Charlotte Knights AAA Ballpark in Third Ward

[Spartan]

The County will control the land, so it's still in governmental control. The ROW abandonment does not mean that the street will be closed immediately, it's just the City granting permission to do it at some point in time. Obviously with the 3rd/4th connector, it will not be closed until the other surrounding streets are redesigned to handle the redistributed traffic. The redirected traffic from 4th St will go up to Mint, making a right, the a left back to 3rd instead of using the connector.

IMO, the inconvenience to motorists should be minimal. I'm not concerned about people having to make some extra turns. If's its that horrible take the bus or walk or bike. Losing this connection will ultimately help improve the pedestrian environment in that area.

[dubone]

I am perfect satisfied with the approach for routing traffic around the stadium superblock if a stadium goes there. My concern is that they are going down a path that I hope does not lead to an unnecessary superblock. I don't want them to scrap the connectivity just to leave it fallow till the next boom time. I am glad to hear, though, that they will keep it open until the land is needed.

[NCMike1990]

what is the gain in having it closed so soon? i'm assuming it wouldn't actually be closed to traffic until development began, right?

i don't particularly want the stadium uptown in the first place since i would MUCH rather eventually have dense neighborhoods and mixed-use towers in this area.

Yeah, I agree. I think I'd rather see the stadium on W. Morehead just off I-77.

[fulcrumsf]

I think the old Beazer Site, where the Coffee Cup would be the perfect place. They could have the stadium, and add some restaurants, retail, mixed use density. Panthers could also benefit from this.

[Guest]

I think the old Beazer Site, where the Coffee Cup would be the perfect place. They could have the stadium, and add some restaurants, retail, mixed use density. Panthers could also benefit from this.

I dont like that areas lack of proximity from mass transit, although it could help the recent W. Morehead revitalization!

[NCMike1990]

I think the old Beazer Site, where the Coffee Cup would be the perfect place. They could have the stadium, and add some restaurants, retail, mixed use density. Panthers could also benefit from this.

That's the site I'm talking about right on Clarkson St.. There's more than enough land for the ballpark to go there and it could open the door for retail, restaurants, and maybe even a few mid-rises in the future.

This area needs to be revitalized because its right next to 77 and a lot of people see this area might be disappointed with the lack of development.

[dubone]

I would far rather the Clarkson/West Morehead land be used for the baseball stadium. It would be closer to a lot more freeway access, with easy access to interchanges on both Belk/277 and 77. It is only half mile (10 minute walk) from the Carson transit station, and on the long term plans for the streetcar. That land is ideally shaped for a baseball stadium, and could even be designed to accommodate expansion to MLB size. it also still has a skyline view to the east from home plate, which was of major importance to them in their original uptown site selection.

The catch, and the reason that the Knights don't ever consider this site, is that it isn't a casual walk from all of the Tryon street office towers. They had hoped to get a significant number of people dropping by after work. I am not sure how much I even agree with that premise, but still, this is not that far for people to walk. At minimum, it is .4 mi (8 min walk) from the Gold Rush stop on Morehead. Walking distance is .6 mi (12 min walk) from Gateway and from the Duke Energy Center. It is certainly more of a trek than they would want, but honestly, people who are going to give up their evening to see a game certainly would be willing to go a little bit farther of a walk. It is still less than a mile from Trade and Tryon, which is within the threshold that people consider it too far to walk (which I believe is about a mile).

Just the fact that it is expandable to MLB makes that site far more attractive in my mind. But from the perspective of downtown, I would far rather have it on the edge by the freeway than in the heart of the grid, creating a scale of a building that is just too large for inner 3rd Ward.

[Urbanity]

I think the old Beazer Site, where the Coffee Cup would be the perfect place. They could have the stadium, and add some restaurants, retail, mixed use density. Panthers could also benefit from this.

Adding my voice to the chorus of those who like this idea. About the issue of Mass Transit - isn't it right along the proposed Streetcar route?

[Rufus]

I really like the idea of the Morehead/Clarkson location. I really like the idea of creating a sports complex like Arrowhead and the Royals stadium in Kansas City, but with an urban design. That area could really take off with places to hang out before or after games, and hopefully even when there isn't a game.

[HopHead]

I mentioned a while back that this Clarkson/Morehead location would be one ideal location for the stadium. That way we could make better use of the land in 3rd ward. However, if I'm not mistaken isn't Beazer trying to sell this land for a big chunk of change? I want to say like ~$20 mill... If so, there's no way the Knights would be able to build on their own

[uptownliving]

Meck Co could do a land swap with Beazer...but I dont think Beazer wants any land in Charlotte. Also the Clarkson/Morehead site would require a new parking deck be built...whereas the uptown site can use existing parking decks. I'm pretty sure the Knights don't have the money to pay for a parking deck and I am not sure Meck Co would want to pay for a parking deck. I think that would be a major sticking point for any site outside of uptown.

