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Developer proposes office tower near Lake Eola


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So, how about if we traded land and made the park even bigger... but trade for land somewhere else. Maybe for what city owns near the Arena. I love this idea.

I love Orlando downtown, but our small and confined park area is its major blemish.

That's exactly what I was going for. Trade the land from Eola Capital with something off of I-4 by the arena. That'll be a big real estate area in time.

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Constitution Green is privtely owned. The City does not have any land of value in Downtown. All of the land is in Parramore. And the only high density site is the OPD headquarters and the Centroplex. Sooo, aint happening anytime soon.

Now, in a few years the OPD site would be great. It offers great signange from I-4. And the access cannot be beat. But OPD is not moving in the imediate future.

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It would have been amazing if Orlando had been given a formal layout from the beginning. It's almost as if the original city fathers had no clue that the city was going to explode. Oh, if only they had it to do over again. As an "urban historian" I find it fascinating to look at Orlando's numbered streets which start at South St. and go go down to the 40's like Chicago. I wonder who created it and why it wasn't used throughout the city. In it's raw form, an amazing street pattern could have been created with grand boulevards and traffic circles surrounding lakes.

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It would have been amazing if Orlando had been given a formal layout from the beginning. It's almost as if the original city fathers had no clue that the city was going to explode. Oh, if only they had it to do over again. As an "urban historian" I find it fascinating to look at Orlando's numbered streets which start at South St. and go go down to the 40's like Chicago. I wonder who created it and why it wasn't used throughout the city. In it's raw form, an amazing street pattern could have been created with grand boulevards and traffic circles surrounding lakes.

it would've been like the Burnham Plan but on steroids.

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I think this is the right thread:

Save Eola Park

Working to perserve Orlando's central city park.

Historic Preservation Board Members

Jed Prest, Chairman

John Classe, Jr.

Earl Crittenden

Catherine Galgano

Catherine Price

Justin Sand

Kelly Stevens

Harold Warren

Case Manager: Richard Forbes

(407)246-3350

[email protected]

Orlando City Commissioners

District 1*

Phil Diamond [email protected]

(407) 246 - 2001

District 2*

Tony Ortiz [email protected]

(407) 246 - 2002

District 3*

Robert F. Stuart [email protected]

(407) 246 - 2003

District 4* (downtown Orlando)

Patty Sheehan [email protected]

(407) 246 - 2004

District 5*

Daisy W. Lynum [email protected]

(407) 246 - 2005

District 6*

Samuel B. Ings [email protected]

(407) 246 - 2006

City Officials

Mayor Buddy Dyer

407-246-2221

[email protected]

Chief of Staff Brie Turek

407-246-2221

Department Director

Frank Billingsley

[email protected]

407-246-2709

Land Swap deal in the works

Historic Preservation Board - Notice of Public Hearing

On Wednesday, September 3 at 4:00 PM in City Council Chambers, 2nd Floor, City Hall, the City's Historic Preservation Board will hear an application to designate four properties within the perimeter of Eola Park at the end of Washington Avenue as historic. Unfortunately, a YES vote will pave the way for the City Council to trade away current Eola Park space so that a new high rise can be built within our Park by Eola Capital. See an August 27 Orlando Sentinel article for tower details.

Please plan to attend this meeting & voice your opposition to the desination of these homes as historic. E-mail case manager Richard Forbes today, as well as every member of the City Council and demand that no more concessions be made that endangers our City's central park space.

For more details, click here.

Final Hearing - City Coucil Sept 8

City considers additional park space and height for high rise in Eola Park

It is critical that this zoning change set for final hearing next week be defeated. Approval by City Council would set a precedent for the other two buildings to come before the council in the near future. All of these building will cast long shadows into the park and lake, cause added traffic snarls, create additional parking problems, and crowd out the small amount of green space we have in Lake Eola Park.

Please plan to attend Sept 8 and e-mail the City Council asking them to vote against the zoning change on 205-215 East Central Boulevard (corner of Central and Rosalind site of proposed W Hotel & condo tower).

For more information or to volunteer to speak in opposition, please contact Jon Stine.

Forward email

Save Eola Park {sodEmoji.|} 1412 Dauphin Lane {sodEmoji.|} Orlando {sodEmoji.|} FL {sodEmoji.|} 32803

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I have to say, that I've got mixed feelings. I'mm all for development, but I don't want to lose park land. I think the City will suffer in the long run.

I want the W hotel, but at the same time, I don't want old bldgs torn down for it. sucks.

