Richmond's new plan for a baseball stadium downtown (Shockoe Bottom). There aren't too many pictures but I really like what they are doing adding retail/entertainment to the mix. The retail looks like a real urban environment rather than an "entertainment complex". I really wish Charlotte could add something similar. Also, the Knights need a freakin website for their new stadium!

Here is a link to Richmond's new ballpark:

Richmond's Ballpark Plans

Due to the fact that Richmond took so long to build a new stadium, their AAA team left for Gwinnett County, GA. Now they are looking for a AA team to take the Braves place. Charlotte really needs to watch out b/c the owners want $$$$.

[Mobuchu]

After a quick glance at that plan, I now hope our baseball stadium falls through, they could do much better! Keep the swap so we get the other parts to the plan, but sell that parcel off to developers or find another use for it.

[tozmervo]

Due to the fact that Richmond took so long to build a new stadium, their AAA team left for Gwinnett County, GA. Now they are looking for a AA team to take the Braves place. Charlotte really needs to watch out b/c the owners want $$.

If they want to move the Knights let 'em. There are plenty of other teams that would jump into a market as big as Charlotte. After that Burton Smith nonsense in Concord I sincerely hope there isn't another power struggle just to keep a AA team.

[hokiehigh]

I do think a plan, like Richmond's, would be great for downtown, but it could also work in Southend or any other area that will be serviced by light rail. The fact that the Knight's plan has been in slow motion for so long is really annoying. I know the court procedures are slowing it down but it really shouldn't take this long to come to a conclusion! I am beginning to wonder how much the Knights really want to move.

[New Name]

Couple of things I'd like to point out: Richmond is in a more precarious position than Charlotte (despite this glossy proposal) - The RBraves and Shockoe Bottom backers first proposed a stadium in Shockoe Bottom almost 10 years ago. It was met with a lot of public disapproval because of it's historic importance (understanding that Richmond was the Capitol City of the South: the area was a former slave market, and the historic neighborhoods just a few blocks away are well maintiainted and famous for the home of Edgar Allen Poe, the church where Patrick Henry proclaimed "Give me liberty of give me death," and the original Lucky Strike cigarette factory. On top of the historic importance of the area, it is at the lowest point in the city, is protected by 20' floodwalls from the James River, and was decimated by 15' of standing flood water during Huricane Gaston - which stood for almost a week in Shockoe Bottom and closed down countless businesses. The GBraves elected to leave Richmond for two reasons: the field conditions at the Richmond Diamond were horrible (often flooding and forcing them to move games), and the community proved that it would fight against any proposal for a new ballpark.

I don't know what's changed to get this new ballpark proposal into better public favor, but they're working uphill now that the team has left.

That being said - Shockoe Bottom a really urban, and cool part of the city that would be great to have a baseball stadium. About 5 years ago, an old warehouse that was on this site burned down and I thought for sure the community would rally behind redevelopment and the ballpark - since history was crumbling before their eyes. But it didn't happen. Richmond is notorious for holding on to history that is questionably preservable. It's 180% from Charlotte. They would rather have an abandoned warehouse that is unsafe and unused, than risk losing something that SOMEONE might consider historic. But I guess I can understand it because of Richmond's importance in the historical South.

The major difference between Richmond's plan and Charlotte's plan, is that Shockoe Bottom is already a very vibrant neighborhood. There's an excellent street grid, farmers maket, 20-30 bars and restaurants, apartments and condos, clubs, riverwalk starts here, and the renovated (and sadly underused) Historic Main St. Amtrak station. It is under I-95, and also under the only 3 level freight crossing in the country. Charlotte - well, it's a bunch of gravel parking lots.

[HopHead]

It is a nice site plan indeed. After looking at their plan, I agree that I'm not necessarily 100% into the 3rd Ward plan as much as I was before. I'd almost rather see the stadium in South End. As long as the stadium were to fit within the South End landscape, it is near one of the light rail stations and didn't have a flood of surface parking lots. I think there are a lot of cool opportunities there, especially if it were somewhere near the Ashton apt complex. The thing that Richmond has against it though too is that the city there is notorious for shooting itself in the foot more times than not. They lost the R-Braves b/c didn't have a good plan in place for the stadium and city gov't infighting. Now they do only b/c it took a team that had been there for decades to pack up and leave. I lived there for a number of years and was constantly frustrated by their inability to move forward with so many things in that city. I also find it intriguing that Gwinnett was able to get their stadium planned and built in a very short period of time.

[New Name]

I lived there for a number of years and was constantly frustrated by their inability to move forward with so many things in that city.

Same here. I really liked living in Richmond, but I felt like things would never change. That's why I fell in love with Charlotte and moved here - because Charlotte certainly isn't afraid of change. Richmond is a very old and dirty city. Charlotte seemed to be the opposite. In hindsight, I wish for a combination of the two (Portland with better weather?). I think this is why I ended up in NoDa - it reminds me of Richmond.

[hokiehigh]

I think Gwinnett did it without putting it to a county vote. Don't quote me on that but I know it happened fast (< 2 years).

Richmond has been inept on getting this done but if they can make this plan happen then I think they will have a good thing. Richmond really needs this downtown. I think they already have a team from CT ready to move and the Nationals would like to put a team there in the future. Now that Wilder is out may be the new mayor will push this through. Plus maybe VCU will put money in it if the Rams also use the stadium.

Back to Charlotte.... I am confused about Charlotte b/c I think the owners are willing to build the stadium. May be wrong but it wasn't 100% city financed. If I were the owners and I had a team that comes in last in attendance then I would seriously look elsewhere in the city to build. I would think every year in Ft Mill means a greater loss of money. I am partial to an Uptown/Southend stadium b/c I don't like going to Ft Mill for a game.

Hell they could put the stadium on East Blvd and bulldoze the whole thing since the city seems to care less about that street having urbanity (talking about CMC).

[monsoon]

..... May be wrong but it wasn't 100% city financed. If I were the owners and I had a team that comes in last in attendance then I would seriously look elsewhere in the city to build. ......

The stadium was to be paid for by the Knights. It was posted earlier that the Knights have said they don't have a sound enough financial plan to get financing. So that makes everything else irrelevant including the court case. Bottom line the Knights don't have the money to do it now. It's over.

[hokiehigh]

That sucks that a new stadium is dead. Oh well. I guess we won't have to read about it in the Observer anymore. Hopefully the court case has been stopped so it doesn't waste anymore money!