Charlotte's Light Rail: Lynx Blue Line

[Urbanity]

McCrory never threatened to withhold funding. That wouldn't be in his power to do anyway. He told Foxx there was a very real chance that the council's actions may result in the Legislature withholding funds. It wasn't a threat...I think it was a warning to be careful.

I agree with ajfunder that it certainly came across as a threat.  And while I agree that his position can't withhold funds arbitrarily - no one can make the argument looking at the Legislature the last few weeks to say that he is without power to influence legislation.

[dubone]

The "Green" line idea I think is very lame.   If they had thought of it before hand and did not have 5 years in people's heads as the Lynx Blue Line, they could have made the whole line the "Green" line (which actually would have been smart eco secondary meaning for this period of time that it is our only line.   It is also our city's logo's color.    But to rename the line after all this time, or alternately have the same line be two separate color designations is quite odd.

 

So woulda, coulda, shoulda but didn't, but now it seems like it's too late for that. 

[abttown]

Actually, changing the line name kind of fits in with all the freaking roads around the city that change names at arbitrary intersections. Why not continue to confuse the hell out of people?!

[jednc]

The "Green" line idea I think is very lame.   If they had thought of it before hand and did not have 5 years in people's heads as the Lynx Blue Line, they could have made the whole line the "Green" line (which actually would have been smart eco secondary meaning for this period of time that it is our only line.   It is also our city's logo's color.    But to rename the line after all this time, or alternately have the same line be two separate color designations is quite odd.

 

So woulda, coulda, shoulda but didn't, but now it seems like it's too late for that. 

 

I don't think very many people at all have the name BLE already stuck in their head. As a matter of fact, I'll bet most people in Charlotte couldn't even tell you that the current line is the Blue Line. Only those of us over-obsessed Urbanplanet readers, and the like, really know those designations (esp the BLE). I doubt even the people at CATS really care if it changes or not which is a much more likely reason they have told UNCC to feel free to ask the FTA. I'm in that camp as well...who cares? It's really not a big deal (although it would make sense if changed that it should begin at the CTC instead of 7th St).

[jednc]

I agree with ajfunder that it certainly came across as a threat.  And while I agree that his position can't withhold funds arbitrarily - no one can make the argument looking at the Legislature the last few weeks to say that he is without power to influence legislation.

I'm def. not trying to be difficult, but what legislation specifically has Gov. McCrory influenced over the last few weeks? I'm hoping the argument won't just be a listing of the things that the legislature have passed in the past couple of weeks without some evidence that McCrory pushed an unwilling legislature into doing something they were resistant to doing.

[15895]

I don't think very many people at all have the name BLE already stuck in their head. As a matter of fact, I'll bet most people in Charlotte couldn't even tell you that the current line is the Blue Line. Only those of us over-obsessed Urbanplanet readers, and the like, really know those designations (esp the BLE). I doubt even the people at CATS really care if it changes or not which is a much more likely reason they have told UNCC to feel free to ask the FTA. I'm in that camp as well...who cares? It's really not a big deal (although it would make sense if changed that it should begin at the CTC instead of 7th St).

I dont know. I think most people know its the blue line? Especially when we start getting more lines.

[Urbanity]

I'm def. not trying to be difficult, but what legislation specifically has Gov. McCrory influenced over the last few weeks? I'm hoping the argument won't just be a listing of the things that the legislature have passed in the past couple of weeks without some evidence that McCrory pushed an unwilling legislature into doing something they were resistant to doing.

 

You do know what the word "influence" means, correct?  It doesn't mean he sat in Dracula's castle rubbing his hands and laughing like Montgomery Burns while he dictated legislation, but no one can look at the last few months and say McCrory hasn't had influence over the legislature.    

 

Back on the Topic of the BLE most people saw his statements as a threat  which is why the media have played up that angle when he showed up for the official kick-off on construction.

Edited July 25, 2013 by Urbanity

[ah59396]

Don't look now, but our light rail extension has a twitter account!

