Major League Baseball In Providence

[Patrick Ward]

but it's surrounded by surface lots and the neighborhood there isn't exactly some place you would venture outside those lots.

[runawayjim]

I know a lot of people here at UP hate parking lots when talking about the urban environment. Big, black, flat with lots of white lines. But don't you need that type of thing when discussing a venue that will hold 12 to 15 thousand people?

[Patrick Ward]

i never said that you didn't need it... though a couple parking garages would work better (MSG doesn't have a large surface lot, and from what i remember, yankee stadium doesn't either and both of those hold more than 12-15k).

the problem with bridgeport is they made the venues their own little world. there's nothing in the neighborhood outside of those 2 places and it's not really a nice neighborhood. maybe they've cleaned it up since i was last down there.

[runawayjim]

Parking garages are big money, correct? 30k + per parking space. This would add lots of $$ to ticket prices. Fenway and Yankee Stadium has lots of micro parking lots and excellent subway service.

[Patrick Ward]

should it be free parking or should it just be priced per hour? eventually the money will be made back. they're expensive up front, but it will eventually pay for itself. throw some shops in the bottom (a gift/souvenir shop should be a given) that pay rent and you can get it paid off even faster. people can take the bus or drive, it's their choice, but parking in cities is never free (at least not in surface lots or garages).

[Cotuit]

As great as it would be to have a stadium (baseball or soccer), I think I would have to be opposed if it meant a sea of parking, especially on Allens, a sea of parking to compliment the hospitals sea of parking.

[CtownMikey]

what about something like a 10k space underground garage?? and light rail to make it easy for residents close by not have to drive

or maybesplit it.

[Patrick Ward]

eventually the money will be made back. they're expensive up front, but it will eventually pay for itself. throw some shops in the bottom (a gift/souvenir shop should be a given) that pay rent and you can get it paid off even faster.

[runawayjim]

So I was just down at the cafe getting slice and thinking about parking garages.

Ok so one parking garage with...what ...2000 spaces? at $30,000 per space is, mmmmm....$60 Million Dollars. How big do you think that gift shop will need to be?

Again, I don't care about parking lots, I like baseball and water views, I just thought it was funny after doing the math in my head. It would not be cost effective to do this downtown never mind a seasonal venue. So lets just leave the PawSox right where they are.

[Lone Ranger]

he was talking about CT as a whole. they were all whalers fans (with the exception of some of the fairfield county folks who were rangers or islanders fans).

[runawayjim]

Then he badly mis-worded his statement. And if people from all over CT could root for the Whalers, then people from all over SENE could root for a National League baseball team in Providence.

[Patrick Ward]

do parking garages really cost that much?

[mental757]

the Whalers move had more to do with ownership than support from what I recall. Perhaps 'Hartford Tycoon' could chime in on that?

[Cotuit]

$25k-30-ish.

I wouldn't mind surface parking if it were creatively screened with buildings, and supplemented by satellite lots with shuttles, but 15k-20k parking spaces just plunked down in the city, no f-ing way!

[jencoleslaw]

I know a lot of people here at UP hate parking lots when talking about the urban environment. Big, black, flat with lots of white lines. But don't you need that type of thing when discussing a venue that will hold 12 to 15 thousand people?

[Lone Ranger]

Hm. Fenway doesn't have it. Camden doesn't have it. I've never been to Yankees Stadium (for obvious reasons), do they have it?..I bet Wrigley field doesn't have it. The Giants field doesn't have it (can't remember the name) does not have a giant parking lot.

I'd really have an issue with any kind of gigantic parking lot right on the bay. the run off issue would be astronomical.

[runawayjim]

philly's got tons of surface parking at their stadium, but it's a mega sports complex with the football field and the arena right there.

[HartfordTycoon]

the Whalers move had more to do with ownership than support from what I recall. Perhaps 'Hartford Tycoon' could chime in on that?

[mental757]

That's correct. Support was not perfect but was there and the season ticket goals were met. The final issue was a dispute over the new arena and reimbursing the team for losses. Ironic considering the huge losses they initially suffered for years in North Carolina and just sucked it up. Per Wikipedia:

Hartford Whalers

In early 1996, negotiations between the Whalers and Connecticut Governor John Rowland to build a new $147.5 million arena seemed to be going well. However, negotiations fell apart when Rowland and the state refused Karmanos' demand to reimburse the Whalers for up to $45 million in losses during the three years the new arena was to be built. As a result, the team announced on March 26, 1997, that they would leave Hartford, one of the few times that a team announced it would leave its current city without having already selected a new city

I don't want to hijack the thread though, just responding with requested info. Personally, I think PVD could potentially support major league sports along with Hartford. If we ever got pro teams for the same sport that would make for a heated rivalry I'd bet.

