National ID Coming for Gen Xer's and younger

[monsoon]

I find it interesting and a bit Orwellian that the Bush administration has gotten a new law pass that requires anyone born after December 1, 1964 to get a new ID in the next 6 years with special features that allow them to be tracked. This is part of the Real ID Act which got pushed through during the 9/11 paranoia as a way to keep track of terrorists. Of course we all know it's really a way to keep track of Americans.

So if you were born after December 1, 1964, then you have 6 years to comply or presumably you could become a federal felon. Baby Boomers and older don't need to worry about it until after 2018.

Now I ask, what in the hell kind of sense does this make?

[tombarnes]

None whatsoever. The new technology is being sold to us as somehow good for us. Rather like the new passports. Isn't the new chip in the passport some sort of tracking device-- "in the event that we are lost in enemy territory" or kidnapped, or whatever? Totally unnecessary- at least for us. The government may have other ideas.

Has anyone read Nenesis by Chalmers Johnson? It paints a chilling picture of our government today.

[Rural King]

Under the current law you won't become a felon, but if you don't have a state driver's license or photo ID that meets the Real ID standards than it will not be able to used for federal identification purposes. Basically Real ID mandates states to create a common standard for their licenses and photo IDs, comply to a common database, utilize approved security and anti-fraud counter-measures, and several other mandates. Many states are fighting aspects of the REAL ID Act because many of those mandates are unfunded and/or pose security concerns for the private information of their citizens in their views.

Many states seem to be willing to comply with the security and anti-fraud countermeasures so they can be used for federal identification purposes, but it is unclear if other mandates in the bill will get incorporated into use by the states as quickly.

[Captain Worley]

I heard something like 17 states are fighting this. I'm proud to see SC is one of them. This is an utterly ridiculous law.

[tamias6]

Maybe I'm just being too naive for my own good, but how is a national ID system a bad thing? It seems to me that we already have a universal national ID system called social security cards. Every US citizen has one. As for the implications of be tracked. Its already easy for governments and illegitimate parties to track people right now mainly because of how most of our activities and communications involve computers in some way same or form thanks to living in the digital age. To be honest I don't think we'd see much difference in our quality lives if any with this new national ID system unless we intend to rob a bank or Hitler reincarnated decides to proclaim himself Supreme Emperor of America.

[monsoon]

Maybe I'm just being too naive for my own good, but how is a national ID system a bad thing? It seems to me that we already have a universal national ID system called social security cards. ....

[tombarnes]

I see your point, but there is already quite enough ID tracking in place now. Why add more of it? This merely makes it easier for a tyrant to gain a foothold. Another book worth reading is Sinclair Lewis' It Can't Happen Here- written in the late 1930's, but still prescient today.

[monsoon]

On the matter of if it is a good thing. One that has been around long enough would remember that people who lived behind the Iron Curtain, (former Soviet Union, East Germany, etc) were required by the government to always possess an internal passport. The passport was used to track and control people within these authoritarian governments. Many here see the requirement for a national ID card to be the first step in the same kind of thing being established in the USA. Once everyone has one of these cards, then the temptation will be there, under the excuse of protecting our freedom, to require the card for such things as crossing state lines, going into certain parts of cities, and lots of other controls that we don't have now.

Maybe this is why Baby Boomers and older have been exempted from it for now. Most of them realize these dangers, the younger generations apparently don't.

[JDC]

Why not just require everyone to have a US passport? This country is still part of the world, isn't it?

[dimebag1980]

No thank you, Mr. Bush. I believe I will have to become a felon. They can take this national tracking device and shove it.

"Oh, Canada!" Okay, well I'm not serious about the Canada part, but ... come on. So lets get the stinking ID and just drop it in a dumpster somewhere. We've complied by getting it, shouldn't we be finished at that? Perhaps, but knowing nothing about this subject I have a feeling there would be penalties to not having it on your person when asked for it.