 

@BLEupdates

 

 

Looks like they are posting photos, updates, et al.  Sweet.

[DEnd]

Don't look now, but our light rail extension has a twitter account!

 

@BLEupdates

 

 

Looks like they are posting photos, updates, et al.  Sweet.

 

The BLE became self aware before computers?  weird.

[kermit]

Some BLE ridership forecasting trivia for you:

 

The cost to park on campus at UNCC will be $450 this academic year ($150 more if you choose a gated lot). That cost alone would pay for 5.6 monthly passes at current rates.

[Urbanity]

Some BLE ridership forecasting trivia for you:

 

The cost to park on campus at UNCC will be $450 this academic year ($150 more if you choose a gated lot). That cost alone would pay for 5.6 monthly passes at current rates.

I'm going to play devils advocate a bit here with this but I disagree with your math in practical application.  Mainly because I don't think it is/will be on anyone's radar for a simple reason: it will still be a bit impractical.

 

Let me explain, there are two UNCC stops.  Both of which are on the fringes of campus.

 

The first is at by the CRI entrance (North Tryon) which is great if you take classes or work in Bioinformatics and Engineering or want to attend a sporting event (football, baseball, softball and track all close) but it's on the opposite side (of a very large) campus that also has a significant valley between the two sections (so significant the Campus Master Plan has proposed an eventual pedestrian bridge between the stadium and the Student Union Building) and thus not likely to be a major pull for those who drive if they work/take classes anywhere else on campus.

 

The second stop is behind the dorms which in my mind is catering to students who already live on campus (and thus have paid for their parking). Granted you can walk through the Dorm quad to the Student Union and then through the Union to the plaza that connects the Colleges of Education, Health and Human Services, and Computing and Informatics.

 

I also will say that most (sizeable majority?) of the commuter students live in student complexes that ring on Mallard Creek Church and University City Blvd - neither strip being served by stops.   

 

All that said - the campus does offer two free shuttles now that the University could leverage to aid getting people to leave the car at home, but they certainly need them to run more frequently/ have more shuttles in operation and tweak the routes as most people I know avoid them as they take longer than a walk across campus.

 

I hope I don't seem like a downer here, because in general - I think the Light Rail will be ENORMOUSLY popular and used by UNC Charlotte students - but I doubt that usage will be primarily for commuting to classes or the UNCC workforce or enough for most people to give up their parking passes. 

 

[ah59396]

Although the argument could be made, that a college student would be more apt to live in a place like NoDa if they have easy access to the campus via rail.

[Urbanity]

Although the argument could be made, that a college student would be more apt to live in a place like NoDa if they have easy access to the campus via rail.

Absolutely.  I am in full agreement with the idea of more people will commute to UNC Charlotte via mass transit in the future when it is light rail and not just busses - I just don't think it will be a seismic shift or that the majority who get parking passes/permits/gate cards will change. 

Edited July 31, 2013 by Urbanity

[kermit]

I didn't mean to predict a "seismic shift" in UNCC student / faculty commuting behavior. I did want to point out that parking on campus is now so expensive that it will encourage _many_ of the folks who find themselves on campus to consider alternative transport.

 

While I agree that the main campus stop is somewhat peripheral to the primary activity spaces on campus it is not significantly further than the distance that commuters must walk from the existing lots. Simply put there is no such thing as parking beside your building at UNCC, my walk from the station to my building is less than 200 ft further than the walk from where I normally park.

 

In my defense there are no errors in my math: The cost of parking on campus / the cost of a monthly CATS pass = 5.6. Once you factor in vehicle costs it becomes significantly cheaper to ride transit than drive to campus. This math means that I am one of the people who is eager to give up my campus parking permit and ride the BLE daily.

 

EDIT: four or five big bcycle stations around campus (it will _eventually_ be at one end of the cross county trail after all) would also change the getting to campus calculus.

Edited July 31, 2013 by kermit

[Urbanity]

Take me with a grain of salt, I'm a born kvetcher. 