[Baines]

Thanks, thats what I thought. Now the rumors are out there that teams like Florida are looking to move back north...

back to the topic: Between the pull from the surrounding areas, and the PVD metro itself, there is plenty of population to support more major league teams in my opinion.

[Dan]

It would be great to have a MLB team relocate to Rhode Island.

I'm in the minority here when I say that Fenway has outlived its useful life and the experience is not worth anywhere near the ticket prices. I've been sitting in the same seats up there since I was 7, when the tickets were about $18-20 each. These are good seats (Sec 12 Box 16 / 6th row) on the 1st base line BUT you spend the whole game with a crooked neck because the seats are pointed out toward the camera nest in the outfield; all the action from your position is at 9 o' clock. Its wicked cramped too, aisles are about 10" wide and the seats are not wide enough for Americans in this day. Sitting in an aisle seat, its a safe bet that at some point someone's going to spill beer on you when you least expect it. If you show up within 25 minutes of game time, you'll be stuck in a mob on the way to your seats (you might have to just start pushin and shovin like Bill Belichick through a swarm of photographers after a Pats game).

All this for $125.00 a ticket.

Don't get me wrong, Game 7 vs. Cleveland I wouldn't want to be anywhere else. The old garden was like that when I was young too, loud as any building I've ever been in. But why not build a new park with 20k additional seats - so a portion of the seats are within reach for the working families - and everyone can afford to come out and see a big league game at least once? Why can't we have a Camden Yards or a Jacobs Field with all the modern amenities AND the classic look and feel of an old time ballpark?

Back to the topic though, and I'll try not to repeat any of the points made already. This would be absolutely phenomenal for the economy here if it were somehow possible. We could certainly draw a considerable amount of fans priced out of Boston. And I personally believe that a modern ballpark with 21st century amenities (Gillette opposed to old Foxboro) would be a major breath of fresh air to all fans; your average Joe - true fan of the game - who can't afford to take a grandkid to Fenway - not by a long shot - would be a big part of your market.

Transportation: If there were some type of link (trolley / shuttle / rail) to Capital Center or at least the Jewelry District (where I think we could find a place to park a few of the cars), it would alleviate some of the traffic and help out the restaurants, night clubs, bars and retail in Downcity (keep 'em here after the game and keep 'em spending). If MLB came to town we would actually need more hotels, believe it or not. I think also you'd get a bigger average crowd if 384 W to Hartford was ever finished, and this would help with potential gridlock on 95 S as well. The Providence - Newport ferry would be back and both cities would prosper.

The Allens Ave area could be the next Plant / Rising Sun / ALCO comeback neighborhood in the city. The whole state would benefit... and remember Rhode Island is very much a seasonal, heavily tourism-dependent state and baseball is a summer game. Summertime in Rhode Island, clamcakes and chowder, Del's lemonade, Grays baseball on FOX TV with shots of sailboats on the bay, colonial Newport, Providence Waterfire. Yea!!!

BUT...

Unfortunately all major league sports franchises rely on corporate sponsorships. I'm talking the big-money luxury suites, advertising, special events, etc. Rhode Island just doesn't have a big enough supply of large firms to draw from to make the numbers work. That and the construction costs make it almost impossible right out of the box.

So the question is How? How could a project like this, in a state positioned as RI is now, ever obtain financing?

Oh well... GO RED SOX! Yeahhhh!!!!!!!!!!!

[runawayjim]

Unfortunately all major league sports franchises rely on corporate sponsorships. I'm talking the big-money luxury suites, advertising, special events, etc. Rhode Island just doesn't have a big enough supply of large firms to draw from to make the numbers work. That and the construction costs make it almost impossible right out of the box.

So the question is How? How could a project like this, in a state positioned as RI is now, ever obtain financing?

[Baines]

CVS field (he personally donated for the ryan center, but perhaps the company could sponsor one)? Dunkin Donuts Stadium (there certainly is no shortage of RI money going to them)?

Citizen's sponsors the field in philly (i can't remember if it's the football or baseball stadium), yet they're headquartered here. maybe we could get them to sponsor one in their home city? or maybe RBS would be willing to? there's gtech and textron (though textron will never do something like that)

unfortunately, a lot of the money not only comes from the corporate sponsorships, but also from the state and city. that's where we run into problems.

[Lone Ranger]

there's gtech and textron (though textron will never do something like that)

[RobGritti]

I would be a fan even though I live across the country!

My Rhode Island Pride Has never left! It won't happen.

Providence had Pro-Teams when it was a much more of a relevent city!

Population then 260,000...now maybee 175,000.

I do have $5 on it though!