Town Point Park Facelift...

[brikkman]

I was thinking that with the new stage setup, adding seating and a large screen monitor for viewing football games in the winter, with vendors, might help bring people to the park. Kind of like an outdoor sports bar. Screens are set up outside Fedex Field in DC and Wimbleton in ole' London, so the same concept could be used. I'm convinced when the weather is good, big crowds would show up to see their favorite pro and college teams.

Good idea if they can find a way to block the wind. I do not mind doing something like that in the cold but not if the wind is howling off the water at me.

[Sky06]

I can't remember if this was reported or not, but the 09 budget covers installation of an electronic message board at Nauticus, primarily to inform about Town Point Park events. Project total funds reduced from $29M to $11.5M.

[7citiesVA]

So an article in the pilot today about Towne Point Park states that the park will be closing on Oct. 20, the day after the Virginia Wine festival, and will reopen next July 3 for Harborbest.

I find it funny that the makeover of the park will conveniently be done in time for Harborfest, but not a week or two earlier so that AFRAM Fest can hold its festivities in the park like it has done on Memorial Day Weekend for the last 25 years. Must be a coincidence seeing as how some downtown residents had a few complaints on AFRAM this year about profanity and what not.

Or maybe they want the "Harborfest crowd" to have first dibs at the newly renovated park. What do you think?

[br0guy]

So an article in the pilot today about Towne Point Park states that the park will be closing on Oct. 20, the day after the Virginia Wine festival, and will reopen next July 3 for Harborbest.

I find it funny that the makeover of the park will conveniently be done in time for Harborfest, but not a week or two earlier so that AFRAM Fest can hold its festivities in the park like it has done on Memorial Day Weekend for the last 25 years. Must be a coincidence seeing as how some downtown residents had a few complaints on AFRAM this year about profanity and what not.

Or maybe they want the "Harborfest crowd" to have first dibs at the newly renovated park. What do you think?

I just read the article and thought the same thing... how convenient

Afram is during Memorial Day weekend (typically the start of vacation/tourist season)... and there's no way the park could be done in time, hmmmm. I guess that old money in Freemason still has power.

[rusthebuss]

I just read the article and thought the same thing... how convenient

Afram is during Memorial Day weekend (typically the start of vacation/tourist season)... and there's no way the park could be done in time, hmmmm. I guess that old money in Freemason still has power.

I imagine if that was the case the racist aka Riddick would have said something by now.

[cpeakesqr]

I just read the article and thought the same thing... how convenient

Afram is during Memorial Day weekend (typically the start of vacation/tourist season)... and there's no way the park could be done in time, hmmmm. I guess that old money in Freemason still has power.

I think you're both reaching... Is there a rule that says AFRAM has to be Memorial Day weekend?

[spiker3]

There's a picture now on the article

Norfolk Gets Personal in Plans to Prettify the City

my browser isn't working right, can anyone rip and post that picture?

[okinawatyphoon]

Here it is. I like it, but there aren't quite enough trees for me.

[Glassoul]

Here it is. I like it, but there aren't quite enough trees for me.

Considering it has to hold tens of thousand of people simultaneously, vendors, and host concerts (sight lines), the number of trees and their placement seems correct to me.

[brikkman]

Only change I really see in that picture is the relocation of the stage and added tree's. HOw much did this facelift cost again?

[7citiesVA]

I think you're both reaching... Is there a rule that says AFRAM has to be Memorial Day weekend?

No there is no rule that says that AFRAM has to be Memorial Day weekend. But it has been that way for the past 25 years. I guess you can say its a tradition and staple of the Afram fest. I would look at it differently if Harborfest was a month or two after Afram, but it is literally a week (or 2) after.

Is it not odd to you that the park will be done in time for Harbor Fest, but cant be done a week earlier for AFRAM? Why should one event be altered by the parks renovation? Why not finish in a timely manner so that all events may go as regularly scheduled? Even if they reschedule AFRAM to a later date, that goes back to my point where they want the Harbor fest crowd to be the first ones to experience the new park. I wonder if it was Harbor Fest that was initially held on Memorial Day weekend for over so many years, would they have the park done in time for it so that the event could be held on its traditional date.

And no I am not saying that this is a racial thing and no I am not trying to pull that "race card", but it does seem a little funny to me. That is all.

[cpeakesqr]

No there is no rule that says that AFRAM has to be Memorial Day weekend. But it has been that way for the past 25 years. I guess you can say its a tradition and staple of the Afram fest. I would look at it differently if Harborfest was a month or two after Afram, but it is literally a week (or 2) after.

Is it not odd to you that the park will be done in time for Harbor Fest, but cant be done a week earlier for AFRAM? Why should one event be altered by the parks renovation? Why not finish in a timely manner so that all events may go as regularly scheduled?

