Jump to content

Charlotte's Light Rail: Lynx Blue Line


dubone

Recommended Posts


20 hours ago, jthomas said:

Thanks for the info! What I am wondering, though, is if advances in autonomous driving technology in the future could allow for the implementation of automatic train operation without the need to upgrade infrastructure through grade separation, platform screens etc. I am skeptical that we will see fully autonomous cars in urban areas anytime soon. However, an LRT line, even with at-grade vehicle and pedestrian crossings, is a less complex environment than a busy downtown street. Could the technology currently being developed for cars be applied to trains to allow a far broader implementation of automatic operation?

Largely speculating here but.... The technology is certainly available to run any train using an automated system on existing tracks (it is MUCH more straightforward than road vehicles). The difficulty with doing this is with the remediation strategy that you take when the automated system detects a problem. If there is no crew on the train then dealing with inevitable problems (a door won't close, someone is on the tracks, a crossing gate is broken by a car, etc.) becomes very difficult and the delays to send someone out to deal with the issue will end up crippling the remainder of the system.

Fully grade separated systems, and those with platform doors, reduce the number of potential problems enough that operators can gamble with problem solving (but I am not sure how they staff for it). I doubt the Blue Line (in its current design) could ever reduce the 'problem possibility set' to a low enough level that automation would allow for a reliable transit system. I would bet money that any system where a person could potentially access the tracks (e.g. by walking from 7th street onto the rail) is unlikely to ever be fully automated.

The London DLR may offer an automation model for a similar system as ours (some grade crossings and surface running still exist). The DLR has automated operation, but every 'train' still has a staff member on it who monitors for errors, can correct them (and usually operates the doors and gives the 'OK, Go' signal to the train). These guys don't usually ride up front or monitor the track in front of the train (so the two available front seats are pretty fantastic for transit nerds). I guess the relevant question for Charlotte is, would a DLR-like vehicle supervisor be easier to train and have better working conditions than the current set of drivers?

Edited by kermit
  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 hours ago, kermit said:

some grade crossings and surface running still exist

I am not sure why surface running would preclude a system from becoming automated...there are plenty of systems that are fully automated (driverless) have sections of tracks that run on the surface...SkyTrain (Vancouver), JFK AirTrain, some MTR lines in Hong Kong, Sydney Metro, the Lausanne Metro, etc. This is in addition to the many systems with surface tracks that are automated but still have an operator/attendant onboard like BART, WMATA, and MARTA. 

Obviously precautions have to me made to prevent intrusion, be it with strong steel fencing equipped with security spikes, or an intrusion detection system (to automatically stop a vehicle if contamination is detected or if the fencing is compromised), or a mixture of both. 

Where does the DLR have grade crossings?

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, LKN704 said:

I am not sure why surface running would preclude a system from becoming automated...there are plenty of systems that are fully automated (driverless) have sections of tracks that run on the surface...SkyTrain (Vancouver), JFK AirTrain, some MTR lines in Hong Kong, Sydney Metro, the Lausanne Metro, etc. This is in addition to the many systems with surface tracks that are automated but still have an operator/attendant onboard like BART, WMATA, and MARTA. 

Obviously precautions have to me made to prevent intrusion, be it with strong steel fencing equipped with security spikes, or an intrusion detection system (to automatically stop a vehicle if contamination is detected or if the fencing is compromised), or a mixture of both. 

Where does the DLR have grade crossings?

Yea, I was speaking lazily once again. Surface running doesn't preclude automation, particularly when its a sealed ROW, but I do think its fair to assume that more problems that need to be solved will appear when running occurs at ground level.

I had thought I remembered grade crossings on the DLR Beckton  line but google maps tells me I am wrong. The nice thing about having an oyster card is it doesn't really matter if you are on mainline rail or the tube so route specific memories can get fuzzy.

Edited by kermit
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, kermit said:

One fare check this morning at Old Concord, and then a second one, by a different crew, at Mucullough.

This is not a sensible allocation of resources…

What does it matter if you get to where the hell you going?  I guarantee, no matter how great you keyboard transit operations managers are, you’d piece meal it together as well…good grief.

 

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
  • Confused 6
  • Sad 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 11/4/2022 at 1:30 PM, KJHburg said:

Extending the Blue Line to UNC Charlotte campus was one of the smartest decisions we made in transit.

and the University area has the best connected hotels to uptown via its multiple stations including the on campus Marriott hotel at JW Clay station.  

 

I totally agree. The relatively few times I’m on the blue line, the train seems extremely popular with UNCC students. 

Also think University has the geography to be a truly special mixed use development if someone could properly redevelop a lot of the box stores on JW Clay.

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...
Short side note that is more of a rant. I know I've brought this up before, but it irks me that DC's silver line extension opened up THREE DAYS AGO and is already reflected on Google Maps. I have no idea why it is so hard to include at least the LYNX Blue Line, it would be excusable if they didn't want to put in Gold (though DC streetcar is also visible on Google Maps). Where is the disconnect here? It's not like system size matters, Phoenix's one single light rail line has been visible for years.

Google neglect? CATS puts the data out there for maps they said and Apple maps has both of our lines added for trip planning. I’m not sure why Google Maps doesn’t?
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...
On 11/19/2022 at 8:46 PM, MothBeast said:

It is up to Google and CATS has chosen not to dedicate any energy towards advocating for it themselves. I don’t get it myself personally, it feels like an obvious win and I figured with the app improvements it would be within their vision 

Yeah it is on Google.  For some weird reason if it's not a Southern city that Google favors (from my observation: Austin, Atlanta, Nashville, or Durham) they tend to be very slow with maps updates although rapid changes happens outside of those places. TBH, Google has refused to update Washington's 3D roll out nor aerial imagery so the fact that the WMATA Silver Line is online is weird...

  • Sad 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 hours ago, kayman said:

Yeah it is on Google.  For some weird reason if it's not a Southern city that Google favors (from my observation: Austin, Atlanta, Nashville, or Durham) they tend to be very slow with maps updates although rapid changes happens outside of those places. TBH, Google has refused to update Washington's 3D roll out nor aerial imagery so the fact that the WMATA Silver Line is online is weird...

I think you're right, I recently noticed that Miami's rail line isn't shown either despite being heavy rail and quite old (1984). Pretty unfair that they get to just pick and choose which cities to update both in imagery and transit information. Can't even imagine what their incentive is for that, and especially in the case of adding transit lines it's not like this is some monumental undertaking. Weird laziness/ignorance from them.

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, Reverie39 said:

I think you're right, I recently noticed that Miami's rail line isn't shown either despite being heavy rail and quite old (1984). Pretty unfair that they get to just pick and choose which cities to update both in imagery and transit information. Can't even imagine what their incentive is for that, and especially in the case of adding transit lines it's not like this is some monumental undertaking. Weird laziness/ignorance from them.

Google started out great for everyone but they started to pick winners and losers on what to update and how oftenn in the past decade. There are some cities that still have aerials and 3D data over a decade in age on their Google maps and Google Earth apps. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, kayman said:

Google started out great for everyone but they started to pick winners and losers on what to update and how oftenn in the past decade. There are some cities that still have aerials and 3D data over a decade in age on their Google maps and Google Earth apps. 

I wonder how though.

It looks like for example even Tempe, AZ has their Streetcar line on Google Maps and it just opened this year.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site you agree to our Terms of Use and Privacy Policy. We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.