Charlotte Gateway Station and Railroad Improvements

[dubone]

There is a park-like plaza that will be designed for people to enjoy, not an Observer- or suburban-style setback. In fact, it is actually a green roof over a CATS bus hall.

[ajfunder]

Drove by the Gateway Station site today and they were putting a fence in along trade street. What is the purpose of this fence, is greyhound building the fence or NCDOT who owns the surface lots putting it in, or is it a city project related to the DNC. I doubt it has anything to do with the station since it is still a few years off, but it is a fairly permanent looking fence.

Alex

[Spartan]

It's not station related. It definitely spruces up that block a little.

[tozmervo]

My understanding is that the Gateway was awarded to a developer team, but I can't figure out who or who is involved. In any event, there's an NCDOT document that has a conceptual rendering that's new (and probably pulled from the developer team proposals): http://charmeck.org/...eisArriving.pdf PDF page 8.

While I'm loath to comment on conceptual images, I'm a little horrified that such an early conceptual image is already so unimaginative and boring. Don't know what the background/history of that picture is (it could have been produced in a day for all I know), so I'll reserve further judgement until we see a more developed design.

Edit: On painstaking reading, I think the caption says something like "this schematic rendering is not intended to convey any specific design, aesthetic or architectural theme whatsoever"

Edited October 5, 2012 by tozmervo

[dubone]

Regardless, someone did a digital 3d design of what could go there, but having and outdoor bus area is definitely different than all the previous plans. It would take away from land left for the plaza and otherwise. I'm open minded to new designs, in fact, I do not understand why they are not incorporating a large unifying roof over the tracks and station like a lot of train stations.

Beyond that, I would love for them to realize the success of Epicenter and use the european model of a shopping center within the train/transit center. I could see a successful plan to make Epicenter II over the CTC at Trade and Brevard with an underground deck, ground floor bus terminal and then expanded entertainment center at the level of the light rail. For Gateway Station, they could potentially do something similar but more mall-like and indoor. I'm sure it will be a hard sell because there is no proof of reliability of middle class foot traffic to support retailers. But it would be nice to have a train station+ mall like most cities our size have in Europe.

[ajfunder]

I read some very fine print on that picture with the open bus area, In bold it appears to say, "This schematic rendering is not intended to convey any specific design, (a word I can't make out), or architectual theme whatsoever." This rendering has also been around for at least three months. It is intended to show all the various modes of transportation, hence the lack of the covered bus station. It also mentions all the modes of transits including "a CATS bus station in an open air environment." Whatever that means...

[dubone]

Overall these diesel buses are just generally off putting when corralled into the same place, so there there some sense to using exterior bays. Perhaps they'll put stops all around like they have on Brevard St by the CTC, (although hopefully not be so dumb as to not expand the sidewalk to curb, like they've done at Brevard).

[C_C_Planner]

Short list announced by NCDOT today for design/build of Charlotte Gateway Station: Esse Quam Videri Consortium and Hines. Presentations in late October and selection by November 1st.

[atlrvr]

What do you guys make of all of this? Looks like they are doing less decks, and no sub-grade for busses.

https://connect.ncdot.gov/letting/Design%20Build%20Program/Charlotte%20Gateway%20Station/Executive%20Summary%20-%20Feasibility%20Study.pdf

Interesting to see the P&N extension tying into the station.

[kermit]

^???

its a document from 2002?

[TotalLamer]

Interesting to see the P&N extension tying into the station.

Highly unlikely. Currently, the P&N is only in service from Pinoca Yard down to the BlueLinx lumber yard. There is a derail there and everything further, heading towards Cedar and Freedom, is out of service and has been for a few years now. Also, the track that IS still in service is just abysmal. It's scary going down there to work the few industries that are left.

Edited October 5, 2012 by TotalLamer

[dubone]

http://www.bizjournals.com/charlotte/print-edition/2012/10/12/big-names-in-line-for-gateway.html?ana=e_ph&page=all

Looks like NCDOT got two proposals from serious developers. I guess the proposals now include the rights to develop all of the land from 9th Street to 3rd Street that NCDOT owns along the tracks. This will be a huge impact for 4th Ward and 3rd Ward alike.

