Charlotte's Light Rail: Lynx Blue Line

[dubone]

The green in that rendering is part of the land of the NoDa Mills.  

http://charmeck.org/city/charlotte/focusareas/housingandndev/documents/august%202,%202010%20meeting%20presentation.pdf

 

http://charmeck.org/city/charlotte/cityclerk/councilrelated/documents/agenda%20attachments/2012/09_24_12%20mtg/01%2009-24-2012.pdf

 

 

There are no site plans that I can see but the article from last year says they would add retail along 36th near the station.  And an article from September says they'd start construction again this month, so hopefully progress will begin again. 

[DEnd]

REALLY!? Anyone have renderings of that. I personally hate elevated trains, but I feel like it'd be cool that close to downtown Noda.

 

It's a bit of a misnomer, The track grade will be elevated some, but the majority of the grade separation IIRC will be that 36th will be regarded lower.  But I'm mainly going off of memory.

[Guest]

It's a bit of a misnomer, The track grade will be elevated some, but the majority of the grade separation IIRC will be that 36th will be regarded lower.  But I'm mainly going off of memory.

I guess I don't really follow Light Rail construction like I do buildings :-)

[dubone]

The grade of the railroad will not be changed.  They will lower 36th under the tracks as shown in that rendering.  

[kermit]

Seattle's University LRT extension is currently 6-9 months ahead of schedule and about $100 million under budget. They are discussing an early opening for the line (which is mostly underground).

http://www.masstransitmag.com/news/11245013/u-link-to-open-in-2016

Perhaps some of that luck might rub off on the BLE......

[tozmervo]

NCDOT proposed map of the Sugar Creek grade separation. 

 

caution: large PDF. caution caution: north is DOWN on the map.

http://www.ncdot.gov/download/projects/publichearings/12022013_U5008_PUBLICHEARINGMAP.pdf

[dubone]

I really hate NCDOT sometimes.   Look at the suburban style changes they are making at North Davidson at Sugar Creek.  2 swirly roundy connector streets we have been trying to purge from downtown and a cul de sac.  

 

Please explain to me why Northmore couldn't connect with Redwood and Davidson couldn't connect with Bearwood?

 

Who on earth is going to develop that ridiculous kidney bean block they are creating DIRECTLY next to the light rail station.  They have destroyed the potential density of these blocks, and made a mess of it.   If the proxmity to the lower grade is too much for the North Davidson traffic, then just cut out the connector to Bearwood.

 

Why do these engineers always try to put spaghetti on clean perpendicular grids?

[Urbanity]

 

Why do these engineers always try to put spaghetti on clean perpendicular grids?

Ok - I'm going to be a smart ass here - but where exactly do you see a grid in that map to begin with? 

[tozmervo]

There's a little good and some really bad here. It gives NoDa and Howie Acres a lit intersection (safer access) to Sugar Creek.

 

Then the rest of it just kind of sucks. Pedestrians and bikers on the east side of Sugar Creek (the left side of the plan) get a giant bloody highway bridge to access the light rail station, which they will have to go past and turn around to get to. All the residents on Bearwood Ave get really lousy access to a light rail station that's practically in their back yard. 

 

I would much rather see a new light at Dinglewood Avenue and a second light at the existing Davidson St intersection without capping the other streets (like Northmore) the way that's shown.

 

They are clearly looking at minimizing the connections to Sugar Creek to make it more highway like, in typical NCDOT fashion. 

 

Edit: It's very telling that this doesn't make any mention of the light rail. Rails, station, nothing.

Edited November 25, 2013 by tozmervo

[dubone]

Exactly, it does not even show the light rail plans UNDER CONSTRUCTION on the map, and buildings that are about to be torn down.

 

@RDF, the connectivity is not there north to south of Sugar Creek Rd so this one isn't as clean a grid as what NCDOT has done elsewhere to grids in Charlotte. But the streets are at least parallel/perpendicular to eachother leaving blocks that are developable with reasonable density and seem to have been put in an orderly fashion.

 

That kidney shaped block might as well be declared a branch bank for life.   I had hopes that this would be the section of NoDa that gets the large apartment block buildings as greenfield development similar to how New Bern Station has seen that type of growth.   But if they're going to make all the square blocks round, and make it very hard for pedestrians to navigate the area then that vision is unlikely.

 

Maybe it is purely aesthetics, but I still feel strongly about it.  This has the aesthetics of everything I hate, exurban curvy roads with high speed thoroughfares.   Straight lines are urban, swiggly lines are suburban, and I feel like a team of engineers drove in from Cary to try to remake NoDa in that image.   

[orulz]

There will be another chance to redo the street grid in this area, when the ACWR is relocated. It could be a chance to make things better, or it might wind up making things even worse. It's likely that only North Davidson will be bridged over the new route of the ACWR, so connecting Northmore to Sugar Creek would be pointless in the long term since the ACWR would just sever it anyway.

 

I have to say that extending the grade separation so that Raleigh Street and Bearwood Avenue go under the bridge does seem gratuitous.

