Bearden Park in Third Ward, Uptown Charlotte

[atlrvr]

Opening up the back of the house of Jazz building to over-look the park would be great. I have a feeling it is pushed too close tot he corner to allow the side-walk widths that they want, but I agree if they were willing to get creative, they could program the existing building to compliment the park.

[dubone]

As I wrote in the previous thread, I strongly believe they should save that building, or else the other old building at the corner of old Poplar and 2nd/MLK. It is absurd to me for them to spend the money to tear down two ~80 year old buildings that are fairly attractive, and then pay to build a brand new building just for toilets and some very small amount of flex space. Given other buildings that Meck County has built in their parks, it would be a huge step down.

This park is almost certain to be named for Romare Bearden, a prominent artist that lived his early years in 3rd Ward. The act was about to be done by the county in the original site. The House of Jazz building has tie ins to Romare Bearden in that jazz features very prominently his art

That demo and new construction costs a lot more money than just leaving the buildings as they are (they are in use with active businesses), or just additional bathrooms. That money would come out of what they can spend on other amenities in the park.

Firstly, the sidewalk isn't as small as people think on Church, it just feels smaller because they have a traffic light box, and other things on the sidewalk which makes it smaller. One solution would be to not save all four sections of the building, but rather just the northern half. That would allow for better features at the corner, wider sidewalk on MLK, and not having the sidewalk in front of the building be impacted by anything at the corner.

http://meckcama.co.mecklenburg.nc.us/mvide...12/LC081501.JPG

However, if the corner building does not work, this is the building from 1925 at the corner of the old Poplar alignment and MLK. It is also attractive, 80 years old, and not too intrusive into the park design. It does still have the sidewalk issue on MLK, but frankly, people walking along MLK would either walk inside the park or on the new wide sidewalks lining the Novare site.

http://meckcama.co.mecklenburg.nc.us/mvide...12/LC081501.JPG

I just really hope they utilize one or part of one of the existing buildings. It would be such a waste to not.

[28202]

Opening the back to face the park would be great. Also decking the roof for cafe/restaurant space would be a huge hit.

[ontap]

I attended the public meeting and gave my input as to design. Just to clear up some misconceptions here:

The permanent stage that was discussed is basically a small podium for spontaneous and intmate performances. The intent was to encourage street performers at the small "events lawn." Also discussed were having movable cafe table and chairs surrounding this green...ala NYC's Bryant Park. It was decided that this is most likely the place for improptu gatherings, meetings, and having lunch. The "lawn" is 1.8 acres and was purposely left unstructured so groups could tailgate, picnic, throw a frisbee, etc. This is the place for large performances and temporary staging.

Most of the concerns everyone is talking about were addressed at the meeting. Everyone agrees more water features, more art, and more space for children. This park design tries to incorporate something for everybody.

Saving the existing buildings at the MLK corner was mentioned by one group. I really don't see this happening. The building Park & Rec plans to build is just to house Park Watch and provide restrooms. It would be a very small space. There may be some concessions, but that will likely get scrapped in lieu of letting push cart operators service that need.

There will be many exciting and positive changes when these ideas are incorporated into the park design. If you have ideas for the park design, be sure to attend the next meeting on Sept 10th at 6:00 in the Johnson & Wales auditorium.

[atlrvr]

Not saving the existing building because it takes some creative thought is just typical lazy Charlotte planning. I won't cry too hard if the building goes, but writing it off as something "in the way" as opposed to a possibly amenity seems like a foregone conclusion without one ounce of brain power used to work with the existing urban landscape. You can plan pretty parks on blank slates in the suburbs, here's a place where it would be nice if they would try a little harder.

There's probably 10 good reasons to demo the building without a second thought (and I'll be surprised if it does get a second thought), but that doesn't mean it should. Don't be afraid to pull the "dirty brick" colored pencil out. Certainly the planners can afford more than the pastel box.

[Raintree21]

The permanent stage that was discussed is basically a small podium for spontaneous and intmate performances. The intent was to encourage street performers at the small "events lawn." Also discussed were having movable cafe table and chairs surrounding this green...ala NYC's Bryant Park. It was decided that this is most likely the place for improptu gatherings, meetings, and having lunch. The "lawn" is 1.8 acres and was purposely left unstructured so groups could tailgate, picnic, throw a frisbee, etc. This is the place for large performances and temporary staging.

