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Powerhouse Plaza

urbanesq

By urbanesq
in The NC Triangle

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cthayes75 Whistle-Stop

cthayes75

Posted
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I'm pretty sure the plan is to convert Jones & Lane to two-way operation within a few years. Lenoir & South will be done first as part of the F-St Phase Two project.

Do you really think the General Assembly is going to allow that? I mean, they'd lose their cushy street parking if that happened!

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DPK Hamlet

DPK

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I don't have as much of an issue with there being no retail on the West Street side now that I have a good look at the site plan. They're using that area for hotel drop-off, so there will be a level of pedestrian/vehicle interaction going on there. It won't be just a boring windowed wall where you can look in to see cars.

Yes, retail would have been great, but you can't really have that everywhere. I think this will work well.

powerhouseplaza-plans.jpg

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Jones_ City

Jones_

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I am certain I saw the demolition permits for this in the paper in last few days, but cannot find them online. Along with Green Square, this should keep Jones Street busy despite economic slowdown everywhere. This is the one project I see moving forward (not Soleil, Charter Square, Edison, Lafayette or Reynolds) by the summer. With a hotel and all the office space spoken for, what bank would not finance something 100% occupied?

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orulz City

orulz

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Demolition may be getting ready to proceed, but according to the N&O today the financial crunch has put construction of this project on hold:

But the project was contingent on the pre-arranged sale of the hotel portion to an investment group. And as lenders tightened up in 2008, it became harder for hotel investors to finance a purchase, scuttling the plans for now.

I'm not sure whether they mean that the hotel portion is on hold, or the whole project, but in any case. I'm not really going to shed tears over the demolition happening before construction is ready to proceed.

Also an interesting note is that the developers of Powerhouse Square also own some property that borders Peace and Harrington, just east of the intersection with West Street, though they don't have any development plans yet.

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Jones_ City

Jones_

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No. Powerhouse has always been Cross Williams. The Edison is Sandreuter. It's a logical mistake, though!

I would swear Sandreuter's path in downtown was Powerhouse (as a partner)--->Dawson--->West---->Edison. Obviously I am wrong, but did Sandreuter have his hand in something before Dawson in downtown?

Edit: whew...I am not nuts (sorry to go off topic jojo)...I only could quickly find this blurb on Empire's website, but Sandreuter =Hamilton Merritt = Powerhouse Square. 8th paragraph.

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Jones_ City

Jones_

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Ah! Good find. I had to read this twice to see what you meant. "Square" being the old Southend Brewery and "Plaza" being the planned development diagonally across the street. (Is the Napper Tandy corner considered part of PS?)

Yeah, Square was Napper Tandys (Ri Ra at the time) and Southend Brewery plus I think the new building that Blue Martini is in. Still though, Cross Williams is becoming his own man in downtown development it seems. IMO you can't have enough local guys showing how its done.

So is the Powerhouse area, part of Glenwood, part of the warehouse district or its own deal? Inquiring minds want to know. In its time, it was a dirty, industrial, prostitute laden area. Probably would make a good book or setting for a southern biography.

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ChiefJoJo Town

ChiefJoJo

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Yeah, I think Powerhouse Square is considered Glenwood South, but here's to hoping the lines get more and more blurry in the coming years... i.e., projects come to fruition that connect all of DTR together.

FYI, the city council is set to approve an encroachment agreement on city property so they can excavate and install footings and street trees around the building. Not sure what the timeframe will be for this work, if financing is not secured. Also Cline Design, which was set to buy/lease 2 stories in this building, has laid off a number of staff lately, so I wonder whether Cline can still occupy that space.

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DPK Hamlet

DPK

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This project is now on hold:

http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/4686614/

They are going ahead with clearing the land/demo/relocation though. This seems to be the theme lately (knock everything down but not build anything to replace it until the economy gets better). I think that pretty much puts off all the projects for big buildings that hadn't started after the Hue.

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Rufus Hamlet

Rufus

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hmm...I am a little more upset about this one than the others...I just liked the size, design, location, etc...it was a nice project. Now this begs the question: With all of the on-hold projects or cancelled projects that are waiting for the economy to pick back up, how many will truly be revived when this happens? If every one of them are revived, then it gives me hope for the future because it shows resiliency and perseverance on the developers to truly deliver something that will positively affect downtown.

