Charlotte Gateway Station and Railroad Improvements

[kermit]

Interesting story out of Memphis today on the potential for new Amtrak intercity routes: https://www.commercialappeal.com/story/news/2020/01/15/amtrak-nashville-tennessee-train-service-state-legislators/4477648002/

It sounds like Amtrak is currently in the process of contacting states to guage their interest in supporting new intercity routes.  The pitch in Tennessee was for a daytime service from Memphis to Chicago and service from Nashville to Atlanta.  The effort appears to be part of the new Amtrak CEO focusing on short distance routes as well as the prospect of new federal funding:

Quote

The expansion plan relies on additional federal funding Amtrak hopes Congress will approve in a revised Fixing America’s Surface Transportation Act.

Lang said Amtrak could present its vision to Congress as soon as the spring, once it has secured partnerships with interested states. 

"It's going to take anywhere from 12 to 24 months to redo the surface transportation bill," Lang said. "We think this presents us an opportunity to really transform the company."

This is relevant to us because if Amtrak is pushing for those Tennessee routes then I expect they will also push for a Charlotte to Atlanta day train, possibly DC to Asheville (as part of new SE service on the S-Line) and (less likely) Charlotte to Charleston (but I doubt SC is ready to play ball on rail). If this Amtrak expansion happens also expect to see federal  $$$ for the S-Line connection to Peetersburg and the speedier NEC service.

Edited January 17, 2020 by kermit

[j-man]

When will they start actually constructing the station buildings for this? 

[kermit]

Just now, j-man said:

When will they start actually constructing the station buildings for this? 

We still don't know (thanks to the nature of the public-private partnership)

[tozmervo]

37 minutes ago, j-man said:

When will they start actually constructing the station buildings for this? 

 

35 minutes ago, kermit said:

We still don't know (thanks to the nature of the public-private partnership)

RFPs for Charlotte Gateway Station development are due in March (I think it's March),  and the development will be awarded shortly thereafter in the Spring. I don't recall specific schedule requirements, but I suspect there's something in there that requires serviceable platforms within a certain timeframe.

[cha]

[Hushpuppy321]

I been doing research on Atlanta area Mass Transit and they really don’t have much of a robust system in relation to just how large their Metro Area is.  They have big commitments now (more counties signing onto MARTA) but I hadn’t realized how limited the Rail is - only 4 lines at 48 Miles in Length.

I hope Charlotte makes the right visionary commitments to Mass Transit.  

[kermit]

9 hours ago, Hushpuppy321 said:

I been doing research on Atlanta area Mass Transit and they really don’t have much of a robust system in relation to just how large their Metro Area is.  They have big commitments now (more counties signing onto MARTA) but I hadn’t realized how limited the Rail is - only 4 lines at 48 Miles in Length.

I hope Charlotte makes the right visionary commitments to Mass Transit.  

Atlanta did an amazing job of fudgeing up lots of federal dollars for a fancy heavy rail transit system that they didn't really want.

Atlanta was given a nearly blank check to build transit after Seattle citizens voted against accepting 80% of heavy rail transit costs from the federal government in 1968.  The city never bothered to change their zoning to encourage density around stations as they were built. In addition, the funding came at the peak of white flight into Cobb and Gwinnett counties from the city (Fulton and Dekalb counties) -- neither of the suburban counties wanted MARTA due to fears of transit bringing crime. It was just straight up racism which limited MARTA's reach -- Atlanta transit is still fighting against this bullcrap perception.

Charlotte is fortunate in three ways. First, the core of our metro is confined within a single county (while Atlanta's is spread across four) so it was harder for our suburbs to reject transit. Second, we were more than 30 years after Atlanta's transit planning so we have a much better understanding of why density is important for urban health. Third, downtown Atlanta is a relatively unimportant employment center, while ours is, by far, the largest cluster of jobs in two states. Finally, we choose light rail rather than heavy, which means our stations are much more easily connected to their surroundings (many MARTA stations are just mall-sized parking lots surrounded by nothing). Geographically, Mecklenburg is roughly the size of Fulton and Dekalb together, if we can get Union and Gaston to pay to participate in the Silver Line we will have a -much- more extensive (in a political sense) transit system than  Atlanta.

Tldr: MARTA was built 30 years before we understood contemporary urbanism. Charlotte's late start and more cohesive governing and funding structure means we are in a much better place.

 

Edited January 18, 2020 by kermit

[RiverwoodCLT]

From Twitter

 

[Yeahdoug]

Lots of work on the Gateway Station lot itself, it’s just a platform to start right? 

[Hushpuppy321]

Phase I of Gateway Station includes only the Structures, Signaling, Earthwork and temporary Greyhound Station.  Other stuff like Main Building(s), Platform, Canopy, Permanent Bus Terminal (City & Greyhound) Are all in future phases currently not under construction.

Edited January 25, 2020 by Hushpuppy321

[DH17]

7 minutes ago, ricky_davis_fan_21 said:

I think theres a chance it won't come back with any options. Lot of asks, not a whole lot of space.

Coming from a different thread - the above is relating to the RFP we should hear about relatively soon based on the original timeline (120-180 days after the 3 finalists are announced - they were announced in October).

Really interested in what comes of this - hoping Phase 2 can start by the end of this year or early 2021, but there are still a lot of unknowns.

