Northlake Mall

[A2]

Taubman just reported that Northlake is now 95% leased and 80% physically occupied. They expect the in-place physical occupancy number to increase to 90% by year-end.

Interesting, the total cost of the project came in $4 million under budget at $171 million. The company has a reputation for always opening malls on time and under budget, so add this one to the list.

I am sure they are retty happy SC. BTW, does anyone know about the Outlet Mall that is being built ? I heard just a small brief bit on the news this morning that a developer was planning another large Outlet mall. I just did not catch where.

A2

[DigitalSky]

Where did you hear that? (what station)

[monsoon]

I am sure they are retty happy SC. BTW, does anyone know about the Outlet Mall that is being built ? I heard just a small brief bit on the news this morning that a developer was planning another large Outlet mall. I just did not catch where.

A2

Possibly you heard them talking about the new outlet mall in Charleston. This was on the news this morning.

[A2]

Possibly you heard them talking about the new outlet mall in Charleston. This was on the news this morning.

thx metro. They said it would be built in the Carolina's, so that has to be it.

A2

[monsoon]

I was out at the new mall this weekend and was flabberghasted by the staggering amount of retail construction that is taking place around the mall area. It seems to have doubled in size since the last time I looked. And across the street a HHGregg just opened to be followed by a Staples (closest one to downtown the only the 2nd one in CLT), an HHGregg Fine Lines store (see my post on this) and a number of smaller shops. There is also a very good upscale Mexican restaurant in this development along with a carribean type cafe and a Northern Tools.

[A2]

I was out at the new mall this weekend and was flabberghasted by the staggering amount of retail construction that is taking place around the mall area. It seems to have doubled in size since the last time I looked. And across the street a HHGregg just opened to be followed by a Staples (closest one to downtown the only the 2nd one in CLT), an HHGregg Fine Lines store (see my post on this) and a number of smaller shops. There is also a very good upscale Mexican restaurant in this development along with a carribean type cafe and a Northern Tools.

Check out this article concerning the rapid growth of the area. It is simply amazing what is taking shape in that area from a resedential and retail stand point.

http://www.bizjournals.com/charlotte/stori.../14/story1.html

My question is will we see Reams Road and W.T Harris become another Hwy 51 in Pineville Matthews, or will we see something different???

I would assume that the development will be a notch above that in South Charlotte (Carolina Place). I also believe that this area will be similar to the Perimeter area in Atlanta as we go into the next decade. What do you guys think?

More office, more residential, and definately more retial are in store. Now the question is how high will the quality of development be? I also would like to know from all of you high rise guys if you think we will go verticle near the Reames road/ I-77 intersection (ie office and hotels)???

A2

[A2]

I am curious will the residential piece mentioned in the article have any verticle piece to it?

A2

[dubone]

I think that it is a very positive step that Charlotte is taking to make a plan for the Northlake area. CDOT and the the Planning department are now proponents of gridded, connected streets. This should prevent the Pineville-Matthews Rd effect.

They also have nearby stations for the N line, which will allow the city to approve higher density and prevent the sprawl that is typical of suburban activity centers. The city has learned that they can demand higher quality of the development in the area, due to the high demand for rezonings.

The retail growth is staggering, though. Hopefully, it will pull some retail spending from other counties, or from Mecklenburg residents that otherwise would have shopped in Concord. That will mean higher sales tax revenues in this county for both Transit and general purpose funds.

I am curious will the residential piece mentioned in the article have any verticle piece to it?

A2

My guess is that we can expect some height to projects around the transit station, but not as high rises.

[A2]

I think that it is a very positive step that Charlotte is taking to make a plan for the Northlake area. CDOT and the the Planning department are now proponents of gridded, connected streets. This should prevent the Pineville-Matthews Rd effect.

The retail growth is staggering, though. .

My guess is that we can expect some height to projects around the transit station, but not as high rises.

I agree. I think reams road will be developed in a much better fashion. I wanted to get some more perspective from the gang as to what they thought.