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NCpride Unincorporated Area

NCpride

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hmm...I am a little more upset about this one than the others...I just liked the size, design, location, etc...it was a nice project. Now this begs the question: With all of the on-hold projects or cancelled projects that are waiting for the economy to pick back up, how many will truly be revived when this happens? If every one of them are revived, then it gives me hope for the future because it shows resiliency and perseverance on the developers to truly deliver something that will positively affect downtown.

Maybe this is a topic for a totally separate thread, but I'm curious to hear thoughts on how strong downtown Raleigh will bounce back after the economy gets its footing again. It seems that momentum is a powerful force and a strong catalyst for development. Downtown had built some really positive momentum and quite a buzz over the last few years, but it seems this recession has all but killed that. Sure there are some bright spots to be noted; I'm not one of the naysayers. But there are also a lot of negatives and question marks in my mind. So has the recession ended downtown Raleigh's revitalization or was this only a temporary setback? I would really be interested in what others think about this.

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DwnTwnRaleighGuy Hamlet

DwnTwnRaleighGuy

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Maybe this is a topic for a totally separate thread, but I'm curious to hear thoughts on how strong downtown Raleigh will bounce back after the economy gets its footing again. It seems that momentum is a powerful force and a strong catalyst for development. Downtown had built some really positive momentum and quite a buzz over the last few years, but it seems this recession has all but killed that. Sure there are some bright spots to be noted; I'm not one of the naysayers. But there are also a lot of negatives and question marks in my mind. So has the recession ended downtown Raleigh's revitalization or was this only a temporary setback? I would really be interested in what others think about this.

I personally think downtown will bounce back well and I hope fast...my other thought is that the Reynolds project/Hillsbourgh is the only "for sure" goner...to my knowledge...

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Jones_ City

Jones_

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I know some folks who just moved here and they were impressed to see dirt still being turned at all here. I think the government led projects will maintain interest in downtown and interest will beget momentum to a degree. Stabilizing of land prices via economic meltdown may allow stuff other than skyscrapers and "high" end condos to stand a chance (3 story middle class row homes or apartments say...). I think its noteworthy that Boylan Bridge Brewpub, Remedy Diner and Foundation all opened within the same week and are doing quite well from what I can tell.

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orulz City

orulz

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Site plan here. 203 units. They're calling it "Link Apartments." They are planning a Leasing office and fitness center at ground level along West, and apartment units at ground level along Jones and Harrington. I kind of like the idea of ground level units in this neighborhood.

 

If anyone is distraught at the proliferation of mid-rises and lack of high rises, take heart:

 

If the entirity of Glenwood South were to get developed as a midrise residential district with mostly 5-8 story buildings, that would yield some pretty fantastic density. This building, for example, is 160 units per acre. Some of the units are 2-bedroom so that could easily add up to 200+ people per acre. But then you have to account for things like streets, parks, historic buildings that can't/shouldn't be redeveloped. So conservatively, figure on 100+ people per acre, or 64,000+ people per square mile. (For reference, the average density of Manhattan is about 66,000 people per square mile.)

 

I estimate that Glenwood South is about 200 acres. At that density, it would be a neighborhood of 20,000 people. We're a long way from that at the moment, but you have to believe that's the way we're headed. As more people move in, more amenities will follow, making the neighborhood even more attractive. Under the adage of "Retail follows rooftops", 20,000 people can support a lot of urban amenities.

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Green_man Hamlet

Green_man

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Orulz, one thing to add to your density & building height discussion:  I would prefer that a neighborhood such as Glenwood South develop mainly mid-rise buildings as you suggest - especially since this is in line with the existing neighborhood and adequately matches the perceived demand.  And then, once you have an area with about a dozen mid-rises (and the amenities that will follow), then the demand should increase and with the remaining land available you would likely see 10-15 story developments based on that increased demand.  This is a much more organic development pattern than say 1 developer constructing a 20 story building based on wild speculation and then having it sit half empty - which would also hurt other projects getting off the ground. 

 

Also, if we get to 20,000 residents in Glenwood South I really hope there is a reliable transit system in place by then.

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