I guess your line of thinking is that the city told the construction company they want the renovations done in time for Harborfest. I don't know exactly how much work is going into the project, so I don't know, nor do you, what would be considered a timely manner. I believe the companies would tell the city we need this much time to do the work, and the city would say ok... not the other way around.

Why should one event be altered by the park's renovation?

That's like saying, why should one person move in the new building a week before it's finished? The answer is obvious.

I think you should wait and see what happens before jumping to conclusions that, whether you mean to or not, bring up racial issues. Saying the city wants the Harborfest crowd to use it first, is just like saying the city doesn't want the Afram crowd using it first. The bottom line is, you, I and everyone else who don't know the specifics are speaking from a position of ignorance, and that can't be wise, especially with the implications of racial bias.

[lil-bear]

Only change I really see in that picture is the relocation of the stage and added tree's. HOw much did this facelift cost again?

They will also replace all the walkways with brick pavers because many of the paths in the park are black top.

They will also install new light poles and fountains.

I'm sure that the plan to update the park is more detailed than what is seen in the rendering.

[7citiesVA]

I guess your line of thinking is that the city told the construction company they want the renovations done in time for Harborfest. I don't know exactly how much work is going into the project, so I don't know, nor do you, what would be considered a timely manner. I believe the companies would tell the city we need this much time to do the work, and the city would say ok... not the other way around.

That's like saying, why should one person move in the new building a week before it's finished? The answer is obvious.

I think you should wait and see what happens before jumping to conclusions that, whether you mean to or not, bring up racial issues. Saying the city wants the Harborfest crowd to use it first, is just like saying the city doesn't want the Afram crowd using it first. The bottom line is, you, I and everyone else who don't know the specifics are speaking from a position of ignorance, and that can't be wise, especially with the implications of racial bias.

Time will tell as far as how this whole thing will play out. Im not jumping to any conclusions. I just really find it hard to believe that there just so happens to be a "coincidence" that the park will be done in time for Harbor Fest. I am just calling it how I see it. I do not know the specifics though as you say so I guess I am speaking from a position of ignorance. And honestly I hope I am wrong in my little conspiracy theory because if not that would truly be sad and petty on behalf of the city.

[reggie3]

No there is no rule that says that AFRAM has to be Memorial Day weekend. But it has been that way for the past 25 years. I guess you can say its a tradition and staple of the Afram fest. I would look at it differently if Harborfest was a month or two after Afram, but it is literally a week (or 2) after.

Is it not odd to you that the park will be done in time for Harbor Fest, but cant be done a week earlier for AFRAM? Why should one event be altered by the parks renovation? Why not finish in a timely manner so that all events may go as regularly scheduled? Even if they reschedule AFRAM to a later date, that goes back to my point where they want the Harbor fest crowd to be the first ones to experience the new park. I wonder if it was Harbor Fest that was initially held on Memorial Day weekend for over so many years, would they have the park done in time for it so that the event could be held on its traditional date.

And no I am not saying that this is a racial thing and no I am not trying to pull that "race card", but it does seem a little funny to me. That is all.

According to the Festevents website http://www.festeventsva.org/events.php Harborfest was June 6-9th this year, so they are moving Harborfest to a later date to accommodate the renovation. Other events that will either have to move or skip next year in additon to the AFRAM fest are the Wine Festival, Beer Festival, and the Bayou Boogaloo.

Harborfest draws the biggest crowd and would be the largest (existing) showcase for the improvements so it would make sense that it would open the park. Plus, the Harborfest fireworks would double as the 4th of July fireworks.

[urbanfan]

According to the Festevents website http://www.festeventsva.org/events.php Harborfest was June 6-9th this year, so they are moving Harborfest to a later date to accommodate the renovation. Other events that will either have to move or skip next year in additon to the AFRAM fest are the Wine Festival, Beer Festival, and the Bayou Boogaloo.

Harborfest draws the biggest crowd and would be the largest (existing) showcase for the improvements so it would make sense that it would open the park. Plus, the Harborfest fireworks would double as the 4th of July fireworks.

Good point on the fireworks. Should be pretty awesome considering they only will do one set of fireworks next year. Coupled with the lack of 4th fireworks this year.

[7citiesVA]

Other events that will either have to move or skip next year in additon to the AFRAM fest are the Wine Festival, Beer Festival, and the Bayou Boogaloo.

Harborfest draws the biggest crowd and would be the largest (existing) showcase for the improvements so it would make sense that it would open the park.

Yeah I guess it would only be right for Harborfest to open the park in the sense of it drawing the largest crowd. I can agree with that.

(etc. - AFRAM draws a large crowd also, not as big as Harborfest, but way larger than the other festivals mentioned.)

[virginia pe]

I guess your line of thinking is that the city told the construction company they want the renovations done in time for Harborfest. I don't know exactly how much work is going into the project, so I don't know, nor do you, what would be considered a timely manner. I believe the companies would tell the city we need this much time to do the work, and the city would say ok... not the other way around.

