Charlotte's Light Rail: Lynx Blue Line

[southslider]

^Yep, 36th St won't open now until next year.

[CLTranspo]

I took the extension for the first time this weekend as well (just moved back to Charlotte from Denver). Made my dad come with me from concord as he usually would never take transit. We parked at Jay W Clay and used day passes but there wasn’t anyone checking fare/tickets anyway for parked cars to exit. The ticket machine had 20+ people waiting to use it so I was thankful for the app so we could skip the line. Train was pretty packed going in: standing room only.

I have to say compared to Denver, charlotte’s light rail vehicles are much more modern and comfortable. More accessible for bikers and handicapped people as well since every door has level boarding (in Denver you can only use a ramp to the first door for level boarding for handicapped access and you have to carry your bikes up a few stairs inside the vehicle). Of course Denver has many more light rail lines than us, but I am really proud of what Charlotte has accomplished so far and was impressed with the extension overall. 

The ride on the extension was pretty smooth! Not much unneeded stopping/starting or jerky movements, although I definitely picked up on the slower speeds around Old Concord and Sugar Creek where I think the trains will travel faster once all of the kinks are ironed out. Saw a few vehicles that had stopped past the cross bar and had it sitting on top of their hoods or roofs. Hopefully they won’t do that again  

We went all the way to Arrowood to look at the townhouses being built there, and then got off at New Bern on the way back in to check out a playground we had worked on in Sedgefield and grab lunch. I was only away in Denver for a year, but it’s been amazing and wonderful to see all the growth in Noda, uptown, south end, and a reciprocal dynamic emerging in Charlotte that wasn’t there before between transit and density. Here’s to hoping it only gets better from here! (Cough cough less parking structures and beige)

[Nick2]

I think if a car is sitting under the crossbar it should just repeatedly go up and down smacking their roof till it dents badly.

[Hushpuppy321]

I very much look forward to the expansion of Transit options in CLT but am very skeptical about the way forward with ballooning costs, lower and lower Federal funds and the NCGA not wanting to contribute.  Totally wish things were able to be established decades earlier but I guess that's water under the bridge.

[15895]

2 hours ago, Nick2 said:

I think if a car is sitting under the crossbar it should just repeatedly go up and down smacking their roof till it dents badly.

 

I think we should get Kermit to go throw bikes and pedestrians at them 

Edited June 11, 2018 by AirNostrumMAD

[videtur quam contuor]

I spent the first 18 years of my life in a city where rail grade crossings were everywhere, including my neighborhood. I spent many afternoons sitting in the car with my father waiting for a train to pass and occupying my time by counting cars, guessing cargo, leaving the car and walking to the front of the line of cars to look for the caboose, which was a common appendage at that time. As a child with time to burn it was no inconvenience and my father seemed inured to the delay. All other streets nearby heading in that direction would also be crossed by the same train and tracks. Respecting grade crossings was just what one did.

Signal intentions, park at the curb, stop well ahead of crossarms. Competence is underrated.

[15895]

Took a ride to UNCC today to pick up my diploma. When I rode regularly to UNCC up until May, old Concord barely had cars. Today driving past it was 1/2 full if not more.  CTCC is filling up the train and it’s just as busy on the extension as the regular side. 

(Though I’ll imagine it’s overwhelmigly more busy from uptown to 485 during rush hour)

[grodney]

Walking to the station yesterday, I saw the 3:33 southbound cross MLKJr  at 3:37....obviously a couple-three minutes behind schedule, since that street is less than a block from the station.  The next train (scheduled for 3:40) was at the station with doors open by 3:39.

There's no great ending to this story......just the note that 7.5 minute headways can turn into 3-minute headways pretty quickly if a driver has to slow down, has a to re-cycle the doors at a stop, is a crazy-braker, etc.  

 

[kermit]

New fare audit strategy (for me): G4S was checking everyone’s tickets and passes as they exited the platform at 7th this morning.

[Matthew.Brendan]

Yeah I’ve seen that once before at 3rd. Pretty annoying I’d say. 

[deleted]

1 hour ago, Matthew.Brendan said:

Yeah I’ve seen that once before at 3rd. Pretty annoying I’d say. 

I think it's great (though I also think that people below a certain income level should get free transit passes).

[15895]

I know some of you may disagree with me completely and think I’m a loser and why I would get worked up about this and I sort of agree with anyone who thinks that of me...

But I know myself and  I’m not getting off a train and going to fiddle around with farecheckers. At that point, I’m off the train leave me alone, I’m an adult, not a child. I’ll just throw my ticket in their direction and move on with my life.  I paid my service and I’m done and I’m leaving.