Most of the concerns everyone is talking about were addressed at the meeting. Everyone agrees more water features, more art, and more space for children. This park design tries to incorporate something for everybody.

Glad to see that they are listening to people's wants and concerns. I wonder how their plan to allow impromptu concerts will work. Will one group try to monopolize the space since it will be so high profile or will they be able to regulate it? Since most groups that play on the streets downtown do so for money often, it could be interesting I would think.

[Spartan]

The next public meeting is Monday at 6pm at the JWU Hande Auditorium (801 W Trade). They will talk about West Park and Second Ward Park like last time.

[Raintree21]

Received this in an email today:

Proposed final master plans will be unveiled October 3 at 6pm for two new uptown parks. Plans will be presented at a workshop in Johnson and Wales University's Hance Auditorium, 801 West Trade Street. Public is invited. Property for these parks is involved in the much-publicized "land swap" for uptown baseball: New West Park will be on 5.4 acres along Mint Street. Mecklenburg County has $9-million dollars in bond funds to develop this park. Second Ward Park would be on part of the current site of Marshall Park and CMS Education Center. County has $6 million dollars to develop it on 3.9 acres. Plans will be based on public comments from previous workshops. For more information: contact planner Brian Conroy at (704) 336-7694 [email protected]

[Andyc545]

I've had this question on my mind: I'm not too familiar with the construction process of a park, but does anyone know how long it typically takes for construction process vs. that of the buildings going up around uptown. I am assuming things beging like a building, soil work, demolition, land clearing, but I'd imagine there's more. Was just curious to help gauge what we can expect to see and when as far as the transformation of these property sites.

[Spartan]

That will vary depending on the park setting. More suburban parks are probably easier to do, and urban parks like this one will be more complicated. You'll see work start on New West Park shortly after its approved because I think they want the park to be ready around the time that baseball starts.... so 2009 sometime.

[uptownliving]

If I remember correctly back when it was going to go on the 8 acre site they said it would take about 12 months to construct the park....so I would assume the same for the new site...I think Spartans estimate of 2009 sounds about right to me.

[Spartan]

LandDesign confirmed tonight that they want this to open at or before the baseball park opens. So we're looking at March or April 2009 for New West Park. They also said that the name change to "Bearden Park" is not official yet.

Second Ward Park will have a similar development time, but its totally contingent on what the developers of Brooklyn Village do, so there is not a "precise" timeframe.

The new design for New West Park is excellent. They still didn't save the Jazz House So aside from that, I think it will be a good design. They also included a rendering of the linear park to Tryon St. It will have a hanging garden sort of feature that will help draw people down to the main park.

Renderings to come...

[AMZIE]

Some drawings of West Park & Brooklyn Village Park from last night.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/14557817@N04

Edited October 4, 2007 by AMZIE

[atlrvr]

^ Thanks for those......the 3rd Ward Park is much improved....still a little too busy, but I think it will all work well together.

The 2nd Ward Park still needs some work.....at this point, it just a collection of grass patches and hardscape, with no particular programming to move people through it.

[Guest]

Not too shabby. 3rd ward park will bring charlotte a lot closer to having a true cohesive CBD. I can't wait to have a park surrounded by multiple skyscrapers, and a ballfield, I will definately be out there as much as possible.

Edited October 4, 2007 by Guest

[Andyc545]

Not too shabby. 3rd ward park will bring charlotte a lot closer to having a true cohesive CBD. I can't wait to have a park surrounded by multiple skyscrapers, and a ballfield, I will definately be out there as much as possible.

It reminds me of that huge park in downtown Columbia, SC. I really look forward to this park, I think it will be an essential attribute to bringing people connected to the city on all days and nights of the week.

[AuLukey]

While I know it is a bit of a stretch, I hope they repave Mint street in some other shade than regular asphalt between those two brick crosswalks. In the drawing of Big Moon Green, it looks like that stretch is more of a reddish color. I think that would look really nice and would actually promote a more cohesive look between the park and the baseball field rather than just two crosswalks and a plaza.

[Skyline49er]

Its going to be nice to be able to have a picnic at the 3rd Ward Park and maybe throw a frisbee around or something. Maybe even toss a football around before a Panthers game. I think this will be a nice addition to Uptown and I am looking forward to seeing it develop.

