Transit Agencies in South Carolina

[GvilleSC]

This will be interesting to see play out... Could it be that CAT's attempts to become a more regional transportation provider have limited its ability to properly serve its original base? Maybe the far flung destinations should either fork up more money, or be cut?

[Spartan]

I would think that the longest routes that are least used would get axed first.... like the route to Anderson.

[monsoon]

It seems to me that it is so short sighted to remove mass transit because fuel prices have risen. Instead they ought to be increasing transit.

[Greenville]

It seems to me that it is so short sighted to remove mass transit because fuel prices have risen. Instead they ought to be increasing transit.

They aren't being short-sighted at all. It's a funding issue, not a conscious decision to cut bus service. It's not like the CAT decision-makers were sitting around one day and decided to cut bus routes for the heck of it.

They have been quite innovative to have a fare-free system from the beginning, and it has worked quite well. I think it's obvious that they believe in mass transit and want to see it work. Now CAT needs more money to offset increasing fuel prices, so how do you propose that they come up with it?

Keep in mind that charging fares to Clemson students is not likely to work - at least not in the traditional sense of having fare boxes as you board the bus. One option might be to have "fares" built into tuition somehow, sort of like an activity fee.

[knightrider162]

They aren't being short-sighted at all. It's a funding issue, not a conscious decision to cut bus service. It's not like the CAT decision-makers were sitting around one day and decided to cut bus routes for the heck of it.

They have been quite innovative to have a fare-free system from the beginning, and it has worked quite well. I think it's obvious that they believe in mass transit and want to see it work. Now CAT needs more money to offset increasing fuel prices, so how do you propose that they come up with it?

Keep in mind that charging fares to Clemson students is not likely to work - at least not in the traditional sense of having fare boxes as you board the bus. One option might be to have "fares" built into tuition somehow, sort of like an activity fee.

I believe we already have that as a transit fee.

[crescentmoon]

One option might be to have "fares" built into tuition somehow, sort of like an activity fee.

Yes, that is indeed already done and is the major source of funding.

[GvilleSC]

Short sighted? The Nation's largest fare-free transit system was not short sighted to reach its current status and state, and it's not likely to begin now. It's an economic issue.

[monsoon]

Ahh so the alternative is to put more cars on the road. It's short sighted. They need to adjust the funding to increase ridership, not decrease it.

[GvilleSC]

Ahh so the alternative is to put more cars on the road. It's short sighted. They need to adjust the funding to increase ridership, not decrease it.

Who on here has said that you have to put more cars on the road??

Some peoples' lack of willingness to understand or try to contribute constructively to threads is the only shortsighted thing I've seen... anyone else?

It's a funding issue. From my experience on the system, the importance of it running at the same or similar capacity as before is an important one to the livelihood of many residents and students alike. I think someone will come up with some more funding for the protection of their constituents route(s). The University should not foot the entire bill, if any.

[monsoon]

....

Some peoples' lack of willingness to understand or try to contribute constructively to threads is the only shortsighted thing I've seen... anyone else?

.....

Indeed, take your own advice. We don't approve of boosterism to the exclusion of all else.

All transit systems are having to pay higher energy costs whether it be diesel, gasoline or electricity. The more progressive ones are finding other ways to deal with the issue over cutting service. If you want examples we can discuss them but we first have to have a "willingness" as you put it, on your part, to address the shortcomings of cutting transit because energy is more expensive.

[GvilleSC]

Indeed, take your own advice. We don't approve of boosterism to the exclusion of all else.

All transit systems are having to pay higher energy costs whether it be diesel, gasoline or electricity. The more progressive ones are finding other ways to deal with the issue over cutting service. If you want examples we can discuss them but we first have to have a "willingness" as you put it, on your part, to address the shortcomings of cutting transit because energy is more expensive.

Can I ask, what do you know about Clemson Area Transit?

As a rider myself, I can tell you that there are ways to cut service without decreasing riders. How many bus systems in the US can you think of that have 24 hour service (especially in an area the size of Clemson?)?

And, can we discuss the additional ways "to deal with the issue over cutting service"? It's a lot harder when you're serving financially strapped small towns (Pendleton, Seneca, Clemson, Westminster, and Central).

[breed]

While I am not intimately familiar with the CAT, I imagine that there may be some political maneuvering going on. I'd be surprised if they cut routes, or at least in any meaningful way. I imagine that much of this talk deals with trying to help solicit funding from other sources, primarily because the costs of running the system have skyrocketed.