Checking my ticket on the train, I’m completely fine with. Exchange greetings and pleasantries and show them my valid ticket and give a big smile. Impeding my exit or wanting to hold me from going about my merry day, I’m irrationally triggered. 

I saw 2 farecheckers going through a black girls purse at the Carson station. I was sorta outraged even if she did something wrong they were going through her purse. Call the real cops. 

Edited June 21, 2018 by AirNostrumMAD

[CharlotteWkndBuzz]

9 minutes ago, AirNostrumMAD said:

I know some of you may disagree with me completely and think I’m a loser and why I would get worked up about this and I sort of agree with anyone who thinks that of me...

But I know myself and  I’m not getting off a train and going to fiddle around with farecheckers. At that point, I’m off the train leave me alone, I’m an adult, not a child. I’ll just throw my ticket in their direction and move on with my life.  I paid my service and I’m done and I’m leaving.

Checking my ticket on the train, I’m completely fine with. Exchange greetings and pleasantries and show them my valid ticket and give a big smile. Impeding my exit or wanting to hold me from going about my merry day, I’m irrationally triggered. 

I saw 2 farecheckers going through a black girls purse at the Carson station. I was sorta outraged even if she did something wrong they were going through her purse. Call the real cops. 

I understand your frustration, but I think you're technically still in the ticket "Fare Zone" when you get off the train (the perimeter etched out by lines).  Which probably gives the ticket people the right to check for people's valid tickets.  I personally haven't experienced it, but I've noticed that they usually are at the busy/popular stations waiting outside (7th street, CTC, Bland).  My take on it is...I rather have those random checks occurring, than no one ever checking for tickets (how it seemed for years).  I view it as a tactic to encourage riders to make sure to buy tickets and not station hop.

[deleted]

3 hours ago, JBS said:

I think it's great (though I also think that people below a certain income level should get free transit passes).

I get down-voted plenty and it never bothers me.  In this case, I'm just curious...are you against fare enforcement or against low income people riding for free?  Either is, I suppose, a reasonable position but just down-voting doesn't add to the conversation.

[cjd5050]

3 hours ago, AirNostrumMAD said:

I know some of you may disagree with me completely and think I’m a loser and why I would get worked up about this and I sort of agree with anyone who thinks that of me...

But I know myself and  I’m not getting off a train and going to fiddle around with farecheckers. At that point, I’m off the train leave me alone, I’m an adult, not a child. I’ll just throw my ticket in their direction and move on with my life.  I paid my service and I’m done and I’m leaving.

Checking my ticket on the train, I’m completely fine with. Exchange greetings and pleasantries and show them my valid ticket and give a big smile. Impeding my exit or wanting to hold me from going about my merry day, I’m irrationally triggered. 

I saw 2 farecheckers going through a black girls purse at the Carson station. I was sorta outraged even if she did something wrong they were going through her purse. Call the real cops. 

I get where you're coming from but not sure I agree.  

It's kinda like food.  You can pay in advance before you get your food, pay at the table while eating or pay at the register on the way out.  At the end of the day, you ate the food and owe the money.   It's not like you can go into Chick-Fil-A and say you want to pay after you have eaten.  

The problem, I think,  is that you're looking at this from the spectrum of someone who purchases a ticket even if nobody is checking.  That's not the world we live in sadly.  I'd much rather have riders burdened a bit if it ensures that the most revenue possible is captured.  ROI and all....

[Matthew.Brendan]

If capturing revenue is the goal, then enforce it consistently. These scatter shot random checks are nearly pointless. 

[cjd5050]

37 minutes ago, Matthew.Brendan said:

If capturing revenue is the goal, then enforce it consistently. These scatter shot random checks are nearly pointless. 

Not really.  It's like a speed trap.  

I know that when I drive to NY and when I go through VA there is more often than not troopers looking to bust speeding.  I also know that when I drive to NY and go through WV I hardly ever see a trooper.  Because of this I speed in WV and drive close to the limit in VA.  If people think there is a chance of a random ticket enforcement after they get off the train, unless they DGAF or are foolish, they are more likely to purchase a ticket.  

It's an enforcement mesh without full resource deployment.  

[HighRiseHillbilly]

4 hours ago, AirNostrumMAD said:

I know some of you may disagree with me completely and think I’m a loser and why I would get worked up about this and I sort of agree with anyone who thinks that of me...

But I know myself and  I’m not getting off a train and going to fiddle around with farecheckers. At that point, I’m off the train leave me alone, I’m an adult, not a child. I’ll just throw my ticket in their direction and move on with my life.  I paid my service and I’m done and I’m leaving.

