Park Avenue

[thewizard16]

IMO, $22 Million was wayyyyy to much just for a Target. Not that I don't love Target, but 22 Mill?

I just cant believe we haven't heard anything out of the developer about the property. Its been a year or 2 and nothing on it. The way things are shaping up, i wouldn't hold much to this place anymore.

Not trying to be a debby downer, but this had so much potential. To bad its turned out like this. Wish I was wrong, but this is looking to be another wasted opportunity in little rock. But I guess patients is a good thing.

I'm concerned about the future of this center too. In my opinion, a 1 story Target and so much surface parking pretty much doomed what the development of that site could have been. That said however, the Target there seems to be doing very well and brings in a lot of traffic so it could be a real asset when it comes time to lease commercial space. I think the choice to put 1 story buildings along University and only a 2 story building in Retail/Rest. B is a very short-sighted decision and a major missed opportunity. They paid quite a bit for this property and had an opportunity to completely reshape the midtown Little Rock retail, dining, entertainment and maybe even residential scene and it looks like they're going to give up that chance just in order to get some sort of development underway there. I wish they still had a more solid plan for an entertainment destination with the development and I really wish they'd put a decent sized hotel as a priority for the project (I think that could have made surrounding retail and office space even more appealing and possibly helped drive future redevelopment in the area), but it doesn't look like either of those things are likely now. I still think Strode is a great company and I am optimistic that if anyone can pull this now watered-down plan off in a cohesive way they can, but as a resident of this part of town it is certainly disappointing. Unless a number of other large buildings near Park Avenue (Plaza Towers, the Baker Building, and the old Mall Office building or the Doctor's Building and Sears) are leveled at some point in the future, I don't think there will be another opportunity to redevelop that corridor in any significant way for decades to come, and I just don't think this will be enough.

[Architect]

I'm concerned about the future of this center too. In my opinion, a 1 story Target and so much surface parking pretty much doomed what the development of that site could have been. That said however, the Target there seems to be doing very well and brings in a lot of traffic so it could be a real asset when it comes time to lease commercial space. I think the choice to put 1 story buildings along University and only a 2 story building in Retail/Rest. B is a very short-sighted decision and a major missed opportunity. They paid quite a bit for this property and had an opportunity to completely reshape the midtown Little Rock retail, dining, entertainment and maybe even residential scene and it looks like they're going to give up that chance just in order to get some sort of development underway there. I wish they still had a more solid plan for an entertainment destination with the development and I really wish they'd put a decent sized hotel as a priority for the project (I think that could have made surrounding retail and office space even more appealing and possibly helped drive future redevelopment in the area), but it doesn't look like either of those things are likely now. I still think Strode is a great company and I am optimistic that if anyone can pull this now watered-down plan off in a cohesive way they can, but as a resident of this part of town it is certainly disappointing. Unless a number of other large buildings near Park Avenue (Plaza Towers, the Baker Building, and the old Mall Office building or the Doctor's Building and Sears) are leveled at some point in the future, I don't think there will be another opportunity to redevelop that corridor in any significant way for decades to come, and I just don't think this will be enough.

I completely agree that they're not exactly pushing the envelope here. I'll give them credit for maintaining the mid-rise density of the mixed-use buildings forming the retail "street", but otherwise it's pretty watered down. I don't see ANY reason why they don't maintain the hotel and entertainment options, which are CLEARLY lacking in mid-town and would unquestionably be a huge draw. See Branson Landing as an example of retail below upper level 5-6 story hotel/residences. There is NO reason why this couldn't break a new mold here in Little Rock. None whatsoever.

That being said, I think locating the "big box" at the rear of the site was the right thing to do. However...I am dumbfounded why the retail "street" (or any structure for that matter) is not fully located and taking advantage of the existing parking structure on the west end! Why in the world would they not front the structure completely across! Sheesh.

[thewizard16]

I completely agree that they're not exactly pushing the envelope here. I'll give them credit for maintaining the mid-rise density of the mixed-use buildings forming the retail "street", but otherwise it's pretty watered down. I don't see ANY reason why they don't maintain the hotel and entertainment options, which are CLEARLY lacking in mid-town and would unquestionably be a huge draw. See Branson Landing as an example of retail below upper level 5-6 story hotel/residences. There is NO reason why this couldn't break a new mold here in Little Rock. None whatsoever.