For what it's worth, consider the current buildings residing there and how they benefit you, the public, and the city. Not much there, really, eh? Then consider what the W Hotel & Residencies can bring to you, the pubic, and the city. Restaurant(s), improvement of foot traffic possibly, more income into downtown possibly...

Just my HO.

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For what it's worth, consider the current buildings residing there and how they benefit you, the public, and the city. Not much there, really, eh? Then consider what the W Hotel & Residencies can bring to you, the pubic, and the city. Restaurant(s), improvement of foot traffic possibly, more income into downtown possibly...

Just my HO.

True, but all of which they can do from an infinite number of other locations around downtown. Destroy the park and save the empty parking lots with weeds pushing through the pavement - that's our motto! Hmmm, maybe we could connect a couple of those up and build a drag strip for the tractor pull crowd that will be using the renovated Citrus Bowl!

I'm all for as many highrises as you can build but please, please put them where they actually improve things, not destroy the areas that are the best of what we already have. It's not like downtown is ANYWHERE near buildout.

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^ fourth. Need2Progress misses the whole point of our objections. We have no problem with the building. We do have a problem with the location. This park is a key reason why living in downtown is so desirable. Why does it have to be the houses or the park when there are so many other locations. This is like needing a whart removed on your hand and the only options they offer are amputation at the wrist or elbow. Damn it ... there are so many better options. By all means build the building ... but build it somewhere else.

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Fifth, the reasons you all state that 201-215 should not be built and Eola Capital is the reason they want to build there. The Rosalind and Central location already had a pretty tall building there. Doubling the height would be dramatic but not as much as building on vacant land. When the land was purchased for these sites, there was no other place to do these projects. The parking lots you all mentioned all have had proposals in the recent years. If they could have predicted the future 5 yrs ago, they may have opted to build where Tradition Towers. It would now be ridiculous to try and sell the land that they would only get half the price they paid for it, throw out all of the plans and designs that have been paid for, and start from scratch at Tradition Towers.

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As cool as it would be to have a dramatic looking highrise on that corner, especially if TT had gone up diagonally across from it, I have to agree that what is there now is better for that particular piece of land. Those older smaller buildings really do fit in to the atmosphere of Eola Park much better than a huge glass office building.

Had the buildings currently on that site been a couple of plain, non-descript one or two story concrete block boxes I would be saying knock em down & go up, up, up.

But there are too many other prime locations more appropriate for tall buildings just sitting there, so leave the park like it is I say.

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Fifth, the reasons you all state that 201-215 should not be built and Eola Capital is the reason they want to build there. The Rosalind and Central location already had a pretty tall building there. Doubling the height would be dramatic but not as much as building on vacant land. When the land was purchased for these sites, there was no other place to do these projects. The parking lots you all mentioned all have had proposals in the recent years. If they could have predicted the future 5 yrs ago, they may have opted to build where Tradition Towers. It would now be ridiculous to try and sell the land that they would only get half the price they paid for it, throw out all of the plans and designs that have been paid for, and start from scratch at Tradition Towers.

That brings up an excellent point on why government and regulation exists. The market is not free of imperfections - whether it's tulips, railroads, dot.coms or real estate, the market frequently sends out incorrect signals. Regulation such as zoning and public hearings allow the community to speak to the excesses of the market and place a value on things the community wants.

The individual developers and property owners speak to the potential of one piece of property and want to maximize its potential. However, the community realizes most of those will never come to fruition or downtown Orlando would be filled with high-rises everywhere. How many times do we have to accept poor decision-making for one piece of property, only to regret it later? See DuPont Centre II (that block has been an empty eyesore for 20 years and still no building is anywhere near breaking ground). Or Eola Heights - when the debate about limiting density there took place in the late 1980's, there were property owners and developers screaming that Orlando would be sending the signal that it disliked growth. If that's true, how did we just add more buildings downtown in one wave than ever before? Then there's just outright greed - see Steve Walsh and Lou Pearlman. What's good for the individual is not always good for the community, even in terms of economic success.

Total market decision-making is no more a panacea than total command decision-making; indeed, it's why mixed economies tend to perform best over time. Whenever I show people the "Orlando Remembered" website or show them pictures of Penn Station in New York or the National Historic Trust's gallery of treasured buildings that were demolished for questionable "urban renewal", the first question I always get is, "What were they thinking?" If we lose large chunks of Eola now, we will likely never be able to get them back. As many have noted in this space before, compared to a lot of other great cities, Orlando already has a dearth of green space.

