The Vatican reported today that its ok to believe in aliens.

[sean]

"if you've seen it in Star Trek, we've already done it"

[cityboi]

Yeah, like flip phones!

[Justadude]

Religious people usually do look to their priests, pastors, amans, etc. for moral/spiritual guidance and advice, but I think we can agree that they would have no more knowledge about or divine insight into the acceptability of belief in aliens than anyone else.

[Charlotteman]

When I lived in Florida I had Baptist neighbors who believed that "aliens are demons"........and that UFOs, if they exist, are the work of the devil.

At least the Vatican is more progressive in their outlook.

[nowensone]

I don't think that your typical member of the clergy would claim to have more knowledge or insight than the average person. However, these people have spent in most cases the great majority of their lives closely studying scripture and engaging in deeply complicated theological issues. In that respect, they most certainly bring more to the table in these arguments than your average Joe off the street. I know that I certainly couldn't match a Vatican priest point-for-point in a theological debate, and I suspect that not too many of our forumers would last very long either.

At face value, the Vatican's opinion on extraterrestrials seems trivial. But it's actually an issue that derives from a centuries-old issue over the divine design of the universe. To make an extremely long story extremely short, for the majority of Christian history it was believed that the universe was designed explicitly for humans -- that the animal kingdom, heavenly bodies, and so forth are all designed specifically for us, and that we are at the literal and philosophical center of the universe. This was why Galileo ran into so much trouble when he posited that the earth was, in fact, nowhere near the center of our solar system let alone anything else.

Over the past few centuries the Catholic Church has gradually let go of that medieval point of view and actually become a relatively progressive body in regard to certain scientific issues, pushing for theological acceptance of evolution and global warming and so forth. The Vatican's decision on extraterriestrials is simply another step toward modernizing their stance on such issues -- it officially recognizes that the divine purpose of the universe need not necessarily be limited to Planet Earth, that our biosphere might be only a part of a much greater cosmic drama. It's a long way from acknowledging the possibility that we might have spiritual peers on alien planets, but it's certainly a movement in that direction. And if they were to arrive at such a conclusion, it would effectively be the end of homo-centric Catholic theology... not a sexy subject but a very significant one for Western culture.

[runawayjim]

To the average person, yes, you're right, they are experts in scripture and can make a better educated "guess" about the issue, or at least that they couldn't find anything explicitly forbidding the belief in aliens. From the average person's perspective. From my perspective, I want to know that they referenced biblical text in it's original language, and referenced discarded pieces that have been pulled out through the centuries. But I want them to give virtually no weight to most New Testament materials since from a historians standpoint they are suspect. Ditto things edited by past priests and popes.

All that is said not to inflame, merely to suggest that if the Catholic Church wanted to find evidence that we should not believe in aliens it probably could. Therefore people should come to their own conclusions on things that aren't explicit/obvious, or that they do not feel to be right. For example, a close friend lives in Rome who has about a year left of his 5 year seminary training/study. We are still close but have had some fairly intense discussions about certain views, still currently upheld, concerning women and the church. To me, that is something that we should choose to follow our hearts on, ignoring the official doctrine if need be. After all, we know what the bible says on that subject. So it seems that belief in aliens would not be any different.

[cityboi]

Well I agree the earth wasnt created in (7) 24 hour days. There is even scripture in the Bible that says a day in God's time is like a thousand years.

[Justadude]

From my perspective, I want to know that they referenced biblical text in it's original language, and referenced discarded pieces that have been pulled out through the centuries. But I want them to give virtually no weight to most New Testament materials since from a historians standpoint they are suspect. Ditto things edited by past priests and popes.

[Charlotteman]

I always wondered how organized religions would react to an alien contact, and the confirmation that man is not alone in the Universe.

In the Vatican's view, or in fundamental Christians' eyes, would an alien have to "accept Jesus and become a Christian" in order to go to heaven? .........even though Jesus wasn't born on their planet. (?)

The answers to lots of important questions would certainly be forthcoming from a superior race. Any way ya look at it, alien contact would shake organized religion to it's very core.

[Gusterfell]

I'm hardly an expert on theology, but given what I do know about the subject this doesn't really surprise me. The Catholic Church holds the biblical story of creation to be a metaphor rather than literal truth. Given that, there is no reason to assume God's creation of life was limited to this one planet out of thousands.

Genesis was written in a time when the earth was believed to be the center of the universe, and the concept that it was just one of many planets was unthinkable. Given that context, it is understandable that the creation story focuses on earth. I see this announcement as the Church's way of keeping its theology up to date with the scientific likelihood that some form of extraterrestrial life exists.

