Iroquois School Reuse by GRCS (former Ottawa Hills High School)

[fotoman311]

Thanks, Dave...I was only $22 million off...cut a guy some slack!

With all the money that GRPS is hoarding away in secret bank accounts, $22 million is pocket change.

[ModSquad]

With all the money that GRPS is hoarding away in secret bank accounts, $22 million is pocket change.

Don't get me started on that rant .

Hey why aren't the Christian School teachers crying foul that their administrators are getting ready to spend millions on a new building but not giving them a raise? After all the average private school teacher makes about $15K less than the average public school teacher.

OK-I could not resist that one...

[GRDadof3]

$8 Million doesn't seem like very much for a new elementary school.

[Allison Slater]

If they're replacing it with a smaller building, can they not just rennovate a small portion of the building -- the space they need -- and lease out the rest?

[PR-15]

If they're replacing it with a smaller building, can they not just rennovate a small portion of the building -- the space they need -- and lease out the rest?

They say they cannot...cannot...cannot afford to restore (or re-implement) any portion of the building. It's way cheaper to demo the entire historic building...and then put as little money as possible into a new structure.

I'd like to see them retain the entry and other architecturally significant portions of the building...the rest of it is a hulking mess and can be brought down...then they can build some glassy/angular pods off each side...JUST like Burton...but not as extensive.

[fotoman311]

They say they cannot...cannot...cannot afford to restore (or re-implement) any portion of the building. It's way cheaper to demo the entire historic building...and then put as little money as possible into a new structure.

I'd like to see them retain the entry and other architecturally significant portions of the building...the rest of it is a hulking mess and can be brought down...then they can build some glassy/angular pods off each side...JUST like Burton...but not as extensive.

Perhaps they need a more creative design/construction team? Or they just need to commit a little bit more money, or both. Riding by this school is one of the things that really draws me to your neighborhood. It compliments all of the beautiful brick houses around it perfectly.

[organsnyder]

Hey why aren't the Christian School teachers crying foul that their administrators are getting ready to spend millions on a new building but not giving them a raise? After all the average private school teacher makes about $15K less than the average public school teacher.

They're not crying foul because they're afraid of losing their jobs - the district is consolidating next year, after all. Even the teachers at Oakdale Christian, which put up the biggest fight to avoid being shut down, aren't speaking publicly out of a fear of the administration. The Oakdale building, btw, is also likely to be demolished. It's another grand old brick building around the same age as Iroquis.

The vast majority of teachers don't approve of the administration's plans, and haven't for years. Unfortunately, with the economy and the district's impending layoffs / early retirements, they're afraid of losing their (admittedly low) incomes.

[JAS]

They're not crying foul because they're afraid of losing their jobs - the district is consolidating next year, after all. Even the teachers at Oakdale Christian, which put up the biggest fight to avoid being shut down, aren't speaking publicly out of a fear of the administration. The Oakdale building, btw, is also likely to be demolished. It's another grand old brick building around the same age as Iroquis.

The vast majority of teachers don't approve of the administration's plans, and haven't for years. Unfortunately, with the economy and the district's impending layoffs / early retirements, they're afraid of losing their (admittedly low) incomes.

The plans looks good, but i don't be fooled, there are a lot of people who are not very happy with how Tom DeJonge handles things in that system. That is part of the reason they are losing so many families, along with the economy.

[Mark Miller]

For everyone who gave the sob story about how the Christian schools get no public money....boo hoo....and as such they are not obligated to do the right thing or to give a crap about the public realm, well it looks like they got some public money anyway. To tear down a perfectly good building.

At least one of the commissioners gets it.

So, anyone think they will make a better school??? Anyone????

GRAND RAPIDS -- By a 5-1 vote, city commissioners today approved a $712,000 grant application to help Grand Rapids Christian School Association demolish the former Iroquois Middle School in the Ottawa Hills neighborhood.

Second Ward Commissioner Rosalynn Bliss voted against the application to the Michigan Department of Environmental Quality, saying she couldn't bring herself to vote for demolition of the old building.

"I am struggling to understand how demolishing a building is environmentally sound," Bliss said. "I know it's not historic, but it's a beautiful building."

Mlive link

[Yankee Fan]

For everyone who gave the sob story about how the Christian schools get no public money....boo hoo....and as such they are not obligated to do the right thing or to give a crap about the public realm, well it looks like they got some public money anyway. To tear down a perfectly good building.

