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Providence Population Growth


cataldo

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In 2000, we're at the top in terms of % of households on assistance. In 2007, we're 17th in % of population participating in the workforce. WTF? Has there been some sea-change?

No. It's probably closest to reality to say that both of those statistics were generated with a particular goal in mind to make a particular case, but both have some level of truth to them. I note that 'your' stat doesn't differentiate between what kind of assistance people receive while 'my' stat doesn't differentiate between what kind of jobs people have. It would be really great to have access to the raw data, so that intelligent, inquiring minds -- like ALL the people here have -- would be able to draw their own conclusions.

I'm sure you know the expression, Ank: lies, damn lies and statistics. So let's try to move this forward.

When I pull together these contradictory stats with what I'd like to call the "Ruchele Experience," I see a picture. And it ain't pretty. It seems to me that there's a pretty good number of people who are BOTH working AND on assistance. Not good.

I'm sure that most everybody here would agree that having a lot of people who need assistance to survive is not a good thing. It's a net drag on the economy, even though (you should admit and this is all that whoever was saying) the money paid out doesn't disappear but goes into the economy. The ROI is negative, but it's not zero.

So what's the solution?

Our cost of living is high, and the easily-created, easily-filled service sector jobs don't pay enough to support a more-or-less normal family life. My low-end BC/BS family health insurance policy is over $500/month. That's a week, a day and 2 hours at $10/hr. A two-bedroom for $800/month and that's the entire month's take home. At minimum wage, fugettaboutit. Hence the working and getting assistance conundrum.

These jobs are for teen-agers and 20-somethings living 6-to-a-flat. (Oh, the memories!)

What we need isn't JUST jobs, but good jobs. Good jobs are hard to create, and even harder to fill. So really, to make any kind of a dent in this problems (and I agree it's a problem) we need invest in training and adult education.

Now if somebody could find a way to tie these two things together, then I think we'd be getting somewhere. For example, what if - as an alternative to welfare - there were a program where under-educated young single mothers got paid to go a place where the kids could get Headstart type stuff while the moms got training. You'd have to have a GED program as the first level and then move from there. (Personally, I'd also require a course on early childhood development. IMO, better parent make better kids and that makes better schools.)

Would you save money? No, you'd probably spend more. But the ROI would be through the roof. Better educated mom get better job, sets the better example and (hopefully) breaks the chain of poverty. Money well spent.

I'm sure this 'big government program' goes badly against your grain, but do you have a better alternative? Please don't say "just cut 'em off and let 'em sink or swim on their own." It's really not a solution.

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:rofl:

Seriously though. Why don't we teach life skills in school? You know like balancing a check book, and what credit is and how to maintain it, and how to get a mortgage, and what a 401k is... The middle class really sits on the edge of economic disaster, not many people could go more than a few weeks to months if they lost their income or earning ability, then we go into debt... And so many people don't have basic budgeting skills. Especially here in Providence where there are large minority and immigrant populations, many of which don't even trust banks.

I mean kids get credit cards and don't grasp the concept of a finance charge. Would it be so hard to integrate these life skills into the curriculum?

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Some of this is already happening. My daughter just had a math unit on budgeting at the Cuffee School. I remember having a similar unit in middle school (circa 1971 :shok:). Fat lotta good that or my parent's best efforts did me. I was a financial mess until I was 30+, but then I always was "special."

Also, check out Operation Hope and their whole financial literacy program. I stumbled across this guy, John Hope Bryant, on CSPAN and was amazed.

He hipped me to that Winston Churchill quote: Success is the ability to go from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm.

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Cotuit, I honestly believe wholeheartedly that teaching "money" in schools is the #1 cure.. Get this.. I offered to volunteer at Olneyville Housing doing this exact thing.. Teach people how the system works, how to avoid pitfalls, how places like Rentway are parasites, the value of inflation, managing money, credit usage, the value of good credit..

Their response was.. "Great idea!! We currently need help helping people fill out their tax forms.. Are you interested?"

<_<

For some reason, and for the life of me I can't figure it out.. We would rather teach people about people like Columbus (that rapist and murderer of my people) as an "explorer".. The guy has a holiday!! But we don't teach people that buying a car from JD Byrider @ 20% interest MIGHT not be a good idea..

Speechless..

The government solution is to light money on fire and throw it at the problem in the hopes that people wont revolt... Their programs create servitude to welfare.. And then on the other end of the spectrum, they give 10 mill to Friends of The Program @ Tort Fruit..

80% of us are defined as "working class middle" paying the way for the bottom 15% and the top 5%.. Unsustainable.. I'm probably a little too passionate about it, but when someone asks the question "how do we get popultion increases to Rhode Island'.. Its simple.. Less freebies for the top and bottom.. Make it a better place for the middle class.. The solution is far more difficult than the problem..

And that, accross the board.. Is lower taxes for working people.. In order to get lower taxes, you have to stop paying special interest groups at the top and bottom and fix it.. My solution above to volunteer apparently, simple as it seems to us, is apparently too out of the box for the powers that be..

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:rofl:

Seriously though. Why don't we teach life skills in school? You know like balancing a check book, and what credit is and how to maintain it, and how to get a mortgage, and what a 401k is... The middle class really sits on the edge of economic disaster, not many people could go more than a few weeks to months if they lost their income or earning ability, then we go into debt... And so many people don't have basic budgeting skills. Especially here in Providence where there are large minority and immigrant populations, many of which don't even trust banks.

I mean kids get credit cards and don't grasp the concept of a finance charge. Would it be so hard to integrate these life skills into the curriculum?

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We're the ones with the ideas and the energy to make things happen. Now, granted, I have a Bucket perspective where anything is something. The City does what it can, and, sometimes, that ain't much. Still, J and Zano have been spectacular in their results almost entirely on their own. Things can get done.

I dunno, I've just had a really good, oh, year or so.

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Speaking of lighting money on fire...

http://money.cnn.com/2008/01/24/news/econo...sion=2008012410

(Note, I would have loved to post those sexy links that frankie does where you can HTML-it and not post the actual link, but have "lighting money on fire" be the link.. If anyone can PM me and let me know how to do this, it would be most appreciated)

Lighting Money on Fire

Lighting Money on Fire

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Cotuit, I honestly believe wholeheartedly that teaching "money" in schools is the #1 cure.. Get this.. I offered to volunteer at Olneyville Housing doing this exact thing.. Teach people how the system works, how to avoid pitfalls, how places like Rentway are parasites, the value of inflation, managing money, credit usage, the value of good credit..

Their response was.. "Great idea!! We currently need help helping people fill out their tax forms.. Are you interested?"

<_<

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In hindsight, I really regret this post.. In no way, shape or form did I intend to disrespect Libyans.. Furthermore, I understand that "middle america" might be good and scared of Libyans. There are so many other 80s movie villains out there that middle america is already inclined to be scared of, so in the future I will be sure to stick to them as my "terrorist organization" poster children.
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So even if we can't agree on all points....

If we:

make social programs more efficient,

end cronyism,

lower taxes for the middle class,

end frivolous red tape restricting the entrepreneurial spirit,

improve public transportation,

hide the foreclosure crisis through fines to banks for dilapitating properties,

recruit a major league team to RI,

become six sigma ninjas what ever six sigma is

wash off the gay

and become Sin City East without detracting from reputable business from locating within city limits........

Then we can attract people to Rhode Island and grow population in a healthy way... Whoever posted this topic, if we can do some of that... I think we'd make steps forward.. Its not too much, seems reasonable..

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