Checking my ticket on the train, I’m completely fine with. Exchange greetings and pleasantries and show them my valid ticket and give a big smile. Impeding my exit or wanting to hold me from going about my merry day, I’m irrationally triggered. 

I saw 2 farecheckers going through a black girls purse at the Carson station. I was sorta outraged even if she did something wrong they were going through her purse. Call the real cops. 

Checking during the course of the ride is fine, but yes, don't stand there upon exit. People have places to go. 

Also, why were they going through a purse?

[15895]

9 minutes ago, HighRiseHillbilly said:

Checking during the course of the ride is fine, but yes, don't stand there upon exit. People have places to go. 

Also, why were they going through a purse?

They were digging through it. 2 farecheckers with the younger black female standing there. The train pulled off so I have no idea. 

[Hunted]

4 hours ago, JBS said:

I get down-voted plenty and it never bothers me.  In this case, I'm just curious...are you against fare enforcement or against low income people riding for free?  Either is, I suppose, a reasonable position but just down-voting doesn't add to the conversation.

This is how threads divert into something annoyingly political. The vast majority of poor people are perfectly able-bodied people who shouldn't find incentives and rewards in their status. These types of welfare programs serve as the opposite of motivating factors. Obviously there are disabled people who simply aren't able to work. You'd be surprised at how many people are on welfare who just straight up are unmotivated and don't look hard enough for employment. I lack sympathy for people like that. No, they shouldn't get free rides. 

 

Bring on the down votes. I'll leave it at that. 

Edit: For the record, I'm TOTALLY fine with people who meet certain criteria receiving free passes. Income status alone shouldn't qualify you. Bum ass people shouldn't be rewarded for being lazy. That is all.

Edited June 21, 2018 by Hunted

[Nick2]

Anyway...

Is it not possible to have a limited access to the train itself that requires a ticket to go through? Like the turnstiles on the NYC  subway. Forgive my ignorance if there is an obvious  reason that this wouldn't work. 

[CharlotteWkndBuzz]

12 hours ago, Nick2 said:

Anyway...

Is it not possible to have a limited access to the train itself that requires a ticket to go through? Like the turnstiles on the NYC  subway. Forgive my ignorance if there is an obvious  reason that this wouldn't work. 

I mentioned this a long time ago.  Forget what city but they did an experimental turnstile ticketing at one of their stations. Study found that ticket profits rose. But I just found this article which makes sense and applies to us:

https://m.soundtransit.org/blog/platform/why-doesnt-link-light-rail-use-turnstiles  

Edited June 22, 2018 by CharlotteWkndBuzz

[kermit]

15 hours ago, Nick2 said:

Anyway...

Is it not possible to have a limited access to the train itself that requires a ticket to go through? Like the turnstiles on the NYC  subway. Forgive my ignorance if there is an obvious  reason that this wouldn't work. 

The expense of controlled platforms is high, higher than the incremental revenue generated by better compliance. Also keep in mind that even when you have  6 ft tall turnstiles (e.g. Paris) fare evasion still exists. In addition, security people will continue to be needed even after controlling platforms are so they might as well check tickets while we are paying them to be there.

Beyond the financial folly of limiting platform access, it would be -really- difficult to seal our street level platforms. Since you can’t build a fence across the tracks evaders will always have a (dangerous) way to avoid fares by just walking along the tracks from the street to the platform.  You can see the impossibility of sealing grade-level station by considering the case of the streetcar.

A second non-financial problem with walls around the stations in the damage it would do to the neighborhoods around them. We can see clearly that having stations be part of public space is a really good thing (e.g. the rail trail). Walling stations off would make surrounding neighborhoods significantly crappier -- look at the MARTA stations along DeKalb avenue to get a sense for how bad transit station design can damage a neighborhood. Our freedom to move from platform to city is highly underrated — I have walked up to 7th street station and heard the ‘next train to... in 10 minutes’  announcement and realized I had time for a quick pint at Tank's Tap (I still made the train). That, and many other urban interactions, would be impossible with protected platforms. 

TLDR: turnstiles are bad  for urbanism and not worth the money. 

Edited June 22, 2018 by kermit

[Nick2]

Thanks for the explanations!

[videtur quam contuor]

To the excellent post by Kermit, I would preface his remarks with "In this climate..." Cities north of us may be required to have enclosed stations for climate reasons as well. Charlotte, less so. Rare indeed is the day an underground or controlled conditions station would be necessary here.