[nowensone]

I don't think that your typical member of the clergy would claim to have more knowledge or insight than the average person. However, these people have spent in most cases the great majority of their lives closely studying scripture and engaging in deeply complicated theological issues. In that respect, they most certainly bring more to the table in these arguments than your average Joe off the street. I know that I certainly couldn't match a Vatican priest point-for-point in a theological debate, and I suspect that not too many of our forumers would last very long either.

At face value, the Vatican's opinion on extraterrestrials seems trivial. But it's actually an issue that derives from a centuries-old issue over the divine design of the universe. To make an extremely long story extremely short, for the majority of Christian history it was believed that the universe was designed explicitly for humans -- that the animal kingdom, heavenly bodies, and so forth are all designed specifically for us, and that we are at the literal and philosophical center of the universe. This was why Galileo ran into so much trouble when he posited that the earth was, in fact, nowhere near the center of our solar system let alone anything else.

Over the past few centuries the Catholic Church has gradually let go of that medieval point of view and actually become a relatively progressive body in regard to certain scientific issues, pushing for theological acceptance of evolution and global warming and so forth. The Vatican's decision on extraterriestrials is simply another step toward modernizing their stance on such issues -- it officially recognizes that the divine purpose of the universe need not necessarily be limited to Planet Earth, that our biosphere might be only a part of a much greater cosmic drama. It's a long way from acknowledging the possibility that we might have spiritual peers on alien planets, but it's certainly a movement in that direction. And if they were to arrive at such a conclusion, it would effectively be the end of homo-centric Catholic theology... not a sexy subject but a very significant one for Western culture.

[cityboi]

I agree. Who says God did create a universe full of intellegent life. Space is alot like how the oceans seperated man on earth. It possible that God sent Jesus to their planets as well. There is nothing in the Bible that says thats not the case.

[runawayjim]

That wasn't aimed at the newspaper editorial, but the tone and stance of your reply: that the clergy spends a majority of their lives studying scripture, and that their ability to debate theology is beyond our own. As to the rest, I don't disagree that the church is attempting to modernize it's views, but the praise here is a little unwarranted given that it ignores the elephant in the room which are the things it is NOT modernizing it's views on.

[nowensone]

^ I had already mentioned the issue of women earlier, but you just addressed a huge one - homesexuality - and glossed over it, what more do you require? And I 'm pretty sure that, while not spoken about much any more, there is still the hard-line belief that one who is not a Judeo/Christian is practicing the wrong religion and is destined for hell. There are more, but if those aren't elephants to you then not sure anything would be.

I am not attacking Catholicism just to clear that up, but the idea of praising them here, it's more than a little incongruous.

[runawayjim]

^ I had already mentioned the issue of women earlier, but you just addressed a huge one - homesexuality - and glossed over it, what more do you require? And I 'm pretty sure that, while not spoken about much any more, there is still the hard-line belief that one who is not a Judeo/Christian is practicing the wrong religion and is destined for hell. There are more, but if those aren't elephants to you then not sure anything would be.

I am not attacking Catholicism just to clear that up, but the idea of praising them here, it's more than a little incongruous.

[Charlotteman]

..........catholics, believe it or not, are actually pretty accepting of homosexuals.

[Justadude]

That wasn't aimed at the newspaper editorial, but the tone and stance of your reply: that the clergy spends a majority of their lives studying scripture, and that their ability to debate theology is beyond our own.

[satalac]

[Choirboy622]

When I lived in Florida I had Baptist neighbors who believed that "aliens are demons"........and that UFOs, if they exist, are the work of the devil.

At least the Vatican is more progressive in their outlook.

[nowensone]

Their ability to debate theology is in line with the fact that they have received years (often decades) of related higher education and practical experience. Frankly I find it rather arrogant for a layman to assert that they can easily match theological wits with an archbishop. That would be like myself claiming that I can do math just as well as Stephen Hawking. I might be good at certain types of math within my own intellectual boundaries, and could even have such an inflated view of my own abilities that I would willingly enter a debate with a professional physicist, but someone with an advanced degree would wipe the floor with me because 90% of what they have studied is completely incomprehensible to me. Similarly, the "nuts and bolts" of Vatican debates are not newspaper material; editorials like the one we're debating are simply a generalized summary of the debate presented in common language. They are intended as a means of educating the general public about the nature of the debate, not presenting iron-clad proof of an argument. If you want the real guts of the issue, go to your local seminary and I'm sure they can provide you with relevant documents.