BTW, I think the number of retail sqaure footage is around 3.1-3.2 million according to the article. That is freggin' HUGE. That would be almost 3 BofA Corporate towers of shear retail space.

Or better yet 3 Carolina Place malls of retial. That does not include what developers want to do from an office and residential standpoint.

A2

[monsoon]

My guess is that we can expect some height to projects around the transit station, but not as high rises.

Possibly. But the closest station to the mall will be the one on Harris where 115 crosses. My guess is that is about 5 miles from there. I would be more willing to think that highrise development would occur there IF it was LRT. But since this is a basic commuter rail system I am not sure if it will do a good job at spurring development of this type. Remember, unlike LRT, commuter rail really isn't designed to encourage high density development. (though it won't hurt). That could change of course if they built a bi-directional electrified railway, but I don't expect that for a long time unless ridership overwhelmes what they are planning.

It would be great however if they did have some kind of rail transit to the mall area.

Edited November 14, 2005 by metro.m

[A2]

With all of the development in the area, does anyone expect the farm land right around NL to be developed? The last time I went to Northlake, I went home via Reames Road. It seemed crazy how much open green pasture there was just off to the left of Reames rd heading away from the mall.

Is this one of those weird instances where a private owner is going to hold onto the land and development will just surround it for the next decade, or are we just talking about land that is already owned by a developer that will soon be developed in the next one to two years?

A2

[dubone]

But if you look at it another way, it will also have an extremely large amount of new transportation capacity. 485, widened 77, North commuter line, Fred Alexander Blvd, and Northlake Parkway. If they combine that with a gridded street network in the immediate area, there should be quite a bit of capacity to handle the growth.

The key will be to provide or demand the private sector to build enough localized connected streets so that the land can be developed in a dense pattern. Hopefully Huntersville will stick to its guns and leave its western area rural, so that the Northlake density can be healthy.

Of course, a major problem will be that North Mecklenburg just voted down $130m worth of new local school infrastructure. That will not stop the growth, but it will make for thousands of angry parents and high profits at the classroom trailer manufacturer.

[monsoon]

On the Huntersville side, I believe that some of that will happen. Unfortunately going east on Harris Blvd one finds that it is already highly developed with endless cul-de-sac development. It is really a mess.

I think Rhemes Rd heading back to Charlotte will see some development. However as you get closer to Sunset Rd, the area starts to become questionable, and you start running into some industrial areas.

[A2]

On the Huntersville side, I believe that some of that will happen. Unfortunately going east on Harris Blvd one finds that it is already highly developed with endless cul-de-sac development. It is really a mess.

I think Rhemes Rd heading back to Charlotte will see some development. However as you get closer to Sunset Rd, the area starts to become questionable, and you start running into some industrial areas.

Why is Sunset not as attractive for developers? I have often wondered since it is so close to Uptown. I question why that whole interchange does not have more on it. It is basically halfway between the mall and Uptown. It seems crazy that it is even zoned Industrial, but even so, if I were a developer I would be focused in on the area big time.

A2

Edited November 14, 2005 by A2

[monsoon]

Why is Sunset not as attractive for developers?

Well you have the huge county jail complex, the metrolina fair grounds that bring in a great deal of traffic, and about 5 trucking depots located on that exit between Hwy 21 and I-77. It's not really an area that I would want to live in. And the area on the East side of I-77 headed back into town (Statesville Ave) is afflicted with some pretty high crime areas.

Edited November 14, 2005 by metro.m

[A2]

Well you have the huge county jail complex, the metrolina fair grounds that bring in a great deal of traffic, and about 5 trucking depots located on that exit between Hwy 21 and I-77. It's not really an area that I would want to live in. And the area on the East side of I-77 headed back into town (Statesville Ave) is afflicted with some pretty high crime areas.

I guess it only makes sense then that developers skip over sunset. I guess I am disappointed by the location of all the Truck depot's and the site of the jail then. It seems crazy to have it all so close to the center city imo.