That being said, I think locating the "big box" at the rear of the site was the right thing to do. However...I am dumbfounded why the retail "street" (or any structure for that matter) is not fully located and taking advantage of the existing parking structure on the west end! Why in the world would they not front the structure completely across! Sheesh.

I very much agree with what you're saying. I hadn't thought about Branson Landing as a possibly comparable project that would be a good example to consider when building Park Avenue, but I actually think that could work very well at the Park Avenue site (just a bit smaller footprint of course) too. As a current Hillcrest resident (and don't get me wrong, I love Hillcrest) there's nothing in the line of large-scale entertainment here. I firmly believe that a small, high quality movie theater or even a trendy bowling alley/entertainment venue would do extremely well in the Park Avenue location. Actually, both of these types of venues are lacking in the Little Rock region as a whole, not just midtown. For a bowling or entertainment venue, I'd encourage the developers to consider Flamingo Bowl in St. Louis or even Fast Lane in Rogers as good examples of what could do very well in Little Rock that absolutely does not yet exist here. For a unique movie theater (Little Rock already has plenty of regular movie theaters, a decent IMAX, and a very nice techy movie theater with the Rave) they could look at the Moolah Theater and Lounge in St. Louis (a fantastic example of a movie theater, bar, and loft apartment project) or the Main Street 6 in Kansas City as top-notch examples of smaller theaters that hit a completely different niche and target market than the existing Little Rock theaters. There's no where you can enjoy a drink, or in the case of the Main St. 6, a dinner and a drink, and sit on a leather loveseat or couch and watch a box office movie in Little Rock, and I think it would really appeal to the Hillcrest/Heights/Midtown and even the downtown residents.

I also wondered after seeing the overlay why they're not hiding that old parking deck better. It's small and it's not attractive, so it seems like they could have easily put single story retail against the first level of the deck with offices or apartments above the retail rising above the second floor of the deck to hide it more effectively. Anyone with Strode contacts should be guilting those guys right now to either put some more thought into the hotel and entertainment aspects of this center (otherwise I fail to see it being a very successful addition to their presence in Little Rock, honestly) or even holding off on construction until they're able to do it right. I feel the market in Little Rock is still strong enough to support it as originally planned (there is plenty of retail and some types of office vacancy in the region overall right now, but look at vacancy rates at Park Plaza, Hillcrest & the Heights rental properties, and high quality office space in those areas as a sign for the strength of that area's draw), but I would admit that they would probably have to do it a bit more gradually than they seem to want to develop the watered-down alternative now.

[LIT uPP]

Strode expects to begin work on the next phase of Park Avenue in May or June, according to a small article in yesterday’s Arkansas Democrat-Gazette. I had previously heard from a fairly reliable source that additional retail/restaurant space would be available for rent by the end of this year.

The same article mentioned that the Midtown Redevelopment District Advisory Board approved the construction of the retro-style McDonald’s, which will rise at the location of the old Bennigan’s.

[Architect]

Glad to hear about both! Excited to see a McDonalds return to midtown. We love their breakfast!

[ecity3138]

I am glad that construction will begin on the second phase of Park Avenue. However, I am still upset on how the development will turn out. I do agree that there should be more entertainment options at the center and more retail/ restaurants. A nice upscale movie theater such as Studio Movie Grill or Alamo Drafthouse (both based in Texas) and a Dave and Buster would work well for this development. As for retail/restaurants, I think they should demolish the mall office building and add more space available for more retail. This development have potential to be a major destination for this area of a city but I don't see that based on the current plan.

[Architect]

Agreed. However, what "mall office building" are you referring to?

[Arkanzin]

Agreed. However, what "mall office building" are you referring to?

I think there are two buildings near the corner of Markham and University. I believe one of those is called the "Mall Office Building." I think it is the one behind the site of the old Bennigans. The other is directly on the corner of Markham and University but I think it's called the Baker Building. I'm certain he's referring to one of those two.