At least one of the commissioners gets it.

So, anyone think they will make a better school??? Anyone????

No one here was sobbing about any story. And no one said that the GRCS should not give a crap. And the comment about not being obligated to do the right thing is just lame and shameful.

C'mon. The building is not as bad as everyone is making it out to be. Plus, they are making a commitment to the neighborhood. They are going to put a fully functioning school building in a location that could have sat dormant and decaying for years. I think that it is great what they are doing!

And yes, I think that it will make a better school. Because again, to my point, what goes on inside a school is the most important thing, and the Christian schools consistently outperform the GRPS, albeit with less money and less support.

The old building is obsolete. It has not been used to its fullest for a long time. If it is so important to preserve, then why didn't the public schools retain it? For that matter, why didn't you buy it? What would you have done with it?

If preservation is sooo important, then where was the uproar about Alger? I loved that building. I am sure that there are a lot of people with fond memories of that old building, too.

I just think that it is crazy to be upset about this. It feels like a NIMBY moment all over, again. Why don't people just come out and say that they do not want a Christian school in their neighborhood?! Because no one seems to have a problem when the GRPS starts knocking down buildings in the name of progress; yet people are up in arms about this? It doesn't add up.

[joshleo]

I have tutored in the old building and drive by it VERY often. My children will play on the playground (when I have children) So I am very glad that the school is there.

The building is beautiful (at leas the corner details and entry way) I also think it is fantastic that a school is going in instead of the building just sitting there. If that means that we lose the architectural detail, then so be it. I think that having basketball hoops, a playground, a track, etc will keep energy in the community and also be useful to the neighborhood.

If it costs tens of thousands of dollars to keep the details, then I understand why it isn't happening.

we also must remember that the GRCS system was debating between this location and building another giant warehouse school somewhere out by 44th or east beltline. I am glad to see the GRCS moving closer to the city center.

I am curious however how this will affect the Oakdale school. They were going to separate from the GRCS if it meant they had to move out of the neighborhood with consolidation. I wonder if they will see moving a few blocks east as still in their neighborhood and therefor stay in the system.

[GRDadof3]

No one here was sobbing about any story. And no one said that the GRCS should not give a crap. And the comment about not being obligated to do the right thing is just lame and shameful.

C'mon. The building is not as bad as everyone is making it out to be. Plus, they are making a commitment to the neighborhood. They are going to put a fully functioning school building in a location that could have sat dormant and decaying for years. I think that it is great what they are doing!

And yes, I think that it will make a better school. Because again, to my point, what goes on inside a school is the most important thing, and the Christian schools consistently outperform the GRPS, albeit with less money and less support.

The old building is obsolete. It has not been used to its fullest for a long time. If it is so important to preserve, then why didn't the public schools retain it? For that matter, why didn't you buy it? What would you have done with it?

If preservation is sooo important, then where was the uproar about Alger? I loved that building. I am sure that there are a lot of people with fond memories of that old building, too.

I just think that it is crazy to be upset about this. It feels like a NIMBY moment all over, again. Why don't people just come out and say that they do not want a Christian school in their neighborhood?! Because no one seems to have a problem when the GRPS starts knocking down buildings in the name of progress; yet people are up in arms about this? It doesn't add up.

Actually, in GRTP's defense, he has been adamantly and consistently against the demolition of pretty much any of the GRPS schools, not just this one.

[PR-15]

Why don't people just come out and say that they do not want a Christian school in their neighborhood?! Because no one seems to have a problem when the GRPS starts knocking down buildings in the name of progress; yet people are up in arms about this? It doesn't add up.

Sorry, Yankee Fan...the statement that "they don't want a Christian school in their neighborhood" is complete garbage. St. Stephen School is a couple of blocks away as is Eastminster church...so we hardly have a fear of God in Ottawa Hills. I live across the street...how in the world is an expensive private school a detriment to my back yard?

The detriment comes when they tear down the ENTIRE beautiful building and put up a strip mall design that no longer fits the character of the neighborhood.

The best use for this parcel of land is to have a operating school in place (it's how they planned the neighborhood in the 1920's to begin with). I'd just rather that the dutch weren't so dutch in this case and choked out the money necessary to preserve even a SMALL portion of this beautiful, architecturally significant school. If it was a priority to them they would have found the money instead of pinched pennies.

