New Embassy Suites - Monroe North

[egrguy]

I would usually agree with cutting the cord on a project, but I learned a lesson with UICA, that patience can pay off in the end. That building sure is better then a surface lot.

I am okay with an extension. If the market improves, there is not a reason the project can't get bigger. Its not like there is an alternate project on the board. I think with a delay, the project eventually gets started and becomes a nice fill in project for northern DT.

[egrguy]

I would usually agree that a delay is a bad idea and let's cut the cord and move on; however, there is not an alternate project that is not getting built here with the delay. I think long-term this project gets done and is a nice fill in for that part of town.

[egrguy]

I would usually agree that a delay is a bad idea and let's cut the cord and move on; however, there is not an alternate project that is not getting built here with the delay. I think long-term this project gets done and is a nice fill in for that part of town.

[jas49503]

I don't think that there should be ren zone credits for empty lots or undeveoped buildings. just look at the kendall building. there is not incentive to do anything because there are no taxes to be paid. just squat on it. just like "churches" here in town that snap up all the empty lots that they don't need and the try and extort people that want to use it. the can afford to ask some obscene amount for a lot because, since they don't pay taxes on them, they can take as long as they want to find a buyer without costing them a dime. There should be some provision for extending the credit but charging taxes in the meantime until a project starts.

[GRDadof3]

Scratch my earlier post. The Ren Zone was already extended in 2008. This request was to extend the development agreement with the city to change the start date and the scope of the project.

[GRDadof3]

So we are going to just string this along for however long they keep asking? Since the credit disappears for good if it is yanked, then there is no incentive to do anything within 2 or 7 years. The city can just keep granting extensions to keep the credit alive and then these developers can just put a Family Dollar there in 2023.

What's to stop them?

They got the credit for Plan A, now it's cut back (for whatever reason), and they get the extension to boot! So stand-by for the next scale-back and extension #3.

And as I remember no one here was complaining about the original Icon development plans as being silly or out of place. Everyone here was totally geeked for it. I don't recall any posts asking for something more modest or lamenting some out of place design.

If a Family Dollar fits within the current zoning, it's well within the developer's right to build one. Do you think it's not?

I was complaining about the original Icon plan and never for a million years thought it would be built. Guess I was right (again).

[GRDadof3]

I don't think that there should be ren zone credits for empty lots or undeveoped buildings. just look at the kendall building. there is not incentive to do anything because there are no taxes to be paid. just squat on it. just like "churches" here in town that snap up all the empty lots that they don't need and the try and extort people that want to use it. the can afford to ask some obscene amount for a lot because, since they don't pay taxes on them, they can take as long as they want to find a buyer without costing them a dime. There should be some provision for extending the credit but charging taxes in the meantime until a project starts.

No taxes are being paid on the Kendall Building? Where did you hear that?

[Raildudes dad]

Churches only are exempt from taxes on property used for religious purposes. The church we previously attended bought a house and vacant lot next to the church for future expansion. It was tax free as long as the house was vacant or used for church classes. We sponsored a refuge family and moved them into it. For the 2 years they lived there, we were required to pay property taxes even though we were allowing them to live there rent free. (I was Treasurer so I was personally involved with the tax bills)

[jas49503]

No taxes are being paid on the Kendall Building? Where did you hear that?

I mistakenly thought that it was part of the monroe center ren zone. i guess that he probably has to pay taxes on it though. If that is the case though I wonder why he doesn't do something with it.

the fact that churches don;t have to pay taxes on vacant properties is exactly the problem. it allows them to squat on something indefinitely. not to mention that churches should contribute just like everyone else. I am not sure why they get out of paying taxes in the first place. especially since a good percentage of them are non-profit in tax status only

vacant or underutilized properties should always be taxed.

[GRDadof3]

I mistakenly thought that it was part of the monroe center ren zone. i guess that he probably has to pay taxes on it though. If that is the case though I wonder why he doesn't do something with it.

the fact that churches don;t have to pay taxes on vacant properties is exactly the problem. it allows them to squat on something indefinitely. not to mention that churches should contribute just like everyone else. I am not sure why they get out of paying taxes in the first place. especially since a good percentage of them are non-profit in tax status only

vacant or underutilized properties should always be taxed.

He did try to renovate it at one time, but didn't get very far. The taxable value is about $60,000 I believe, so taxes are what, $900/year? That's a lot cheaper than coming up with $1 Million to renovate the place, and find a user (or users).

[Allison Slater]

I could completely understand some frustration if this project was scaled back years ago, but let's face it. This project was proposed when the economy was still booming. We're in a deep recession now and recovery is still shaky and uncertain. A scale-back does not surprise me at all; in fact I think it'd be a bit ridiculous to expect otherwise.

[GRDadof3]

Well damn, there ya go:

 

http://www.grbj.com/articles/76343-suburban-inns-plans-riverfront-embassy-suites-in-downtown-grand-rapids

[joeDowntown]

Wow, I didn't see that coming. With the land along the river going up for sale and MSU securing the GR Press site, it seems like a wise long-term investment. 

 

I didn't realize Embassy Suites was considered the high-end of the Hilton chain.

 

Crossing my fingers that it has a nice urban look. 

 

Great news!

 

Joe

[metrogrkid]

Wow, I didn't see that coming. With the land along the river going up for sale and MSU securing the GR Press site, it seems like a wise long-term investment. 

 

I didn't realize Embassy Suites was considered the high-end of the Hilton chain.

 

Crossing my fingers that it has a nice urban look. 

 

Great news!

