Northlake Mall

[SmellyCat]

I went shopping this weekend at NorthLake. The mall seemed to be pretty crowded. I hadn't been there in months, but did notice a very evident demographic change in shoppers from the last time I went there, as there definitely appeared to be considerably more African Americans there. In fact, they were the majority of the shoppers in the mall at the time.

[StevenRocks]

I think Northlake is the new Eastland.

[Temeteron]

I think Northlake is the new Eastland.

OMG

[DigitalSky]

I think Northlake is the new Eastland.

Everything really does come full circle, to an extent. There was a time, where Eastland was the nice mall and SouthPark was the dumpier (for lack of a better word) mall...

[mallguy]

$394 per sf is good but if the holidays are factored in, I'd think it should be higher; isn't the average for all malls in the US somewhere north of $350?

I agree that Northlake will be the next Eastland. Sad but unfortunately likely. At least Northlake has plenty of stores (Brooks Bros., Pottery Barn, etc.) that don't appeal to people who hang out at Eastland- so maybe that will be Northlake's saving grace.

Edited March 13, 2006 by mallguy

[SmellyCat]

I agree that Northlake will be the next Eastland. Sad but unfortunately likely. At least Northlake has plenty of stores (Brooks Bros., Pottery Barn, etc.) that don't appeal to people who hang out at Eastland- so maybe that will be Northlake's saving grace.

When I was there, Brooks Brothers was completely empty. J. Crew almost was empty.

[charlotte_bon_vivant]

I think Northlake is the new Eastland.

That can be their new slogan. Northlake Mall -- The New Eastland

[DigitalSky]

When I was there, Brooks Brothers was completely empty. J. Crew almost was empty.

So maybe Charlotte can handle only one upscale mall...

[nyxmike]

When I was there, Brooks Brothers was completely empty. J. Crew almost was empty.

Yeah, but I've seen that happen in other malls before (upscale malls too). I think once 485 opens (better access to more people) and as the area grows, it will get better. I'm not too worried about Northlake, because even if Eastland closes, I am sure someone will buy it and re-do it to better suit the needs of the area. I still think Northlake will be like Perimeter Mall in Atlanta - I wouldn't base it's decline on racial demographics.

[mallguy]

Just thinking- wouldn't Concord Mills have stores that would appeal more to people who now shop (or loiter, or whatever they do) at Eastland?

Thus wouldn't that be the next Eastland?

I haven't lived in Charlotte long enough to know, but at one point did the Eastland types ever shop at SouthPark before SouthPark moved way upscale?

[lupitachica]

I've shopped at both Eastland and Northlake...besides the fact that many of the shoppers are black, I don't really how one could say that the demographic is the same. Eastland's crowd (imo) is primarily teenagers. Its a local hangout mall where the kids regardless of whether they are shopping or not. Northlake (when I"ve gone) has been full of families w/ some young shoppers but more couples and mothers w/ kids, etc imo. There is a much greater mix across age and class range.

Now are people here saying that Northlake will become the same as Eastland just because they see black faces? The black community is no more monolithic than any other. As a black person, I see a big difference btwn the shopping population in Eastland and Northlake.

[MZT]

I think the pregnant question, is whether in a short time NorthLake may be perceived as drawing "too many" low income people. Just because it borders Huntersville, doesn't mean it will continue to have a mixed demographic. NorthLake could lose upscale tenants, and begin the slippery slide to B mall status just like anywhere else can.

Huntersville shoppers can just as easily drive a few miles north, as south. But the starter-home and apartment dwelling residents of north Charlotte, don't have as many options. They will be "drawn" to Northlake.

Edited March 14, 2006 by MZT

[Temeteron]

Dont all malls change the first few years they are open?

[StevenRocks]

I was the one who made the statement about Northlake becoming the next Eastland and I'm black. There was not a racist motivation in my statement in the least. I hope the mall stays successful and I also hope that Eastland rebounds. I shop at both malls and I

[Miesian Corners]

^Thank you Steven. Not everything has to be racially motivated.

[Temeteron]

I cant believe its been 7 years since Concord Mills opened. It has changed alot. The stores anyway. I dont really remember if the demographics were different back in 1999 there though. But im sure theyve changed also. And once Mint Hill opens, the blacks and latinos (not necessarily trouble makers) will probably start going there. Charlotte's demographics are constantly shifting and changing

[DigitalSky]

Concord Mills' demographics are in the widest range of any mall in the area, they are still basically the same demos.

[Skyline49er]

Concord Mills' demographics are in the widest range of any mall in the area, they are still basically the same demos.

I work up at Concord Mills and i see about every race, gender, ethnicity and age that there is. I think its great

[StevenRocks]

Racial diversity is a good thing at malls. When a mall gets too far into one demographic, it starts to become boring. SouthPark was getting too "rich middle-aged white lady" before its renovation. Carolina Place is too "average suburban joe" right now. Northlake, I think, will level out as a good mix of shoppers like Concord Mills has.

