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Rhino6885

Would you support a tax increase?

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With a big Friday ahead of us, would you support an increase in state income tax?

I'll go first.

HELL YES! This would let us improve infrastructure, improve public safety and other govt services, increase investment in higher education, give tax benefits to companies investing in Michigan, etc. Maybe this is a bad place to pose this question, as most of us want to see our state succeed in the worst of ways. Bottom line: I'm happy to pay a little more each year if is allocated in a manner that improves the quality of life here in Michigan. Are you? How much more can we cut?

Here's a little story on it:

Wood TV Story (Grand Rapids)

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No. I will not support any statewide tax increase.

I would certainly give a second thought to a regionalized sales tax increase (if it were possible) to generate revenue for infrastructure, arts and education.

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I think I would support a sales tax increase before supporting an income tax increase

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I think I would support a sales tax increase before supporting an income tax increase

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I think I would support a sales tax increase before supporting an income tax increase

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I much rather have a sales tax increase. In fact, I would love to see people taxed only on what they buy and not what they make.

We get taxed for the money we make, and the money we spend. We get taxed for the property we own and sometimes the property we sell.

Let

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What I don't like is that sales tax is generally a regressive tax--having a greater impact as income gets lower. Right now, it's the people who aren't making money who need the most help.

Interesting...

Why a sales tax over income tax?

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Rhino, you really can't see how someone would not want an increase on their income tax, but concede a sales tax? From a selfish perspective, how could you not want a sales tax increase over an income tax increase if those are the only two choices given?

Personally, along with more reforms, of course, I wouldn't mind some marginal increase and combination of the two.

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Rhino, you really can't see how someone would not want an increase on their income tax, but concede a sales tax? From a selfish perspective, how could you not want a sales tax increase over an income tax increase if those are the only two choices given?

Personally, along with more reforms, of course, I wouldn't mind some marginal increase and combination of the two.

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Rhino, you really can't see how someone would not want an increase on their income tax, but concede a sales tax? From a selfish perspective, how could you not want a sales tax increase over an income tax increase if those are the only two choices given?

Personally, along with more reforms, of course, I wouldn't mind some marginal increase and combination of the two.

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Theres no way we can continue to cut spending anymore, we've already hit Mississippian levels of bad education, bad police protection, and horrible urban roads. Anyone whose so blind as to not see what underfunding government does for a state overall might as well keep the sunglasses on.

The best states economically in the union have some of the highest State income taxes AND some pretty high sales taxes too. Minn and Mass are two examples of states that do the best economically yet still have some of the highest tax rates in the US. The best option right now is an income tax increase.

I don't see my income tax being taken from me like I see sales taxes taken everyday. When I go to a restaurant, or go to buy the latest DVD I notice Sales Taxes. sometimes its in the form of "Oops, I didn't bring enough money to cover the sales tax on this, guess I have to come back later, or I have to put it on the charge card..."

If I had it my way, we'd have a 6% income tax, and a 0% sales tax. I think sales taxes are the most unfair, and underhanded taxes we have. Increasing sales taxes rewards the rich, and punishes the poor. income taxes distribute taxes fairly across the spectrum of salaries.

What kind of taxes were the revolutionaries fighting about in the Revolutionary War? It wasn't income tax, it was the nickel and diming sales taxes. Like Stamp taxes and tea taxes, and on and on. These were sales taxes, and in the end they cause more greif then solution.

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Theres no way we can continue to cut spending anymore, we've already hit Mississippian levels of bad education, bad police protection, and horrible urban roads. Anyone whose so blind as to not see what underfunding government does for a state overall might as well keep the sunglasses on.

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One the few things on which I agreed with Granholm early on was her moratorium on new Highway construction projects - maintenance first policy. But then she disappointed and caved on that one too thinking that somehow by putting more people on the government payroll and accelerating projects the state would save money. WE NEED TO STOP NEW CONSTRUCTION AND CAPACITY ENHANCEMENTS NOW!

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A tax increase is going to happen. The only debate is how much and what form they'll take (income, excise, closing loopholes, etc.). I think Granholm's proposal to tax services at 2% was the best one, and that percentage could have been negotiated downward to appease Republicans. But unfortunately that's no longer an option.

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It is things like this that drive me crazy and against any type of new taxes.

MI State Police HQ

Taxes should be for truly need quailty of life items...not political paybacks.

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Out of curiosity, I took a look at our state income and sales tax versus other states across the US. Data came from money.cnn.com.

