SouthEnd Midrise Projects

[KJHburg]

9 minutes ago, archiham04 said:

Asheville and Charlotte were probably on par in about 1929 as far as buildings and architecture go.   If Charlotte had preserved, our downtown would probably look similar to Asheville, Raleigh, or Winston.

Perhaps and check out my photos I took last week there in Asheville UP.  However with our huge job growth (and with  until recently Asheville grew very  slowly)  would have not allowed any of our new buildings and  they had to go somewhere. I lament some of the buildings lost but we still have some they are just buried in the skyline like Johnston Bldg and Tryon Plaza building both built in the 1920s.  Plus the Dunhill.  They just dont dominate our skyline anymore like those towers of that era do in Asheville but even that is changing there.   

[archiham04]

Asheville has a pretty consistent urban fabric that stretches several blocks in every direction.  That is what Charlotte lost and is struggling to establish.  

[Windsurfer]

I noticed a couple of blocks recently bulldozed in Asheville too.  (Sadly)

[Scribe]

34 minutes ago, archiham04 said:

Asheville has a pretty consistent urban fabric that stretches several blocks in every direction.  That is what Charlotte lost and is struggling to establish. 

I think you missed the point @KJHburg was making... In order to keep up with the pace of growth Charlotte had to make some tough choices.

The alternative was to stagnate growth or find 2x the money to preserve/incorporate existing buildings.

2 minutes ago, Windsurfer said:

I noticed a couple of blocks recently bulldozed in Asheville too.

Just wait, as long as the economy holds up, there will be more blocks bulldozed in Asheville...

[KJHburg]

Yes our growth in the 70s 80s 90s until the present caused us to knock down numerous buildings that today would have not been knocked down. Asheville and Charleston and Savannah were very stagnant in the 70s to 90s ask anyone there.  Their lack of fast growth further saved buildings.  What we need to do is concentrate on what we have now like the old hotel building on N Tryon (Hall House the red brick building) and make sure this is saved and converted to something like a hotel again or apartments.  (and I think that is the plan)  Dittos for the smaller historic buildings in SouthEnd and other intown neighborhoods.   Getting back to SouthEnd that is what Asana is planning to do with the Phat Burrito building purchase and the more historic parts of Atherton Mill are all staying.    

[archiham04]

2 hours ago, caterpillar2 said:

Before 1923, about anything in the area was wooden in structure and not durable. Charlotte really never had more than a couple older buildings with significant architectural feature since we are a comparably new city compared to Charleston, Savannah, Wilmington, and some other southern gems.  From what I have observed, I believe that if older places like the Masonic Temple, old YMCA, or other near Victorian structures had been saved, many on this board would complain about the color or the ugliness and want them leveled anyway. 

RE: Me missing the point... I was responding to this comment ^ Specifically that " Charlotte really never had more than a couple older buildings with significant architectural feature..."  My point is that Charlotte had as much architectural interest and significance as Asheville did.  The comment above implys that we really didn't lose anything.  My point is that yes we did.  if we had preserved the majority of the buildings that you think are not significant, the whole would've resulted in something similar to Asheville.

Edited October 4, 2017 by archiham04

[jjwilli]

A few places and a piece of land in and around South End that I am hoping those with more connections (looking at you RDF / Jayvee or Ely if you want to write an article) can possibly find out more details on what may be happening there.

529 West Summit Ave (Corner of Summit and Merriman) - Technically Wilmore / Gold District. Saw some runoff screens go up and did a little investigation. Looks like a 3 story office building is being proposed. Anyone have any additional info? Not a huge lot but it could be in the size range of 300 West Summit without the benefit of the slopped lot for parking purposes.

Does Camden Properties have any plans for the former "dog sitting" building that is next to their Camden Gallery apartment complex on Camden? There was a dumpster out front a few weeks back.

Last one. Palmer's Auto Shop at the corner of S. Tryon and West Worthington. It was recently sold to (I think according a google search) the group behind Atkins Properties . I am hoping this space will be a restaurant and hopefully not one of their Tide Laundry Dry Cleaning places. 

[caterpillar2]

16 minutes ago, archiham04 said:

RE: Me missing the point... I was responding to this comment ^ Specifically that " Charlotte really never had more than a couple older buildings with significant architectural feature..."  My point is that Charlotte had as much architectural interest and significance as Asheville did.  The comment above implys that we really didn't lose anything.  My point is that yes we did.  if we had preserved the majority of the buildings that you think are not significant, the whole would've resulted in something similar to Asheville.