[dubone]

Is UNCC getting B-Cycle stations, or are you just assuming that might happen?   It does seem like a no brainer, especially if the annual fees could be baked into student fees, although if everyone were eligible, there may be a shortage of bikes at stations.

[kermit]

Is UNCC getting B-Cycle stations, or are you just assuming that might happen?   It does seem like a no brainer, especially if the annual fees could be baked into student fees, although if everyone were eligible, there may be a shortage of bikes at stations.

I am just speculating. It seems like a logical place -if- campus is ever connected to the cross county trail as proposed. A robust bike share on campus would solve lots of circulation probs out there.

[birky]

I didn't mean to predict a "seismic shift" in UNCC student / faculty commuting behavior. I did want to point out that parking on campus is now so expensive that it will encourage _many_ of the folks who find themselves on campus to consider alternative transport.

 

As a UNCC staff member, I don't see it having a significant impact on faculty/staff commuting behavior. Most people who work at the University do not live on or near the current/future light rail corridor.

 

I think it will have a significant impact on students though. Although the proposed stop is currently located on the north side of campus, we may find that in closer to the center of campus in 20 or 30 years as the school continues to grow. Not to mention that with few exceptions, that stop is no more than 10-12 minutes from almost every academic building on the east side of campus. The only real exception would be the walk to the towers on 49.

[dubone]

Those types of impacts are usually longer term, where new staff/faculty will consider housing in NoDa or Dilworth or others because of the new commuting option.  The commute is considered heavily when moving, so I think that we will see some people planning for that just as people in DC try to find places near the Metro, and so on for other cities.   This is new infrastructure so it makes sense that it was not previously factored in, and now most are not in a place to use it readily.   Luckily, students often relocate each year of college and are more price sensitive and less likely to obtain good parking, so that much larger population is going to likely choose transit-oriented housing.

[Niner National]

I think we're going to see a lot of students parking at the last parking deck and riding the light rail one stop to campus for free.

 

If I were CATS, I'd have fare collectors stationed at the last stop on campus several days a month (at random) to check tickets to deter this...and collect extra revenue.

[nowensone]

I was pontificating on that this past weekend, the cost to employ ticket checkers versus the revenue their presence assures is collected.  Any stats on how many riders do not purchase a ticket?

Edited August 1, 2013 by nowensone

[kermit]

CATS typically says that enforcement indicates that <5% of riders are fare evaders. There are of course measurement problems here but IMO a closed (turnstyle) system will never be  worth the cost for small, at-grade, systems.

[Urbanity]

I wouldn't think it would be such a big deal to CATS per se of students riding one stop which is the end of the line.   I'm just talking theory here - but at first glance - why bother with the extra cost of people to monitor.  

 

I do think however that the reverse is going to be true and that there may be a presence at that last/first stop so that they catch people at the source trying to ditch fares.   Additionally I wouldn't be surprised if the campus safety officers play a role (even as a visual deterrent) at that stop as I'm certain for perception value of campus safety the University is going to have a heightened "police" presence at a major mass transit line stop on campus grounds. 

Edited August 2, 2013 by Urbanity

[kermit]

^ I think fare evasion around UNCC will be a secondary concern to the consumption of park and ride spaces by UNCC students.

 

Given the cost of parking on campus I can see students quickly learning to legally and cheaply park at the 700 space deck at JW Clay. This will be a problem for CATS (no spaces for commuters) and for UNCC (less revenue for the self-sustaining parking office).

[HopHead]

One thing I've wondered about, not sure if it's been discussed, is student housing (or apartments geared specifically to students) along the rail line between UNCC and uptown. Wonder if some developer would build something like this in say NoDa or right outside uptown? Give students a monthly (or semester pass) on the light rail as a part of their dues or HOA at the building. I imagine it would exclude Freshmen, but would be geared more towards upper classmen that don't necessarily want to live in off campus housing in UC. This may be more prominent once the uptown campus is built out a little more too.