[LRguy21]

IMO, The ideal situation would be to take the entire block and redevelop it! But that wont happen.

Maybe there is a light at the end of the tunnel. At least were seeing some work on the development. Maybe strode will leave room for a movie theater or other entertainment venue. Would be nice to see the Midtown Redevelopment District uphold to some sort of standards. Until they look at the bigger, this will be a second rate development in a PRIME location.

Any Idea of the proposed hotel? Hilton Garden Inn, another Courtyard? Dream would be for a Westin.

Would still love to see this whole Midtown District marked as the premier shopping district in Arkansas.

[Architect]

Cheddar's has applied for a plumbing permit.

[thewizard16]

I've been to Target a couple times in the last few days and noticed they are doing dirt work on the front lots to the immediate right and far left of the main entrance. Does anyone know for sure what these are? I assumed they were probably the restaurant sites (Cheddar's and Panera) getting underway, but thought someone might be able to verify that. Cheddar's plumbing permit was filed and approved for 400 S. University, but I'm not sure which corner that is.

[ryanaw]

I believe Cheddar's is being built closer to Target. The other spot to the far left I believe to be Panera. Finally, there is some work actually happening. Maybe this is a sign that more stores, restaurants and other developments will begin to erect.

[adman0468]

I believe Cheddar's is being built closer to Target. The other spot to the far left I believe to be Panera. Finally, there is some work actually happening. Maybe this is a sign that more stores, restaurants and other developments will begin to erect.

According to plumbing permits, AT&T is opening a store there. Maybe it will attract more stores, although that didn't seem to work at Shackleford Crossing.

[Architect]

According to plumbing permits, AT&T is opening a store there. Maybe it will attract more stores, although that didn't seem to work at Shackleford Crossing.

Interesting. The question is where? Stand-alone? I wasn't aware that they were proceeding with any of their retail buildings yet.

[adman0468]

Interesting. The question is where? Stand-alone? I wasn't aware that they were proceeding with any of their retail buildings yet.

I wondered the same thing. In my mind, I picture them in a strip of stores similar to the SC one. If that were true, then it would be construction we weren't aware of. I don't really see them in a free-standing building, but anything is possible since the center is a clean slate right now.

[comreguy]

I wondered the same thing. In my mind, I picture them in a strip of stores similar to the SC one. If that were true, then it would be construction we weren't aware of. I don't really see them in a free-standing building, but anything is possible since the center is a clean slate right now.

I would venture to guess that they will located in a wing adjacent to Target, as they plan some mid-sized boxes and smaller shop retail there.

[LR501]

The Park Avenue website lists four stores including Target, and coming soon-Cheddar's, AT&T, and Staples.

[LIT uPP]

The Park Avenue website lists four stores including Target, and coming soon-Cheddar's, AT&T, and Staples.

The Park Avenue site plan (if it is to be believed) gives additional information – not only about the location of these retailers, but of other retailers not listed under “Coming Soon.” Two retail spaces to the east of Target, the site plan shows a Carter’s Children’s Clothing Store (in the same family as OshKosh B’Gosh), and Staples is shown immediately to the east of Carter’s. Across a driveway and to the east of Staples is another set of retailers that apparently could include a Verizon Store, a Mattress Firm, and a Sport Clips. To the east of that retail node, in the free-standing space at the corner of University and Saint Vincent Circle is the Cheddar’s. The AT&T Store appears to be going into the northern-most free standing space along University. Too bad they couldn’t lure a nice restaurant there. The only other business noted on the site plan is LA Fitness in the northeastern quadrant of the “Main Street” section.

While I am increasingly under-whelmed by this project, I still hold out hope that Strode may be able to lure at least one more new-to-the-market retailer – and one that creates some buzz about this place. Right now, no one I talk with seems excited about it. Unlike Park Plaza and MidTowne, it appears that Park Avenue is being positioned as more of a neighborhood destination, instead of as a city/metro/regional destination.