But now the commission has approved the demolition. I expect wrecking crews to start any second so they'll only have to apologize later for putting up a cheap looking school.

[suydam]

Sorry, Yankee Fan...the statement that "they don't want a Christian school in their neighborhood" is complete garbage. St. Stephen School is a couple of blocks away as is Eastminster church...so we hardly have a fear of God in Ottawa Hills. I live across the street...how in the world is an expensive private school a detriment to my back yard?

The detriment comes when they tear down the ENTIRE beautiful building and put up a strip mall design that no longer fits the character of the neighborhood.

The best use for this parcel of land is to have a operating school in place (it's how they planned the neighborhood in the 1920's to begin with). I'd just rather that the dutch weren't so dutch in this case and choked out the money necessary to preserve even a SMALL portion of this beautiful, architecturally significant school. If it was a priority to them they would have found the money instead of pinched pennies.

But now the commission has approved the demolition. I expect wrecking crews to start any second so they'll only have to apologize later for putting up a cheap looking school.

I think the options for GRCS were likely "Spend $x,yyy in the burbs, or spend the same in Ottawa Hills."

Hooray for them spending it in Ottawa Hills.

Before you start slinging inappropriate generalizations about "the dutch" don't forget they have declining enrollment (which is the impetus for the consolidation) and declining revenues as a result.

To echo other points, there were likely two viable options: Build the school they're building with the money they have or leave that giant building (which hasn't been fully used in years) to rot.

A someone who lives within walking distance of the school, I'm glad the neighborhood will have a school.

I cannot help but feel if they'd built a "faux 1920s" school they'd be in just as much trouble.

No doubt saving pieces of the building would cost more than their current plan as you wouldn't be able fully demolish the structure before rebuildling.

[joshleo]

Now all I need to do is figure out a way to snag one of those spiral corner columns or the native american seal above the entry way when they demolish it

[PR-15]

I think the options for GRCS were likely "Spend $x,yyy in the burbs, or spend the same in Ottawa Hills."

Hooray for them spending it in Ottawa Hills.

Before you start slinging inappropriate generalizations about "the dutch" don't forget they have declining enrollment (which is the impetus for the consolidation) and declining revenues as a result.

It's cool...I'm dutch/irish. And the fact is we're a thrifty bunch.

Private schools are mostly built with private capital campaigns (donations)...enrollment is only one factor in determining the new construction budget.

It's perfectly fine for people to say they do (or don't) like the design of the new school. I happen to not like it. And we can lament the loss of great old building. I was in favor a saving a "small" portion of it...not the whole thing.

Lastly, I've heard no one raving about how wonderful the new design is...that says a lot. In some cases you only get what you pay for.

[Quercus]

Private schools are mostly built with private capital campaigns (donations)...enrollment is only one factor in determining the new construction budget.

As a graduate of GRCS, I can attest to the campaigning power of the organization. If GRCS had made an effort to preserve part of the building (the main entrance and corner "towers" seem to be most popular) I don't think they would have had any problem raising the extra cash to do so.

[organsnyder]

I think the options for GRCS were likely "Spend $x,yyy in the burbs, or spend the same in Ottawa Hills."

I don't think that's true. They just built Rockford Christian School less than a decade ago. That school is actually a big part of the reason that they're in financial trouble - enrollment has been far less than expected, and a major donor (I don't know who - I don't think it was any of the big names in GR) pulled out after the school refused to pull a popular book series (guess which one) from its library's bookshelves. In that case, I was very pleased with the administration's chutzpah.

My theory on their decision is that they (the administration, especially Tom DeJonge) don't want to ask for a dime more than absolutely necessary. They're already walking a very thin line; claiming that they're going to save money by buying a piece of property, building a new school, and shuttering three others, with little possibility of selling the old properties at good prices any time soon. I've believed all along that their math has never been sound, and I think that they recognize this as well. For DeJonge, however, consolidation has always appeared to be the end rather than the means.

I'm also a GRCS grad (GRCHS class of '02) and my family still has strong ties to Oakdale Christian, which is in its penultimate schoolyear if all goes as Tom DeJonge has planned. It's probably a good idea to note that I definitely have a pro-Oakdale bias in all of this.

[Mark Miller]

I think the options for GRCS were likely "Spend $x,yyy in the burbs, or spend the same in Ottawa Hills."