[Spartan]

There are general principles of transit that you can apply to any transit system, and CAT is not special in that regard. At the very least you all should be respecting varying opinions, even though you disagree with them. The funding situation, however, is very unique since most of it comes from student fees. It might be worth looking at the fee and perhaps increasing it- assuming it has not been raised in many years- to cover some of the costs along with cutting some routes or service in certain areas. In addition, the contribution from the other towns should be re-evaluated.

I think that regardless of any other decision, they need to remain a 24 hour bus service. That is critical to the success of the CATbus.

This is a great example of the transit paradox.

[monsoon]

.....

This is a great example of the transit paradox.

I don't understand how the word "paradox" can be applied to this situation. Mass transit is paid for by one or both of two methods: Direct User fees and/or taxes. In the case of CAT, the tax is apparently the fee on students. They pay it whether they use the bus or not. This is no different than any municipality charging a sales tax, or car rental tax, or just paying out of general funds to support its transit system. As the system grows the transit agency is going to have to spend more to keep it working.

[Spartan]

The paradox being that as fuel prices go up, more people need become transit dependent, and transit companies have to make up for the excessive fuel costs usually through increasing user fees or fare-box rates, thus impacting the people who need transit the most.

The fee is on the students and the several municipalities in the area who choose to pay into the system.

I'm not disagreeing with you though. I think they should raise the fee, particularly with whatever they change the municipalities.

[Captain Worley]

We were in Seneca last week, and were amazed at the CAT station by Ramcat Alley. Do they really have that many riders?

[Spartan]

I was told that its been more successful than they thought it would be. I have seen ridership data in the past, but it was right after they started the routes... That CATbus platform is the "hub" for Seneca. There are 3 routes that converge there... one connects to Clemson, the other two only serve Seneca. Its also a free transit system to the community, so people are going to be more inclined to take it.

CATbus Map

[GvilleSC]

According to an article in the Greenville News, CAT has decided to cut its Maverick Route to the Central Walmart. It will also revamp its campus services.

I applaud the cutting of the Maverick route. It was under utilized and too infrequent to be appealing over using a car.

I'm glad to see that as of right now the Red Route will remain untouched. I hope that the campus routes don't put the campus in chaos. If they could devise a system to run more buses at class change times and cut back during class (but still run fairly often), it would save some gas. As it stands now, any less frequent bus service on campus (Blue and Orange) would cause an uproar among the student body. It's frustrating as it is now when you're late to class because 4 buses that were at capacity have passed you by...

[gman430]

According to an article in the Greenville News, CAT has decided to cut its Maverick Route to the Central Walmart. It will also revamp its campus services.

I applaud the cutting of the Maverick route. It was under utilized and too infrequent to be appealing over using a car.

And how are people who don't have a car supposed to get to Walmart? Do you expect them to ride a bicycle on Highway 123, which is a 4-lane highway with no shoulder?

[GvilleSC]

And how are people who don't have a car supposed to get to Walmart? Do you expect them to ride a bicycle on Highway 123, which is a 4-lane highway with no shoulder?

The Walmart route has only been in business for a couple years. How'd people go before? Anyway, if they truly need to get to Walmart, then they can connect (for FREE) to Electric City Transit's buses and visit the Anderson Walmart. Problem solved.

[Spartan]

The hassle factor of taking the red route all the way to Central and then changing busses to go down to walmart was huge. That is the perfect route to cut. IMO they should also cut the Bridge Route.

[knightrider162]

The hassle factor of taking the red route all the way to Central and then changing busses to go down to walmart was huge. That is the perfect route to cut. IMO they should also cut the Bridge Route.

They cut the bridge route and the university is replacing it with a van.

http://www.clemson.edu/newsroom/articles/2...cat_routes.php5

[gman430]

I don't get it. Gas prices are high and more people want to use mass transit. How are they supposed to when transit services like CAT are cutting back on service?

[knightrider162]

I don't get it. Gas prices are high and more people want to use mass transit. How are they supposed to when transit services like CAT are cutting back on service?

It is due to CATbus's funding situation. They don't collect money from fares so, when gas prices go up and the University is squeezed and has to divert some of its support, the buses suffer. It is not a perfect situation, but they are still maintaining most of the routes.

[GvilleSC]

I don't think some people realize how extensive CAT's service really is. This isn't Greenlink we're talking about. CAT's cutting back is still going to leave it as South Carolina's #1 transit system.