[ecity3138]

The Park Avenue site plan (if it is to be believed) gives additional information – not only about the location of these retailers, but of other retailers not listed under “Coming Soon.” Two retail spaces to the east of Target, the site plan shows a Carter’s

Children’s Clothing Store (in the same family as OshKosh B’Gosh), and Staples is shown

immediately to the east of Carter’s. Across a driveway and to the east of Staples is another set of retailers that apparently could include a Verizon Store, a Mattress Firm, and a Sport Clips. To the east of that retail node, in the free-standing space at the corner of University and Saint Vincent Circle is the Cheddar’s. The AT&T Store appears to be going into the northern-most free standing space along University. Too bad they couldn’t lure a nice restaurant there. The only other business noted on the site plan is LA Fitness in the northeastern quadrant of the “Main Street” section.

While I am increasingly under-whelmed by this project, I still hold out hope that Strode may be able to lure at least one more new-to-the-market retailer – and one that creates some buzz about this place. Right now, no one I talk with seems excited about it. Unlike Park Plaza and MidTowne, it appears that Park Avenue is being positioned as more of a neighborhood destination, instead of as a city/metro/regional destination.

This development is a huge disappointment to the city. Instead of Strode turning the center into a destination retail/ restaurant/ entertainment center, he filling it with junk stores that are unwelcome here. I'm not excited to see another AT&T store, Verizon, etc. I'm also hoping that he could land some stores that are new to the market (like Red did with the Promenade At Chenal). So far, only one full service restaurant (Cheddar's) will be in this center. They should include restaurants like the Melting Pot, Chili's or Friday's, or a California Pizza Kitchen.

[comreguy]

This development is a huge disappointment to the city. Instead of Strode turning the center into a destination retail/ restaurant/ entertainment center, he filling it with junk stores that are unwelcome here. I'm not excited to see another AT&T store, Verizon, etc. I'm also hoping that he could land some stores that are new to the market (like Red did with the Promenade At Chenal). So far, only one full service restaurant (Cheddar's) will be in this center. They should include restaurants like the Melting Pot, Chili's or Friday's, or a California Pizza Kitchen.

Cheddars, Fridays and Chilis are almost identical concepts and Cheddars is a clear step above Fridays and Chilis. Not sure why adding Chilis to the lineup would be better for "the city". LA Fitness will have their first Arkansas location here, which is good for that area. It will also be an amenity to the housing/office portions of the development when they move forward with that phase.

Not sure what everyone thought this development was going to be, but it was always planned to be a Target anchored center. Look at other Targets across the country and tell me who is next to them. Basically, the same lineup you see at Park Avenue...

[ecity3138]

Cheddars, Fridays and Chilis are almost identical concepts and Cheddars is a clear step above Fridays and Chilis. Not sure why adding Chilis to the lineup would be better for "the city". LA Fitness will have their first Arkansas location here, which is good for that area. It will also be an amenity to the housing/office portions of the development when they move forward with that phase.

Not sure what everyone thought this development was going to be, but it was always planned to be a Target anchored center. Look at other Targets across the country and tell me who is next to them. Basically, the same lineup you see at Park Avenue...

Not true. I just came back from Frisco, Tx which is a suburb north of Dallas and saw many Targets in shopping centers that similar to the Park Avenue development. They have stores like Ross, In and Out Burger (similar to Five Guys) and other stores that are not current in this market. I agree, however, that Cheddar's is much better than restaurants such as Chili's or Friday's in terms of food quality and service. I still think that the shopping center should include a nice restaurant (Melting Pot), a movie theater, or entertainment options like Dave and Buster.

[comreguy]

Not true. I just came back from Frisco, Tx which is a suburb north of Dallas and saw many Targets in shopping centers that similar to the Park Avenue development. They have stores like Ross, In and Out Burger (similar to Five Guys) and other stores that are not current in this market. I agree, however, that Cheddar's is much better than restaurants such as Chili's or Friday's in terms of food quality and service. I still think that the shopping center should include a nice restaurant (Melting Pot), a movie theater, or entertainment options like Dave and Buster.