[Urbanity]

There are a few BLE meetings coming up:

 

• General Progress Meeting:
  • Dec 5th (Thurs) ; 4:30 - 6:30 p.m. at Sugaw Creek Church 
• Transit Station Area Plan Workshop (UCity Blvd; McCullough; and JW Clay Stations):
  • Dec 10th (Tues) ; 4:30 - 6:30 p.m. at Oasis Shriners

 

I got to say I'm really annoyed at the 4:30 - 6:30 times.  You want community input but hold it at times when most people will still be at work and/or travelling from their job.

 

 

 

 

[dubone]

Yeah, ACWR is going to be great for the current Single Family Homes area of NoDa to have a greenway.  But when they add another freight line through this northern section of NoDa, it really will remove a lot of opportunity for the area to be built up with dense mixed use or residential projects which the city is relying on to justify the billion dollar rail infrastructure.   

[Otto]

I really hate NCDOT sometimes.   Look at the suburban style changes they are making at North Davidson at Sugar Creek.  2 swirly roundy connector streets we have been trying to purge from downtown and a cul de sac.  

 

Please explain to me why Northmore couldn't connect with Redwood and Davidson couldn't connect with Bearwood?

 

Who on earth is going to develop that ridiculous kidney bean block they are creating DIRECTLY next to the light rail station.  They have destroyed the potential density of these blocks, and made a mess of it.   If the proxmity to the lower grade is too much for the North Davidson traffic, then just cut out the connector to Bearwood.

 

Why do these engineers always try to put spaghetti on clean perpendicular grids?

North Davidson is the primary through road connecting the project area to uptown.  Bearwood does not have an outlet besides its existing connection at Sugar Creek.  By realigning N. Davidson to Redwood, it allows the two main through routes in the project area to remain connected, ensuring network connectivity.  Also, note that NCDOT did not develop this project in a vacuum, working extremely close with CDOT during the development of this project design.

[kermit]

Mary Newsome just published an interesting piece discussing CharMeck planning's more active role in negotiating zoning and development strategies for property owners in the station areas of the BLE.

 

http://plancharlotte.org/story/charlotte-ble-light-rail-station-area-plans-uncc

 

My initial read left me with more questions than answers but it sounds like they are negotiating rezoning on a case by case basis rather than the more blanketed strategy along the south line. While I am glad they are being proactive about zoning I would have been happier if they were further along with the county-wide zoning revamp that has been in discussion for the past six months.

[southslider]

The 60-acre site at the UCB station is already zoned for your typical commercial strip development.  It would be egg on Charlotte's crown if such prime real estate beside a new billion-dollar investment were to develop as more car dealerships.

[illustration82]

I found out yesterday that there will be a Lynx Blue Line Extension Public Meeting to discuss progress along the line.  The meeting will take place Thursday, Dec. 5 from 4:30 pm - 6:30 p.m.  at Sugaw Creek Presbyterian Church 101 W. Sugar Creek Rd.  

 

There will also be a Transit Station Area Plans Workshop for the University City Blvd, McCullough and JW Clay Blvd Station Areas on Tuesday, Dec 10.  This meeting will be held from 4:30- 6:30 at Oasis Shriners Center 604 Doug Mayes place.  

 

I'm planning to attend the first of the two meetings.  I just attended a meeting Monday about the Bridge that will be built over the Sugar Creek railroad crossing in preparation for the blue line. It's suppose to be a massive project. Completely changing the layout of that portion of Sugar Creek. Traffic on this side of town is about to be crazy.  lol.  All in the name of progress, right?

[illustration82]

I didn't realize that a section of the light rail extension would travel under a tunnel.  I found out today that the train will pass underground then onto the campus of UNCC.  

[ajfunder]

That was in the original plans than I thought it was eliminated in favor of a bridge. Maybe they went back to the original plans, was this at the info session?

[southslider]

"Cut and cover" per the meeting.

[dubone]

http://charmeck.org/city/charlotte/cats/planning/BLE/Pages/BLEAlignmentMaps.aspx

 

That's great news.  Certainly has changed since last years documents online.   

 

I think anytime transit goes underground it is better than bridging over, even if in a trench, as it is coverable later and boom a 'subway'.   I had thought they had shifted to the bridge rather than cut-and-cover because of cost savings and drainage with all the creeks just east in UNCC's campus.   Maybe they contractors found a cheaper way to do the cut-and-cover?

[New Name]

Did anyone else make it to the community CATS meeting last night? Highlights?
I got there at 6:15 and they were packing up. What's up with 4:30-6:30 meetings? What kind of community is not in work at those hours?

[southslider]

^Bankers' hours, perhaps?

If active in your community, you could likely ask CATS for a special presentation to your community association.

[Urbanity]

Observer had a piece about the meetings this morning. It didn't really provide any details I didn't know already (ramping up work now; doing utility work on North Tryon; a lot of traffic worries during construction; when finished two lanes of traffic either side with bike lanes, better sidewalks and pedestrian bridges) 

 

^Bankers' hours, perhaps?

If active in your community, you could likely ask CATS for a special presentation to your community association.

 

I think most of us who made comments about the hours will pointing out that CATS dropped the ball in booking the public meetings when most of the public is unavailable.   They could have just as easily made these meetings 6:30 - 8:30.

[tozmervo]

Few shots of the presentation -

http://wfae.org/post/construction-blue-line-extension-will-begin-2014#.Uqh8FBafpOs.twitter

 

CATS did film the presentation, which will supposedly make it online soon.