 

[Hushpuppy321]

21 hours ago, DH17 said:

Coming from a different thread - the above is relating to the RFP we should hear about relatively soon based on the original timeline (120-180 days after the 3 finalists are announced - they were announced in October).

Really interested in what comes of this - hoping Phase 2 can start by the end of this year or early 2021, but there are still a lot of unknowns.

 

Phase II only includes additional Track Infrastructure & interim Amtrak building.  Phase III is supposed to be the large Station and Permanent Bus Terminal with some type of Private Development yet to be divulged in the forthcoming RFP.  

I think i read somewhere that Phase II is funded and will start with or without the larger RFP associated with Phase III.  I cut & pasted below:

Phase 2Edit

At an estimate cost of $49.9 million (2017 dollars), the second phase has two parts:

• 2A) Construct platform canopy; construct station building (interim condition) with full construction of concourse level and core and shell only for plaza and mezzanine levels; construct temporary surface parking and passenger drop-off area.
• 2B) Decommission existing Amtrak station on North Tryon Street.

This phase is partially funded with capital carryover from phase 1. The anticipated construction period is 2019 to 2022.^[1][11]

Phase 3Edit

At an estimate cost of $658.9 million (2017 dollars, the third phase has three parts:

• 3A) Construct greenway connection with bridge over Fourth Street, vertical circulation and retaining walls; construct bus facility, which includes structured parking and residential over retail wrapping garage (facility will serve as temporary parking for rail passengers till phase 3B is completed).
• 3B) Complete upper section of station building; extend greenway with bridge over Trade Street, vertical circulation and retaining walls; extend greenway to Bank of America Stadium; construct private development around station.
• 3C) Construct remote properties between Fifth and Seventh Streets; extend greenway to Ninth Street.

This phase is currently not funded, but is expected to be depended mostly from private developers. The anticipated construction period is 2020 to 2024.^[1]

Edited February 10, 2020 by Hushpuppy321

[#1Son]

On ‎1‎/‎17‎/‎2020 at 5:26 PM, cha said:

Does anyone have any details on how CATS will connect the Lynx Silver Line with the heavy rail Amtrak and NS freight lines at the Gateway Station?  It has been stated in the past that light rail and heavy rail aren't allowed to use the same tracks so I was wondering if the current platforms under construction account for this separation or will CATS have to build a different platform for the Silver Line?    

[Hushpuppy321]

6 hours ago, #1Son said:

Does anyone have any details on how CATS will connect the Lynx Silver Line with the heavy rail Amtrak and NS freight lines at the Gateway Station?  It has been stated in the past that light rail and heavy rail aren't allowed to use the same tracks so I was wondering if the current platforms under construction account for this separation or will CATS have to build a different platform for the Silver Line?    

Read this report - CLT Multimodal Report (Final) for Gateway Station.  It’ll shed some light.  Looks like they’re doing enough Widening for 4 Tracks total (2 Heavy Rail already existing).  Here’s the link https://charlottenc.gov/cats/transit-planning/charlotte-gateway-station/Documents/CGS MSAP - Final Report.pdf

[#1Son]

Thanks @Hushpuppy321! Looking forward to seeing this project fully developed

[Hushpuppy321]

11 hours ago, #1Son said:

Thanks @Hushpuppy321! Looking forward to seeing this project fully developed

Me too!!  FYI - the Silverline Tracks (2) will run besides the Heavy Rail/InterCity Amtrak Lines with Platforms between them to allow for Passenger embark/disembark.

[Skyybutter]

On 1/24/2020 at 8:26 PM, RiverwoodCLT said:

From Twitter

 

I'm mesmerized by how many cranes in the background of this picture! Having followed Charlotte development for 30yrs now,  I cease to be amazed at the magnitude of new projects. Charlotte is clearly positioning itself to become one of the World's PREMIER METROPOLISES! And we all have front row seats to watch as it all unfolds. 

[kermit]

https://twitter.com/CBJFahey/status/1242905518135554049?s=20

 

Edited March 25, 2020 by kermit

[Guest]

1 minute ago, kermit said:

https://twitter.com/CBJFahey/status/1242905518135554049?s=20

 

"their favorite"

heh

From what I understand they are the only one that hasn't dropped out.

[Matthew.Brendan]

“Any port in a storm”. 

[KJHburg]

from the portfolio of Republic  of DC and what we know Spectrum can do and has done here I say they are a good choice.   Look at their DC projects fantastic.

https://www.republicfamilyofcompanies.com/developments/mixed-use/

Edited March 26, 2020 by KJHburg

[kermit]

No real progress on connecting the passenger equipment yard (which looks great and is ready to go) to Gateway station. It will be possible for passenger trains to get to the storage yard from Gateway without using the main (NS will like that). This photo is under the 277 overpass, taken from the Carson exit, looking towards Gateway .  There is a nearly identical photo in this thread from about a year ago.

 

Edited April 2, 2020 by kermit

[Urban Cowboy]

[Hushpuppy321]

Totally Jealous of Denver Union Station.  They have really done a good comprehensive job making that the premiere Multi-Modal Station for that City.  I guess they benefit from being the only Major City in that State as well as the Capital.  
 

Hopefully Charlotte Gateway will turn out nice once Phase III is done in 2024/2025.

[kermit]

^ They also had a pretty nice existing station there that they could add onto.