[Temeteron]

I work up at Concord Mills and i see about every race, gender, ethnicity and age that there is. I think its great

i love diversity also

[mallguy]

Dont all malls change the first few years they are open?

Greenville Mall sure did- lost 2 of its 3 anchors in the first 7 years, followed by its remaining anchor and nearly all of its in-line tenants. And it was a beautiful, new mall. Thus Northlake can't be certain to be thriving and upscale after a few years.

[lupitachica]

There was not a racist motivation in my statement in the least.

I don't believe I suggested that your statement was racist - though being black does not preclude one from making racist statements about other blacks. I asked if people were concluding that Northlake was the new Eastland simply because they see a large number of black faces. And then discussed the difference that I see btwn the shoppers at both locations.

My point was that the overall demographics at Northlake seem different than more narrow one at Eastland except for the fact that many of the shoppers are black. Northlake is a pretty diverse mall, imo. Yes you do see some Eastland style teens but they are a narrow % (imo) of the larger whole as opposed to a large chunk of the pie. Given the demographics of the city of Charlotte, I'd expect the crowds at the mall to look like the ones I've seen at Northlake.

The reason that I said it is because when one mall closes, its customers and problems drift to the next closest mall. Since Northlake is fairly close to Uptown and accessible by bus from most transit hubs, it

[SmellyCat]

I'm interested to see the way Taubman handles this. Their target malls are predominantly very upscale. Will they give up on it quickly if the target market suddenly shifts away from what they projected for Northlake? Most of their best relationships are with the highest end tenants, not sneaker stores or urban clothing stores. I know they got a ridiculous financing package and are fully cashed out on about as much loan proceeds as they could possibly get from a mall of this type. So it wouldn't surprise me to see them bail out and sell it rather quickly, and take a large gain. Hopefully not to a scrub B/C-mall operator and then we'd have to watch another Eastland unfold before our eyes.

[charlotte_bon_vivant]

Keep in mind that these same people are already going to Southpark and Carolina Place to shop for the things they can't find at Eastland.

This is what I thought Steven meant. That Northlake was the new "go to" mall for everyone. The mall appeals to a larger demographic than SouthPark and Carolina Place is just too far for a lot of people. From what I heard from longtime Charlotte residents, Eastland used to be the mall that served a wide range of people because of its variety of stores and that Northlake is now filling that void.

But as it turns out, I was completely wrong.

[StevenRocks]

And just because it wasn't racially motivated doesn't mean that it wasn't ignorant and unfounded.

I have over 800 posts here on UrbanPlanet that state my extensive research and knowledge of the retail scene in Charlotte and its relation to race. If anything is ignorant and unfounded, it's you jumping onto a tangent based on a seven-word sentence.

I don't believe I suggested that your statement was racist - though being black does not preclude one from making racist statements about other blacks. I asked if people were concluding that Northlake was the new Eastland simply because they see a large number of black faces. And then discussed the difference that I see btwn the shoppers at both locations.

My point was that the overall demographics at Northlake seem different than more narrow one at Eastland except for the fact that many of the shoppers are black. Northlake is a pretty diverse mall, imo. Yes you do see some Eastland style teens but they are a narrow % (imo) of the larger whole as opposed to a large chunk of the pie. Given the demographics of the city of Charlotte, I'd expect the crowds at the mall to look like the ones I've seen at Northlake.

I think that the trouble at Eastland is there because its very close and the people will probably find another area in the immediate vicinity to congregate. Keep in mind that these same people are already going to Southpark and Carolina Place to shop for the things they can't find at Eastland.

There's already a movement afoot by the mainstream retail community to move away from East Charlotte because they figure they can make more money in the farther-out suburbs. And there are a lot of people that think that if they get rid of Eastland Mall that somehow that will eliminate the problem of rowdy teenagers and loitering at area shopping centers. My point is that if Eastland is eliminated or if all those mainstream stores pull out, whatever problems, percieved and real, will gravitate to the next mall over, which is Northlake. Those issuers are not going to go away, they are going to transfer to a new location.

I understand that Northlake and Eastland are different entities. They don't look alike and they don't act alike. That said, Northlake will attract more of the less-fashionable element Eastland is famous for as time goes on as well as the majority of Eastland shoppers that are repectful of each other and their surroundings. Some of those kids will go to Carolina Place and SouthPark as well, but a lot oif them will go to Northlake.

Somehow, in the zeal to turn this into an oppurtunity to rain on StevenRocks' parade, I've been labeled a racist, or at least an ignorant person making unfounded statements. If anyone here has tried through small-time activism to save Eastland Mall, it has been me. I have been a tireless supporter of the place, warts and all, ever since I've been here. I don't appreciate the inisnution that somehow I'm ignorant because I see what's going to happen in the future if nothing is done for the youth in this city.