Typically, the bid documents stipulate the construction time. The construction time is established by the project engineer, in consultation with the owner. Often, it is not much more than a "seat-of-the-pants" guess. If the owner has a particular need to open the facility by a certain date, that date can be included in the contract requirements. The bidders can add $$ to their bid to cover the extra costs of early completion if they feel they will incur any costs (overtime, extra manpower and equipment, etc.) to meet the owner's date.

In rare cases, the bid documents allow the contractor to include the construction time as part of his bid, but that makes it very hard to compare competing bids.

[lil-bear]

TPP to close

I think it's sad that the first poster on PilotOnline has to make it a racial issue.

Here is my take on the issue:

Harborfest is the biggest and most profitable of all the festivals that is held at TPP.

Fireworks are displayed during Harborfest and on Independence Day.

So since TTP won't be completed until the end of June, why not move Harborfest back a few weeks, combine Harborfest and 4th of July fireworks to save money and attempt to relocate any other affected festivals if possible.

Sounds sensible to me, not an attempt to slight a percentage of the population.

[br0guy]

TPP to close

I think it's sad that the first poster on PilotOnline has to make it a racial issue.

Here is my take on the issue:

Harborfest is the biggest and most profitable of all the festivals that is held at TPP.

Fireworks are displayed during Harborfest and on Independence Day.

So since TTP won't be completed until the end of June, why not move Harborfest back a few weeks, combine Harborfest and 4th of July fireworks to save money and attempt to relocate any other affected festivals if possible.

Sounds sensible to me, not an attempt to slight a percentage of the population.

Why do you think its sad? There is some truth in the posters comment, and just like a lot of social issues and decisions that are made to impact the community there is a racial element.

[brikkman]

I do not really care honestly, I'm just upset that it is not worth waiting for...New toilets trees and walk ways aren't much to look forward to. It seems like they are trying to keep it from looking ghetto if anything!! For the last 20+ years, there have only been anchors and propellers to pose next to, now they will be able to take the same pictures in a new location within the park. They should have taken that money and revamped Lafayette/CITY Park to match the zoo.

[lil-bear]

Why do you think its sad? There is some truth in the posters comment, and just like a lot of social issues and decisions that are made to impact the community there is a racial element.

What truth, if the city had intentions on slighting any segment

of the population, there wouldn't have been any AfrAm fest in

the first place.

I don't know why there needs to be a segregating type event anyways.

I know that there are examples of racial inequality and mistreatment, but

everything does not have racial undertones within it!

Seems to me that there are people who try to find something in anything.

[br0guy]

What truth, if the city had intentions on slighting any segment

of the population, there wouldn't have been any AfrAm fest in

the first place.

I don't know why there needs to be a segregating type event anyways.

I know that there are examples of racial inequality and mistreatment, but

everything does not have racial undertones within it!

Seems to me that there are people who try to find something in anything.

Thats a BS come-back... Afram fest is segregated?. I think you mean predominently African-American. Using your rationale I can say Harborfest is segregated (wtf?)... and your right, everything doesn't have to have racial undertones to it, but it seems like when anybody does "pull the race card" (as its been termed) there is somebody there to just dismiss it, rather than ask why do you feel this way? Its barely been a full generation since the civil rights movement in this country... granted, we've made great strides since then, but you still have people who lived under those conditions in the 60s who are still very sensitive when it comes to topics such as this.

[br0guy]

I do not really care honestly, I'm just upset that it is not worth waiting for...New toilets trees and walk ways aren't much to look forward to. It seems like they are trying to keep it from looking ghetto if anything!! For the last 20+ years, there have only been anchors and propellers to pose next to, now they will be able to take the same pictures in a new location within the park. They should have taken that money and revamped Lafayette/CITY Park to match the zoo.

That would've been nice... If you look at older pictures of Lafayette/City Park it looked more inviting. It would be nice to have something like Audubon Park in New Orleans which is attached to the zoo as well.

[rusthebuss]

Thats a BS come-back... Afram fest is segregated?. I think you mean predominently African-American. Using your rationale I can say Harborfest is segregated (wtf?)... and your right, everything doesn't have to have racial undertones to it, but it seems like when anybody does "pull the race card" (as its been termed) there is somebody there to just dismiss it, rather than ask why do you feel this way? Its barely been a full generation since the civil rights movement in this country... granted, we've made great strides since then, but you still have people who lived under those conditions in the 60s who are still very sensitive when it comes to topics such as this.

That was in the 60s and this is in a new century. If African American(<<<<which i think is segregating in itself because that would only be true if you were born in Africa) can't move on then this issue will never correct itself. Thats with everything in life. Business decisions are not based on if its a racial issue but about revenue. I really don't think that the construction dates were set up to push Aframfest out. I do think that alot of people are just looking for reasons to throw the card out. If this country is ever going to heal it takes all sides to move forward and not hold on to the past, but learn from the past.