And we think our prisons are overcrowded now... oh boy!

[Raintree21]

The "computer chip" that was spoken of is no longer a requirement so they can't "track you" that way. The main reason states were raising a fuss about it is because of the costs associated with redoing everyone's driver's licenses. I don't think that this is a "Bush" thing. It would have come eventually from whatever President was in office.

[Rural King]

That isn't true. There isn't a law requiring a citizen to apply for or obtain a SS #. As a practical matter you have to have one to work or claim dependents on a tax return, but there is no requirement for this.

[Justadude]

That isn't true. There isn't a law requiring a citizen to apply for or obtain a SS #. As a practical matter you have to have one to work or claim dependents on a tax return, but there is no requirement for this.

[Choirboy622]

The only *potential* benefit to having these would occur after Dubya leaves office. The next president (whomever he or she is) might manage to get us all national health insurance. If that happens, then these cards could be used for that purpose also.

[dxartist]

What the hell did I spend $80 for this passport for?

Screw that. looks like I'll be heading to Canada within the next 6 years or some non-extradicition country.

[cityboi]

wow..this kinda reminds me how the bible describes the end times in the book of Revelation. According to the Bible Everyone will have the "mark of the beast" or "mark of Satan" on their right hands or forheads and they cant buy or sell without it. Alot people think that the national ID card is the beginning of something that will lead to the government putting computer chips in our right hands to track all Americans. Just think if it led to not being able to buy or sell without it. The government would say its a good way to track terrorists or illegal immigrants in our country because they couldnt function without being able to purchase or sell. That practice could spread worldwide in an effort to fight the on going War on Terrorism.

[suburban george3]

wow..this kinda reminds me how the bible describes the end times in the book of Revelation. According to the Bible Everyone will have the "mark of the beast" on their right hands or forheads and they cant buy or sell without it. Alot people think that the national ID card is the beginning of something that will lead to the government putting computer chips in our right hands to track all Americans. Just think if it led to not being able to buy or sell without it. The government would say its a good way to track terrorists or illegal immigrants in our country because they couldnt function without being able to purchase or sell. That practice could spread worldwide in an effort to fight the on going War on Terrorism.

[cityboi]

I 'hope' people would refuse to have marks or chips put in their bodys as a way of identification. Granted, people think national ID cards are a step that way, but it's still a gigantic step to go from an ID card to an embedded chip or marking. I really hope people would rail against such a measure. However, with the younger generation embracing technology so completely, it could happen in our lifetimes.

[sean]

The background on the card is the truncated pyramid with the all-seeing eye.

[Raintree21]

The background on the card is the truncated pyramid with the all-seeing eye.

[cityboi]

Here we go with the conspiracy theories again.

EPIC is a private civil liberties group much akin to the ACLU. It is not affiliated with the government and is AGAINST the Real ID act.

Also, it's HQ address is actually 1718 Connecticut Ave. NW, Suite 200, Washington, DC 20009. The 666 address is just where you mail off to get their publications and there are quite a few other businesses that have that address. Are they all evil as well? Why would an organization that is against the chips have the "mark of the devil?"

[Spartan]

This is a very one sided argument. I'd like to see the pros and cons of this argument laid out. I am not opposed to national standards for ID's but still having them at the state level. Some states have inferior licensing systems. For example, New York's IDs are about 15 years behind the times when compared to South Carolina's IDs. They don't have holograms and other seemingly basic anti-duplication mechanisms. They also can't print them on the spot.

The catch is that with this mandate should come funding to implement the changes necessary to bring all the states to the same level. The problem then becomes that there is no money, and we don't need any new federal programs to take more money out of the pot.

[Recchia]

You can change your DOB or anything else for that matter with a colored pencil on a New York ID.

[Justadude]

Ahhh... The Panopticon! Jeremy Bentham is smiling in his grave.

[sean]

What a weird moment in my life...