Not to many details yet, but at least there is interest in the partnership, which hopefully would create something really good that is both private development and public use.

[15895]

So what would happen to the current transit center again? I may be in the minority, but I like the current bus station. Especially the location.

Edited October 12, 2012 by AirNostrumMAD

[ah59396]

So what would happen to the current transit center again? I may be in the minority, but I like the current bus station. Especially the location.

I hope that thing goes away and never comes back.

[tozmervo]

this would be in addition to the CTC, which is already at capacity as it is.

[dubone]

There is no talk of replacing the current transit center. It is a goofy strategy, based on the fact that we have the two rail corridors and transit focal points downtown, with poor solutions planned to resolve it. The only official plan beyond the current bus lines is for the streetcar, while CATS pretty much has disavowed that without a replacement solution.

Regardless, there would be the Charlotte Transportation Center AND Gateway Station, both with CATS buses in the mix.

[kermit]

The ctc and gateway seperation is unfortunate but largely dictated by the existing infrastructure when the various nodes were built.

The original transit plan had the west side LRT line connecting Gateway and CTC, so it was not as isolated when originally concieved. Too bad the plan fell apart.

[atlrvr]

Boston has North and South Stations

NYC has Penn and Central Stations

Paris has Gard du every direction

London has multiple stations...

For me, I like 2 stations as it promotes 2 key employment centers and would really promote 3rd ward, though finding a way to multi-link that lines would be preferable.

Some ideas:

Commuter rail stations adjacent to current Blue Line stations at Tyvola and I-485 with the CR going from Rock Hill to Gateway Station, and obviously the Blue Line going to CTC.

Streetcar naturally links the two downtown.

Commuter rail station adjacent to BLE station at Sugar Creek with the CR going from Salisbury to Gateway Station.

Possible Silver Line could go along Indepdence and Wilklinson traversing uptown below grade and linking 7th or 9th st to Gateway.

And if I had no budget concerns and wanted to spur lots of development, run a parallel spur of Blue Line would split northwest just inbound of New Bern Station, run below grade along Dunavant, S Tryon, S Mint, S Graham, Gateway Station, N Graham, Dalton, N Tryon and reconnecting with the BLE at Eastway.

[dubone]

But until there is another mass transit line going through Gateway, it is basically a low volume station for a few commuter trains and a few Amtrak trains a day. Hardly a Gare du Nord.

[15895]

I find it interesting that bank of America was named with crescent, Little and the New York firm. I wonder what BOA would bring to the table. That and Little created Trump Charlotte, If I remember correctly, and they did a fantastic job with that.

Glad it's going to be decided upon by the end of the year

[mallguy]

What CATS should do is just to run at least some bus lines starting at Gateway and stopping by the existing bus depot, or vice-versa. Otherwise there will be NO prospect of attracting customers who commute on the commuter rail line and need to continue their trips past uptown, since to do so would take 2 transfers (1 at Gateway to something to get them to the bus depot, and another at the bus depot) or a long walk between the two stations. 1 transfer at most, with no long walk, is acceptable.

[dubone]

It would also work if they ran westbound routes from CTC with just a bus stop visit to Gateway, and eastbound routes from Gateway with just a bus stop visit to CTC. Then you could get on lots of buses to transfer to the other station, and lots of routes would serve both stations.

[DEnd]

http://www.bizjourna...a=e_ph&page=all

Looks like NCDOT got two proposals from serious developers. I guess the proposals now include the rights to develop all of the land from 9th Street to 3rd Street that NCDOT owns along the tracks. This will be a huge impact for 4th Ward and 3rd Ward alike.

Not to many details yet, but at least there is interest in the partnership, which hopefully would create something really good that is both private development and public use.

It's gonna be a $200 development... With a price tag like that even I can afford to be a serious contender.

[dubone]

Ha! Love fun typos in articles like that.

[southslider]

^^^It would also work to interline higher-ridership routes with comparable frequencies. For example, combine the #7-Beatties Ford and the #9-Central as one frequent bus route with through-routing and stops at both CTC and Gateway.