Hooray for them spending it in Ottawa Hills.

Before you start slinging inappropriate generalizations about "the dutch" don't forget they have declining enrollment (which is the impetus for the consolidation) and declining revenues as a result.

To echo other points, there were likely two viable options: Build the school they're building with the money they have or leave that giant building (which hasn't been fully used in years) to rot.

A someone who lives within walking distance of the school, I'm glad the neighborhood will have a school.

I cannot help but feel if they'd built a "faux 1920s" school they'd be in just as much trouble.

No doubt saving pieces of the building would cost more than their current plan as you wouldn't be able fully demolish the structure before rebuildling.

I say, if they are going to build suburban buildings, then build in the burbs!!!! Don't F up the city with this schlock.

[PRCH]

Bad enough we're losing a great old building, now the Press reports that the City Commission has approved a grant application to DEQ for demolition funds. "Environmental quality" indeed - demolition paid for by the taxpayers. (Somebody please post a link to the Press article; I'm too mad to try to do it myself).

[LA Dave]

Curious about the declining enrollment for Christian schools. Is part of that due to the fact that evangelical parents (who might otherwise be attracted by the schools) are home schooling their kids?

[ModSquad]

Curious about the declining enrollment for Christian schools. Is part of that due to the fact that evangelical parents (who might otherwise be attracted by the schools) are home schooling their kids?

This is getting a bit off topic, but let me take a shot at answering this question. Private schools (christian, Baptist, Lutheran, Catholic, and Non-denominational) are currently getting killed by the charter schools. I have seen some statistics from GRPS regarding student movement from year to year. On the flip side, GRPS is getting hurt exponentially by our suburban public schools. By percentage GRPS loses far less students to charters than schools like Forest Hills, Kentwood, Rockford, etc.

To me it is simply a matter of economics. GRCSA costs approximately $7500 per year for tuition!

[PR-15]

As a graduate of GRCS, I can attest to the campaigning power of the organization. If GRCS had made an effort to preserve part of the building (the main entrance and corner "towers" seem to be most popular) I don't think they would have had any problem raising the extra cash to do so.

Yes, GRCS certainly had no problem with raising gazillions for the Quest Athletic Center, DeVos Performing Arts Center and the shiny new football/track stadium...all of these new structures are dedicated to one parcel of land for the high school.

They say it's a money issue...but it's not about money.

It's about priorities...and integrating better into the historic neighborhood isn't a priority for GRCS.

[Ted]

Yes, GRCS certainly had no problem with raising gazillions for the Quest Athletic Center, DeVos Performing Arts Center and the shiny new football/track stadium...all of these new structures are dedicated to one parcel of land for the high school.

They say it's a money issue...but it's not about money.

It's about priorities...and integrating better into the historic neighborhood isn't a priority for GRCS.

He speaks truth.

[nurfle!]

Yes, GRCS certainly had no problem with raising gazillions for the Quest Athletic Center, DeVos Performing Arts Center and the shiny new football/track stadium...all of these new structures are dedicated to one parcel of land for the high school.

They say it's a money issue...but it's not about money.

It's about priorities...and integrating better into the historic neighborhood isn't a priority for GRCS.

I feel disheartened by comments like this. I don't think that's fair at all especially given GRCSA's track record of being a good neighbor in the areas it currently inhabits. I know a lot of people who work for GRCS, and they are definitely hurting despite any appearances given off by the fact that some of their buildings are new. To quote one of their teachers (who I really shouldn't name) "we've been pretty good at raising money for new buildings in the past, not so much with having money to maintain them."

I have no reason not to take them at their word as far as needing to be frugal on this. Being able to depend on the DeVos and VanAndel families when they need a (long-needed, btw) new auditorium or something is much different than having a long-term plan for financial stability. DeVos Center was delayed several years because of lack of funding until Rich DeVos stepped in (I was a CHS student at the time and many members of the classes of 2000-02 were VERY unhappy about this, myself included). Very similar situation with the athletic centers and the Gainey family and others, and Calvin College basically giving them land. I'm not sure but can guess the money they have to build this school came from similarly altruistic sources. Let's not confuse this system's liquidity with that of Forest Hills just because they're private and have a yuppie suburbanite image. I know a lot of people are suspicious of anything with a suburban-type reputation but let's not be so quick to characterize them so negatively just because we don't like the way the building looks.