[Charlotte_native]

LandDesign confirmed tonight that they want this to open at or before the baseball park opens. So we're looking at March or April 2009 for New West Park.

That seems like a long time to me. I'm certainly not an expert in how long it takes to create a park, but it seems like site work, landscaping, hardscaping, etc, just won't take over a year.

[Andyc545]

That seems like a long time to me. I'm certainly not an expert in how long it takes to create a park, but it seems like site work, landscaping, hardscaping, etc, just won't take over a year.

See- that's what I was thinking, and that's why I originally asked the question on how long it takes from start to finish for the park. I know the removing park and any underground sprinklers, utilities, etc. - but after that it's really a matter of art and landscapping it seems to my eye. I think I'm missing a big part though...

[krazeeboi]

It reminds me of that huge park in downtown Columbia, SC.

Yeah, it seems as if it will be somewhat reminiscent of Finlay Park. A few years after it's built, Charlotte will wonder how they ever got along without this park.

[Justadude]

^ You've been saying this for a while, but it never really clicked for me until yesterday. I drove the family up to Nashville and spent about two hours just hanging around their riverfront park waiting for the Preds game. Nothing at all was going on at the park, but it was two solid hours of good vibes to just laze out on the lawn, make observations about passers-by, and generally just kill time. It really hit home that there's no comparable experience to be had in uptown Charlotte, even though it has about as good an urban fabric as downtown Nashville (with the exception of Broadway, which is still far beyond anything Charlotte has developed). This is just exactly the right time to add that element to uptown, while it can be integrated into other plans. I'm really looking forward to seeing how this turns out; it might be the best place uptown to aimlessly hang out.

[UrbanFuture]

That 12 month timeline seems correct to me. We don't want to forget we are in a very nasty drought. That park, with semi mature trees and all that grass will take a massive amount of water, time, and care to get up and running. It takes 2-3 years to fully establish a lawn in a residential setting, so if we assume we have professional crews maintaining and looking after the new park facilities once they are down (when they can install them without having everything go dormant by winter conditions or fried by our recent heat waves during the summers) you can see that they will have almost everything down and done long before they open it as they have to make sure it is established to a point where public use won't kill or wreck the tree/sod with normal use. I don't see it as one of those things where you grade, build the buildings, put down the sod and bam its open.

Other things to consider:

-public works re-routes

-grading

-structures

-irrigation

-money changing hands (novare has pledged 1 million, plus all the land swap details)

-staging for nearby sites, novare, baseball stadium, etc (not saying they will use the space to stage the sites, but it makes a lot of sense for the baseball stadium)

-weather patterns

-available water

-seasons

-any public art (PLEASE NO MORE MUD DISKS OR MUD CIRCLES!!!!!)

I know I repeated myself in the list, I'm just saying, I don't think 12 months is off base at all.

[sfmartin]

That 12 month timeline seems correct to me.

I too think 12 months is pretty good - granted hardscaping and landscaping may not take that long, but the removal and relocation of utilities and potential street work are always very time consuming.

[Spartan]

That 12 month timeline seems correct to me. We don't want to forget we are in a very nasty drought. That park, with semi mature trees and all that grass will take a massive amount of water, time, and care to get up and running. It takes 2-3 years to fully establish a lawn in a residential setting, so if we assume we have professional crews maintaining and looking after the new park facilities once they are down (when they can install them without having everything go dormant by winter conditions or fried by our recent heat waves during the summers) you can see that they will have almost everything down and done long before they open it as they have to make sure it is established to a point where public use won't kill or wreck the tree/sod with normal use. I don't see it as one of those things where you grade, build the buildings, put down the sod and bam its open.

Other things to consider:

-public works re-routes

-grading

-structures

-irrigation

-money changing hands (novare has pledged 1 million, plus all the land swap details)

-staging for nearby sites, novare, baseball stadium, etc (not saying they will use the space to stage the sites, but it makes a lot of sense for the baseball stadium)

-weather patterns

-available water

-seasons

-any public art (PLEASE NO MORE MUD DISKS OR MUD CIRCLES!!!!!)

I know I repeated myself in the list, I'm just saying, I don't think 12 months is off base at all.

There's also the bidding phase and the engineering phase, each of which takes a lot of time (LandDesign actually gave a timeline, I didn't think to write it down though). Someone has to figure out how they're going to make all those pretty pictures become a reality. The actual construction will take less than a year.