A2

[dubone]

Growth in the Charlotte part of Northlake will likely be near the future N line station, off the future Fred Alexander Blvd, (the northwest Charlotte arterial), and closer to Mountain Island Lake.

I wish the city could use eminent domain and add some connectivity to some of the culdesac neighborhoods, but that isn't too likely.

[monsoon]

Maybe, but there are some things you need to know about the area.

Here is a map of the area with some of my notations on it.

The pale light red blob in the middle is the Northlake area.

To the west of it you can see Mountain Island Lake and the Catawba river. It should be noted that approximately in the green area not much development can occur. Its in a watershed area and the land has also been set aside for parks and wildlife refuges for much of the lake. 75% of Mountain Island Lake is protected I think. I know from traveling on my boat north on the river until it hits the dam at Lake Norman there is no development at all and one passes by Latta Plantation and Cowan's Ford Wildlife Refuge. There is also a steam power generatng station on the west side of the lake that takes up a good bit of land.

The blue area is the Huntersville EJT. If I am not mistaken, much of this has been zoned by Huntersville to keep the density of development real low. Low enough so that you wont see starter home cul de sac development or much of anything else. The yellow blob in this area is the Huntersville Business Park where businesses can locate. The area just below that is set aside for a park.

The black dots on the right side are the approximate locations of the North Commuter Rail line stations.

[dubone]

The Huntersville growth looks like it will continue east from 77 for two or three miles. Perhaps east of Asbury Chapel / Brown Rd.

In Charlotte, I'm expecting NorthLake to affect growth between Sugar Creek and 77, and the area around the future Fred Alexander Blvd, which will go between Sunset Hills and Oak Hills golf courses.

[DigitalSky]

Fred Alexander will definately stimulate growth in that area

Also

http://www.wsoctv.com/news/5359749/detail.html

Northlake focusses on Gang prevention

Edited November 19, 2005 by cantnot

[MZT]

I finally gave this mall a walk-through. (Not much else to do the night before Thanksgiving).

The architects were definately shooting for a different effect than in the other malls. It feels more Taliesen-like, with the flat sloping ceilings-- and the wood veneer, picnic tables, and exposed bricks inside the structure.

There are some odd, jarring lines about it at times though... and it seems a bit ... "airport-like".

I think more growth will need to occur in the outparcels, before this mall becomes a heavyweight to counter Carolina Mills. It looks dark out there, beyond the edge of the parking lots.

Certainly the fact that it is new, and smells like fresh paint, will keep the curious coming from all around. But it's a bit far for me (16 miles from south Charlotte.) It may be far enough away from Eastland as well... that Eastland's death will have more to do with its own mismanagement, than from the competition.

Edited November 24, 2005 by MZT

[StevenRocks]

IIt may be far enough away from Eastland as well... that Eastland's death will have more to do with its own mismanagement, than from the competition.

Mismanagement and overblown reports of violence, that is.

One thing that helps Eastland is that Northlake didn't chose to include a Sears.

[DigitalSky]

(16 miles from south Charlotte.)

Yeah but for me it's just as far to Northlake as it is to Concord Mills

[Temeteron]

I finally gave this mall a walk-through. (Not much else to do the night before Thanksgiving).

The architects were definately shooting for a different effect than in the other malls. It feels more Taliesen-like, with the flat sloping ceilings-- and the wood veneer, picnic tables, and exposed bricks inside the structure.

There are some odd, jarring lines about it at times though... and it seems a bit ... "airport-like".

I think more growth will need to occur in the outparcels, before this mall becomes a heavyweight to counter Carolina Mills. It looks dark out there, beyond the edge of the parking lots.

Certainly the fact that it is new, and smells like fresh paint, will keep the curious coming from all around. But it's a bit far for me (16 miles from south Charlotte.) It may be far enough away from Eastland as well... that Eastland's death will have more to do with its own mismanagement, than from the competition.

Carolina Mills??

[MZT]

Ha! Too late to cover my tracks. Need to pay more attention on late night UP posts.