State Income Tax (highest level):

Michigan: 3.9%

California: 9.3%

Colorodo: 4.63%

New York: 6.85%

Oregon: 9%

Mass: 5.3%

Conn: 5%

Texas: n/a

Florida: n/a

CNN Best Places Average: 6.46%

State Sales Tax:

Michigan: 6.00%

California: 7.75%

Colorodo: 6.7%

New York: 8.38%

Oregon: zero, according to the site

Mass: 5.3%

Conn: 6%

Texas: 8.25%

Florida: 6.5%

CNN Best Places Average: 6.55%

...something to think about.

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We're one of the most backward states in the union and I have none but the leadership to blame (not that I think Dick Devos would have been any better).

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I can agree with that first sentence to a high degree, though, I'd say leadership in the past few years in all three branches of state government leaves quite a bit to be desired.

BTW, I think arguing over this 4.3, 4.6, or whatever income tax rate is ridiculous when people seem to forget the income tax was upwards of 6.0% back in the 1980's, even as the auto industry was going through a huge downshift, so it's not like this increase is unwarranted or too high. It's simply a correction in a rate that's gone too low. Maybe, down the road, it will be lowered again, but I find it funny some are painting the increase as the end of the world.

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No. I will not support any statewide tax increase.

I would certainly give a second thought to a regionalized sales tax increase (if it were possible) to generate revenue for infrastructure, arts and education.

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Michigan's problem never was it's leadership, its the public's non acceptance of even small sacrifices to benefit the whole versus their own selfish desires. The government caving to the minority, people who threaten recall votes, and push through legislation by petition are whats killing this state. The biggest problem doesn't lie with leadership, it lies with the garbage that the public has put in the state constitution. Everytime some proposal passes in the general election it costs the state millions, if not billions to enforce.

That recent proposal regarding race in government decisions cost the state lots of money to have to reform to the new law. The proposal that said that gay couples can't recieve the same benefits as regular folk led to millions in litigation costs. Litigation costs soar with each new proposal added. I've said it before, I'll say it again, to really fix the state, a complete overhaul of the state constituion, and the removal of some of the more egregious proposals that have been added recently are the real fixes. The sad thing is the people who pushed these garbage proposals will fight tooth and nail to keep them in the new constitution.

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No general fund money is spent on roads, check out the budget. Road funding is from the "gas & weight taxes" fuel tax and license plate fees (Act 51). MDOT has done a great job "maintaining' the state highways, they are in generally good shape. Unfortunately it's been with mostly borrowed money. Build MI I, II, and III and now Jobs Today are all borrowed money. In just a few years it will take most of the Act 51 monies to repay the bonds :( . Pennsylvania did the same thing back in the 70's, not very pretty :wacko: Local jurisdiction streets especially the urban streets are suffering.

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With a big Friday ahead of us, would you support an increase in state income tax?

I'll go first.

HELL YES! This would let us improve infrastructure, improve public safety and other govt services, increase investment in higher education, give tax benefits to companies investing in Michigan, etc. Maybe this is a bad place to pose this question, as most of us want to see our state succeed in the worst of ways. Bottom line: I'm happy to pay a little more each year if is allocated in a manner that improves the quality of life here in Michigan. Are you? How much more can we cut?

Here's a little story on it:

Wood TV Story (Grand Rapids)

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Another issue with road maintenance is the bureaucracy of the system...no so much for the cities but for people who live in townships and CDP's (lets set a side the pro-urban argument here for a second). Their roads are controlled at a county level and the counties pretty much do as they please when they please without much regard to the needs or desires of the affected local community. A bit off topic but frustrating none the less.

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"CDP's" ? The improvement / reconstruction priorities for county primary roads are set by the Road Commission board. Local road improvements are planned with a lot of input from the townships. (Check the Road Commission map for which ones are Primary). Repaving and surface treatment programs are discussed and planned with township input as well. I don't know how you can say "counties pretty much do as they please when they please without much regard to the needs or desires of the affected local community." because from my perspective, it's not a true statement. I'd like specific examples.

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I do have an example in which the integrity and interest of the road commission comes into question. In Ottawa County they put a turn lane in the middle of Bauer Road in front of Jenison High School about a year back. The issue is it would have made a lot more sense to put a by pass lane on the north (west bound side). This was noted by the local governing unit. The papers reported this was done because a road commission member lives on that stretch of road and didn't want another lane of traffic cutting through his/her yard.

I'm not saying all county road commissions are bad and I don't think Ottawa County's is evil either. I guess, like anything else...it's all politics and you just have to learn to play the game.

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