 

Joe

I'm hoping that GR will finally execute some planning continuity by using this as an opportunity to actually integrate a good project with good plans created before it that will make it stronger....of course I'm refering to the Monroe/Market Streetrail alignment that will have its track turn left from Sixth Street back onto Monroe for its southbound return to Central Station.  Were ITP/The Rapid to be proactive and reach out to Embassy Suites with a copy of the Streetrail plan that GRDad placed a copy of here at UP-GR recently, that development could become a POWERFUL example of how people destinations along the Monroe/Market route can benefit HUGE from partnering with the City and ITP to build in-development integrated Streetrail stations.  The North Monroe DASH shuttle is a harbinger of the positive effects to come that connecting North Downtown to Center City with robust transit will bring about for Greater Downtown.  WE SEEM TO BE MOVING FORWARD now that we are beginning to climb out of the Great Recession hole.   

[RegalTDP]

Hmm... They're still saying 11 stories with a 7 story garage.  The original 240-250 room plan was supposed to be 11 stories too.  But then in 2011 they chopped it down to ~150 rooms, and didn't release any new pictures (at least that nothing appeared on this site).

 

So if they're announcing 11 stories, does that mean they're going back to the original 250 room plan?

 

Of course, these are now suites, so there will probably have to be less rooms per floor than initially thought.

 

Crossing my fingers that it has a nice urban look.

 

Agreed!  I hope it's not like the awful example they have pictured in the GRBJ article.

 

Therefore, to re-inspire everybody I'm reposting the original drawing from 2007 - hopefully they'll stick with the style, regardless of how big it is.

 

[SupercityGR]

This is great news! Just made my day. I do like that rendering from 2007, it doesnt look like anything else from the area!

[Allison Slater]

That 2007 rendering remains one of my favourites I've seen for the city, along with one of the many 240 Ionia (canceled iirc) and 38 Commerce.  Really hoping it's still the current rendering.

[wingbert]

If you want some insight into how the average schmo thinks about downtown, read the story on Wood TV's website and skip down to the comments section.  Many comments lamenting the fact that this takes away another parking lot downtown where there already isn't enough parking to go around.  It's people like these what cause unrest.

 

Wood TV.com New Hotel Project

[john_denver]

Agree...most of he people who commented may ony come downtown once in a blue moon.

 

 

If you want some insight into how the average schmo thinks about downtown, read the story on Wood TV's website and skip down to the comments section.  Many comments lamenting the fact that this takes away another parking lot downtown where there already isn't enough parking to go around.  It's people like these what cause unrest.

 

Wood TV.com New Hotel Project

[RegalTDP]

If you want some insight into how the average schmo thinks about downtown, read the story on Wood TV's website and skip down to the comments section.  Many comments lamenting the fact that this takes away another parking lot downtown where there already isn't enough parking to go around.  It's people like these what cause unrest.

 

Wood TV.com New Hotel Project

 

I disagree.  Internet commenters don't drive the discussion.  They're irrelevant.  That's why they're only vocal on the internet.  The real discussion is among the people who are actually in a position to do stuff.  I'm not trying to insult anybody, as I consider myself among the former, not the latter. 

 

Examples:  Road diets and traffic circles.  Thousands of comments have been thrown on MLive over the years decrying what ridiculous calamities they are.  But guess what?  People still drive on Division, Wealthy, and Breton.

 

If there's demand for a hotel, it's going to be built, no matter what commenters say about it on the internet.

 

Now, new social media makes it easier for like-minded people to meet, form groups and spread influence, but that still requires a level of initiative that's beyond most internet users.  The people who defeated the BRT proposal in 2009 weren't random commenters, but a well-organized group.

 

I would postulate that the "average schmo":

(a) Only cares about downtown in as far as what interests him or her.  Most local schmos aren't going to be staying in this hotel, so they're largely apathetic.

(b) Isn't particularly interested a new building unless it's a sexy skyscraper or an arena.  All other buildings are just buildings.

[RegalTDP]

NM

[joeDowntown]

I'd classify all Mlive and WoodTV commenters as morons. Regardless of the subject.

 

Joe

 

If you want some insight into how the average schmo thinks about downtown, read the story on Wood TV's website and skip down to the comments section.  Many comments lamenting the fact that this takes away another parking lot downtown where there already isn't enough parking to go around.  It's people like these what cause unrest.

 

Wood TV.com New Hotel Project

[GRDadof3]

The MLive article makes it sounds like they are going through a total design change, unveiling it in May:

 

http://www.mlive.com/business/west-michigan/index.ssf/2013/03/new_hotel_north_of_downtown_gr.html

 

I hope they stick with mostly masonry, at least in the portion that is the same height as Brass Works next door.

[GR_Urbanist]

If you want some insight into how the average schmo thinks about downtown, read the story on Wood TV's website and skip down to the comments section.  Many comments lamenting the fact that this takes away another parking lot downtown where there already isn't enough parking to go around.  It's people like these what cause unrest.

 

Wood TV.com New Hotel Project

 

Oh yes, this is very true.

 

GR for decades has F'd up, expanding by putting un needed stuff in places occupied by parking lots, that already don't have enough parking to support what's already there.

 

I seriously hate the stupidity of people in this town sometimes. But then again, this comment was from someone from Wyoming, so I'm not surprised at the lack of intelligence.

[GR8scott]

While hardly upscale, I am a little surprised that Embassy Suites would be located there. When I think of Embassy suites I think a large 10 story building with an open atrium and located near an airport or in an upscale suburb. I think it would be unique for this market. Always good to see new brands in town howabout bringing back Raddison or for an actual upscale hotel Sheraton, Weston or  Hyatt. I think what downtown really needs is a mainstream hotel to compliment the Holiday inn.