Dallas is 30 times larger than Little Rock and Frisco has a median income for the entire 100,000 plus population of over $100,000. It is not comparable to Little Rock in any way. Dave and Buster's requires a minimum 2 million people in their market and density that doesn't exist in Arkansas. Ross is similar to TJ Maxx and is certainly not upscale. In and Out Burger is only entering signifcant metro areas and Little Rock won't be on their radar. Melting Pot requires a franchisee.

The Park Avenue development is going to be a very good and long term development with quality national retailers. Little Rock just isn't a large enough market to support mulitple retail developments with high end retailers. Chenal will have the Apples and J Crews of the world and Park Avenue will have tenants that are more typically associated with Target developments in mid-sized Southeast Markets. Think Jackson, Tuscaloosa, Montgomery, Columbia, etc.

People just need to be realistic in viewing what this project will become. It is great for the market and the stores will all perform.

[Architect]

Dallas is 30 times larger than Little Rock and Frisco has a median income for the entire 100,000 plus population of over $100,000. It is not comparable to Little Rock in any way. Dave and Buster's requires a minimum 2 million people in their market and density that doesn't exist in Arkansas. Ross is similar to TJ Maxx and is certainly not upscale. In and Out Burger is only entering signifcant metro areas and Little Rock won't be on their radar. Melting Pot requires a franchisee.

The Park Avenue development is going to be a very good and long term development with quality national retailers. Little Rock just isn't a large enough market to support mulitple retail developments with high end retailers. Chenal will have the Apples and J Crews of the world and Park Avenue will have tenants that are more typically associated with Target developments in mid-sized Southeast Markets. Think Jackson, Tuscaloosa, Montgomery, Columbia, etc.

People just need to be realistic in viewing what this project will become. It is great for the market and the stores will all perform.

While your point is completely valid either way (and I agree with you), technically, your data is skewed. In no way is Dallas "30 times" the size of Little Rock. Pointing out that it's larger than the whole state is usually effective, but 700,000 versus 4,000,000 is about six. And of course, that's still huge. Also, Tulsa has a D&B, and it's not anywhere close to 2.0M...in fact, it's not even 1.0M as of the 2010 census. D&B has long been rumored for Little Rock, and it is a valid consideration especially given the fact that the chain had it's roots here.

[comreguy]

While your point is completely valid either way (and I agree with you), technically, your data is skewed. In no way is Dallas "30 times" the size of Little Rock. Pointing out that it's larger than the whole state is usually effective, but 700,000 versus 4,000,000 is about six. And of course, that's still huge. Also, Tulsa has a D&B, and it's not anywhere close to 2.0M...in fact, it's not even 1.0M as of the 2010 census. D&B has long been rumored for Little Rock, and it is a valid consideration especially given the fact that the chain had it's roots here.

I stand corrected on D&Bs and was only regurgitating what they told me when i contacted them. I obviously was exaggerating the population of Dallas. But, I'm glad you saw my point.

[ecity3138]

Dallas is 30 times larger than Little Rock and Frisco has a median income for the entire 100,000 plus population of over $100,000. It is not comparable to Little Rock in any way. Dave and Buster's requires a minimum 2 million people in their market and density that doesn't exist in Arkansas. Ross is similar to TJ Maxx and is certainly not upscale. In and Out Burger is only entering signifcant metro areas and Little Rock won't be on their radar. Melting Pot requires a franchisee.

I agree. I'm not say it have to be an upscale shopping center, but it should a decent selection of tenants. Ross is going in near Burlington Coat Factory and I'm not comparing Little Rock to Frisco. I'm just pointing out that Target does not always be in shopping center that less upscale. I'm still saying that an entertainment (does not have to be in Dave and Buster) like a movie theater would be good addition to the center.

The Park Avenue development is going to be a very good and long term development with quality national retailers. Little Rock just isn't a large enough market to support mulitple retail developments with high end retailers. Chenal will have the Apples and J Crews of the world and Park Avenue will have tenants that are more typically associated with Target developments in mid-sized Southeast Markets. Think Jackson, Tuscaloosa, Montgomery, Columbia, etc.

People just need to be realistic in viewing what this project will become. It is great for the market and the stores will all perform.