Are you saying that you prefer what there is in Asheville (architecturally) to Charlotte?  I have been to Asheville numerous times but can't remember being awed by buildings there except Grove Park Inn.  If I am reading your message incorrectly, I apologize.  I do agree that Charlotte would have looked like a huge Asheville, but I don't see that as a good thing. 

[caterpillar2]

2 minutes ago, caterpillar2 said:

Are you saying that you prefer what there is in Asheville (architecturally) to Charlotte?  I have been to Asheville numerous times but can't remember being awed by buildings there except Grove Park Inn.  If I am reading your message incorrectly, I apologize.  I do agree that Charlotte would have looked like a huge Asheville, but I don't see that as a good thing.  Ashevilles growth pattern has not forced the city to create massive housing and business facilities in the city's center like Charlotte. Asheville is still a small town with a population <100K, 

 

[Guest]

15 minutes ago, jjwilli said:

A few places and a piece of land in and around South End that I am hoping those with more connections (looking at you RDF / Jayvee or Ely if you want to write an article) can possibly find out more details on what may be happening there.

529 West Summit Ave (Corner of Summit and Merriman) - Technically Wilmore / Gold District. Saw some runoff screens go up and did a little investigation. Looks like a 3 story office building is being proposed. Anyone have any additional info? Not a huge lot but it could be in the size range of 300 West Summit without the benefit of the slopped lot for parking purposes.

Does Camden Properties have any plans for the former "dog sitting" building that is next to their Camden Gallery apartment complex on Camden? There was a dumpster out front a few weeks back.

Last one. Palmer's Auto Shop at the corner of S. Tryon and West Worthington. It was recently sold to (I think according a google search) the group behind Atkins Properties . I am hoping this space will be a restaurant and hopefully not one of their Tide Laundry Dry Cleaning places. 

529 W. Summit. – Small Commercial building, 3 floors, way smaller than 300 Summit though. Let me look for the renderings. This used to be up on CRE sites, but i can't find it. Let me keep digging.

"Dog Sitting Building" – Camden had plans to make this a "phase 2" of Camden Gallery, it was going to be for rental townhouses. I think that is no longer the plan, and its likely that building will be upfit for restaurant/retail.

Palmers Auto – I'll see what I can find out.

[archiham04]

^^I'm not really trying to make a point about any specific building.  Charlotte had a lot of small parceled mediocre buildings in the 20s that created a diverse city.  Today it has a few dozen sterile superblocks.  If they had preserved more than a half a block of the mediocre buildings the urban envirnoment for the city would have been much different today.

11 minutes ago, caterpillar2 said:

 

 

Edited October 4, 2017 by archiham04

[caterpillar2]

55 minutes ago, archiham04 said:

^^I'm not really trying to make a point about any specific building.  Charlotte had a lot of small parceled mediocre buildings in the 20s that created a diverse city.  Today it has a few dozen sterile superblocks.  If they had preserved more than a half a block of the mediocre buildings the urban envirnoment for the city would have been much different today.

 

I would like to have seen the old Belk Building updated. It was quite a place and to think of it, so was Iveys. My dad worked in Pound and Moore building where the new tower stands on Tryon and 3rd. It was a very nice place too, but I guess they had to make room for the big stuff.  If they ever consider getting rid of the Latta Arcade, I don't know what I will do. 

[go_vertical]

5 hours ago, archiham04 said:

^^I'm not really trying to make a point about any specific building.  Charlotte had a lot of small parceled mediocre buildings in the 20s that created a diverse city.  Today it has a few dozen sterile superblocks.  If they had preserved more than a half a block of the mediocre buildings the urban envirnoment for the city would have been much different today.

 

I agree. Superblocks are pretty bad and I hate when an entire block has a homogeneous look to it. In my fantasy world every block uptown would still have about two or three old stone or granite buildings with the modern towers worked in amongst them. You would have some fairly consistent street level interaction with the occasional huge vanity lobby that CEOs so desperately need.

[KJHburg]

If anyone threatens Latta Arcade I will lead a protest all the around front and back of it. Actually with 300 South Tryon and the Charlotte Chamber on the other side I think it is protected.   

If these large banks did not build their buildings uptown they would left for the suburbs and not come back.  Unfortunately it is a tradeoff.  Again getting back to Southend that is why Atherton Mill is important to preserve (as it is)  and where my grandmother worked at Nebel Hosiery now known as Design center of the Carolinas.  Lance factory is preserved as condos as Factory South where my aunt was a cracker packer.  There are 3 major industrial buildings are preserved in SouthEnd alone.  

[go_vertical]

I think Latta Arcade would be one of the few properties in center city that people would rally behind if it became endangered.