One last thing: before the rabid free marketers start saying that I'm just a commie pinko liberal who just hates anyone out to make a profit, nothing could be further from the truth. First of all, I came up through Junior Achievement, where we were indoctrinated from a tender age to believe in the glories of entrepreneurialism and the marketplace. I subscribed to WSJ as an economics major long before I ever read the New York Times. Heck, I was even a Teen-Age Republican! (my first presidential campaign was for Gerald Ford and my first gubernatorial campaign for Jack Eckerd - yep, the drug store guy who ran against Bob Graham.)

I have long defended developers like John Portman, Tom Cousins, Cameron Kuhn and yes, Walt Disney because they were trying to make things better for everyone, even as they made great fortunes along the way. I have no problem with great men being rewarded for great vision -but what we have learned from other visionaries like Jane Jacobs is that when you destroy the past, you are often destroying a way of life in the process. Both types of people have much to offer to us and we should always listen to both sides.

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look, I think everybody's got a point, even weneed2progress. I prefer the W, for instance, to what's there now. I just know the base of the thing will be substantially larger than what's there now, and will eat into the park. do it like Central Park- no towers within the street border. maybe even build more park amenities on the park to get more people to go there and use it instead.

and as for Eola Park Center at Robinson & Rosalind, how messed up was that when they first announced that 400 footer for that lot? What a shocking proposal that was (is).

Dynetech did the most improvement for a lot so far without sacrificing anything of value that the City needed. we need more of that type of project.

again, I'm tired of losing old bldgs. I spoke to a developer recently and asked if you could build out an entire city block with 3-4 story brownstones-- office/residential. he said it's not cost effective and you have to build up. too bad. it means that we need to preserve these low rises that are old that we still have b/c there's won't be any more of them ever built again-- ever.

I like PTP, but it's got it's flaws, for example.

55W is another good example-- the new section which they tore down--- nothing really lost-- unless they never get retail up and running in there again.

now, balance everything I just said with the desire to have a W hotel downtown, which might be viable only in that location.

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Then there's just outright greed - see Steve Walsh and Lou Pearlman. What's good for the individual is not always good for the community, even in terms of economic success.

ummmm... Don't forget the city paved the way for these guys to screw up. Both parties are to blame for thier failure. If the Goverment hadn't propped up the so-so proposals they would have never happened in the first place.

And I wouldn't call you a commy... maybe just pink.. :)

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I understand with everyone's concerns about the location and do get the point. I just feel that if anything were going to go into it's place, this is most favored. Especially because it incorporates the patio/restaurant into the park where those who don't typically come to Lake Eola (say SouthWestsiders) to enjoy it, but have dinner at the W restaurant with a client or otherwise then decide that it looks nice afterall and go for a stroll. Plus being a hotel and residencies ought to increase foot traffic into the park. Yes, it could be built elsewhere, but at least here it almost forces visitors to see the park and lure them in.

As for the bird education pavillion, I like the idea! Thing is how to keep the homeless from sleeping in there? Hell, it could have an Orlando Urban Wildlife education theme... then I thought how great it would be to connect Lake Eola Park to, say The Green Swamp via green corridors. I can forego the 5-story Super Target idea between The Waverly and Capial Plaza and plant trees and such along the connection.

I understand with everyone's concerns about the location and do get the point. I just feel that if anything were going to go into it's place, this is most favored. Especially because it incorporates the patio/restaurant into the park where those who don't typically come to Lake Eola (say SouthWestsiders) to enjoy it, but have dinner at the W restaurant with a client or otherwise then decide that it looks nice afterall and go for a stroll. Plus being a hotel and residencies ought to increase foot traffic into the park. Yes, it could be built elsewhere, but at least here it almost forces visitors to see the park and lure them in.

As for the bird education pavillion, I like the idea! Thing is how to keep the homeless from sleeping in there? Hell, it could have an Orlando Urban Wildlife education theme... then I thought how great it would be to connect Lake Eola Park to, say The Greenwood Swamp via green corridors. I can forego the 5-story Super Target idea between The Waverly and Capial Plaza and plant trees and such along the connection.

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Long ago... say the 1920s and 30s the city was going to connect all the lakes with green ways/parks. Delany park and lake cherokee it about as far as this plan went. This is also why the vast majority of the lakes in Orlando have parks around them and not homes on thier shores.

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is there any way to make Lake Eola Park larger?

In Chicago, there's a few roads that traverse Grant Park. It's funny, b/c in the ORL, there's quite a few parks and they're dispersed around town-- even the museums are in a park-- just not in downtown.

Maybe if they did a park service Lynx route like Lymmo- but not dedicated lanes, that connected Eola to Loch Haven to some of the other notable parks with stuff there.

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