[dubone]

They wouldn't need all the land for baseball. They could use the rest for surface lots until such time as they are ready for nearby development. It will still need considerably less than its current location. It is only 4 blocks equivalent walk beyond the front doors of BofA stadium. That is no big deal for most people and they'd be able to park in the decks uptown, especially the massive Duke Energy deck.

[southslider]

Walk four blocks from the nearest parking deck? In Charlotte?

http://marynewsom.blogspot.com/2009/11/walking-hazardous-duty-in-raleigh.html

[dubone]

Ha! Well, I think even Mary Newsome would agree that walking 4 blocks downtown is a lot safer than along a suburban thoroughfare. I mean, it is a greenway from Graham to Cedar and then a block or two on Cedar is no big deal.

[uptownliving]

I think the Beazer site already has the utilities in...so they are probably selling it at a premium compared to a true vacant lot and that would probably complicate something commercial like a Baseball Stadium going on that site.

Regarding the walking distance...Yes it is not far...but with the Railroad tracks and 277 acting as physical and visual barriers it would seem a lot farther than it actually is.

However what I would not be in favor of at this site is another surface parking lot. We need less of those downtown. Not more.

[dubone]

It already is a surface lot, thanks to CMPD.

[CharlotteSteve]

What do you folks think about the feasibility of a new Knights ballpark on a portion of the Morningside Village land in PM? That project has obviously stalled considerably. They could still incorporate housing with the remaining land. In the future (hopefully) there'd be access to the streetcar on Central. My biggest concern would be sufficient parking. I know someone posted the idea of Eastland Mall site awhile back which I thought was cool but think this is better. Nice potential for a Wrigley-ville vibe.

[southslider]

^I don't think any of the new blocks are big enough for a ballpark.

[New Name]

What about the land that was reclaimed from the new South/Caldwell/Brevard/277 exit/exchange?

That land is city owned (although the project was financed by the future sale of the land) - I wonder...

The upside of putting a ballpark teetering on the edge of an Interstate is that the "dead side" of the park could be facing the Interstate (a place where no pedestrian would want to go anyway)

[Guest]

What about the land that was reclaimed from the new South/Caldwell/Brevard/277 exit/exchange?

That land is city owned (although the project was financed by the future sale of the land) - I wonder...

The upside of putting a ballpark teetering on the edge of an Interstate is that the "dead side" of the park could be facing the Interstate (a place where no pedestrian would want to go anyway)

Unfortunately I don't think any of the land reclaimed by the city is large enough, or the correct shape to put a ball park. Also It would not be in the best interest of this city to use land it paid to level without any financial gain... I do like your idea however.

[southslider]

^But since a ballpark creates a superblock, I do think placing it against a freeway or railroad likely does less damage to the street grid.

I've also thought placing it within a couple blocks of the football stadium, created too much of a dead zone. Sort of like how the government district on the east edge of Uptown deadens streetlife.

[tozmervo]

At the 2020 workshop they showed Wrigley and PGE (Portland) as examples of ballparks that actually work really well in an urban landscape. It can be done.

[Urbanity]

What about the land that was reclaimed from the new South/Caldwell/Brevard/277 exit/exchange?

That land is city owned (although the project was financed by the future sale of the land) - I wonder...

The upside of putting a ballpark teetering on the edge of an Interstate is that the "dead side" of the park could be facing the Interstate (a place where no pedestrian would want to go anyway)

If there were to be another stadium in Uptown, I would love to see this idea explored. I agree there may be a space issue, but the logic of the dead side of the ballpark facing the interstate makes sense to me.

[grodney]

If you removed the bar (Club Ice?), and shortened left field a few feet, and converted the new on-ramp to a tunnel underneath the stadium ---- maybe.

It does leave a nice plaza area in front of the stadium, though I didn't photoshop any landscaping, so use your imagination.

With this orientation, the spectators would have their backs to the skyline. That wouldn't be as cool, right?

[kermit]

If you removed the bar (Club Ice?), and shortened left field a few feet, and converted the new on-ramp to a tunnel underneath the stadium ---- maybe.

It does leave a nice plaza area in front of the stadium, though I didn't photoshop any landscaping, so use your imagination.

With this orientation, the spectators would have their backs to the skyline. That wouldn't be as cool, right?

Great image, thanks for putting that together.

I don't think this configuration would ever fly since the setting sun would be in the batter's eyes (and half of the fans) due to the South/westward orientation of the park.