But yes, back to southend. This 'hood and others surrounding Uptown is where what little bit of preservation Charlotte sees will happen. And I don't even think we will witness all that much in these areas. By the time uptown is built out you'll probably be able to count the significant, preserved buildings on both hands and still have a digit or two left over. Charlotte just needs to continue to develop its own style and I feel it will be quite modern (hopefully with some more of the art deco touches a few of our towers have).

[elrodvt]

^What makes you think they would even tell anyone before it was too late.

[AP3]

The base for the crane is going in today at Atherton Mill.


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[wilmore]

On 10/4/2017 at 1:09 PM, jjwilli said:

A few places and a piece of land in and around South End that I am hoping those with more connections (looking at you RDF / Jayvee or Ely if you want to write an article) can possibly find out more details on what may be happening there.

529 West Summit Ave (Corner of Summit and Merriman) - Technically Wilmore / Gold District. Saw some runoff screens go up and did a little investigation. Looks like a 3 story office building is being proposed. Anyone have any additional info? Not a huge lot but it could be in the size range of 300 West Summit without the benefit of the slopped lot for parking purposes.

Does Camden Properties have any plans for the former "dog sitting" building that is next to their Camden Gallery apartment complex on Camden? There was a dumpster out front a few weeks back.

Last one. Palmer's Auto Shop at the corner of S. Tryon and West Worthington. It was recently sold to (I think according a google search) the group behind Atkins Properties . I am hoping this space will be a restaurant and hopefully not one of their Tide Laundry Dry Cleaning places. 

This would be a really cool spot for a restaurant, and I'm not just saying that cause I live down the street. 

Something like this great place in Charleston, which was also an auto repair shop, and is kind of on a major street, would be amazing. 

http://leonsoystershop.com/ 

[ah59396]

On 10/4/2017 at 8:45 AM, KJHburg said:

Perhaps and check out my photos I took last week there in Asheville UP.  However with our huge job growth (and with  until recently Asheville grew very  slowly)  would have not allowed any of our new buildings and  they had to go somewhere. I lament some of the buildings lost but we still have some they are just buried in the skyline like Johnston Bldg and Tryon Plaza building both built in the 1920s.  Plus the Dunhill.  They just dont dominate our skyline anymore like those towers of that era do in Asheville but even that is changing there.   

You can have both.  Plenty of cities have an "old town" or "old city center".  Sorry to bring up Seattle again (it's an easy reference point for me obviously) but they've got Pioneer Square.  Certainly didn't hinder the ability for the modern city to grow up and out.  It's moot point, but I wish we could have preserved our old urban core and built either beside or around it.

[Scribe]

13 minutes ago, ah59396 said:

You can have both.  Plenty of cities have an "old town" or "old city center". 

For that to happen, the right conditions have to be in place. 

An example I personally like a lot: in NYC it took the loss of the original Penn Station  to create Landmarks Preservation Commission (IN 1965!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) for a city like NYC with so much history, it was 20 years after WW2 that they decided to take historic preservation seriously - they paid a steep price too.  Charlotte does not have anything on that scale but it does have its gems!

As I mentioned in Coffee House thread, we should probably start a thread on historic preservation. Find out the criteria that others have for preserving a building/landmark and then present examples of things that should be preserved going forward (no point in dwelling on the past unless it bolsters the possibility of preserving a current landmark).

 

The Penn Station that we lost to the current POS terminal...

 

[Matthew.Brendan]

First two are shot from behind Phat Burrito and the rest are down at Atherton Mill. 

[Popsickle]

3 hours ago, ah59396 said:

You can have both.  Plenty of cities have an "old town" or "old city center".  Sorry to bring up Seattle again (it's an easy reference point for me obviously) but they've got Pioneer Square.  Certainly didn't hinder the ability for the modern city to grow up and out.  It's moot point, but I wish we could have preserved our old urban core and built either beside or around it.

I agree with you, I love ole Town Alexandria. 

It's funny though, in 100 years people could possibly be saying, "...damn, I wish we could have saved that Ally building or that Massive parking deck in First Ward, I'd loved to have those "historic" buildings in our city".

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, Popsickle said:

I agree with you, I love ole Town Alexandria. 

It's funny though, in 100 years people could possibly be saying, "...damn, I wish we could have saved that Ally building or that Massive parking deck in First Ward, I'd loved to have those "historic" buildings in our city".

Our friends at Asana just bought like 18 properties in Ole Town. Should be interesting to see what they do with it.

[Popsickle]

3 minutes ago, ricky_davis_fan_21 said:

Our friends at Asana just bought like 18 properties in Ole Town. Should be interesting to see what they do with it.

Hopefully just collect rent...

[Guest]

18 minutes ago, Popsickle said:

Hopefully just collect rent...

They also bought FIFTY in Deep Ellum