First Horizon Park - Home of the Nashville Sounds

[arkitekte]

 

This is absolutely pathetic. I forgot who's responsible for this (design wise), someone please remind me.

 

I've always been a fan and true believer that feeling enclosed at any outdoor event makes that event much better, particularly with sports. Now obviously there's limitations to how enclosed you can feel with only 10,000 seats, but materials and massing will go a long way. This ish looks like little league. Why not eliminate seating as you approach the foul pole, stack that additional seating and create a back drop with the suites that are well above concourse level? This park is awkward. Pringles Park in Jackson looks better holding hands with Delta Faucet and I-40. 

 

I'm an urban planner and believe me at times I think *quickly* designing and approving something is the right move to spur development, particularly in a situation like this to where this $75 or so million can be replaced in 30 years, but good grief this is a fail. The surrounding area could very well create or recreate an urban feel, but this stadium isn't going to help it much, if anything this amount of taken space might keep any cohesive walkable urban fabric from solidifying. I'm ranting, but I generally try to take the good out of every situation, because you're stuck with it. I've commonly used the "balling on a budget" line for why some developments simply look like crap, but this isn't one of those situations. 

[MLBrumby]

I'm glad I'm not the only one disappointed here.  Our ATT park looks great in comparison... and bigger, although it's probably a third smaller. It sits a lot more prominently on the hill at the edge of downtown.  On game day, people walk from blocks around to the game and it's just a fun time. The program barker at the front gate is also fun to hear. She's an institution. 

[rookzie]

This is absolutely pathetic. I forgot who's responsible for this (design wise), someone please remind me.

 

I've always been a fan and true believer that feeling enclosed at any outdoor event makes that event much better, particularly with sports. Now obviously there's limitations to how enclosed you can feel with only 10,000 seats, but materials and massing will go a long way. This ish looks like little league. Why not eliminate seating as you approach the foul pole, stack that additional seating and create a back drop with the suites that are well above concourse level? This park is awkward. Pringles Park in Jackson looks better holding hands with Delta Faucet and I-40. 

 

I'm an urban planner and believe me at times I think *quickly* designing and approving something is the right move to spur development, particularly in a situation like this to where this $75 or so million can be replaced in 30 years, but good grief this is a fail. The surrounding area could very well create or recreate an urban feel, but this stadium isn't going to help it much, if anything this amount of taken space might keep any cohesive walkable urban fabric from solidifying. I'm ranting, but I generally try to take the good out of every situation, because you're stuck with it. I've commonly used the "balling on a budget" line for why some developments simply look like crap, but this isn't one of those situations. 

 

thankyou, thankyou!! (well said critique!)

-==-

[Nathan_in_DC]

This is highly unlikely, but maybe, just maybe, it's a bad shot that doesn't do a good job of showing what the stadium will feel like from the inside. It looks like it is taken from an elevated position that could make the seating look smaller than it actually is?

(Just trying to find some sort of silver lining here...)

[titanhog]

It's just from one of their construction cams, so it can definitely give a skewed view of the place.  I would imagine we should all hold judgment until we see it in person, but it's still pretty easy to see it's not going to be a major "showplace."

[bigeasy]

At least hold judgement until it is finished people. I just don't understand why the members on this site rarely, if ever, have anything positive to say about the developments in the city. I am sure there is a project somewhere we can be positive about? I am not going to say the park is a failure before they even hold one game at it. The lighting sucks in the picture, the field is not finished, the seats are not done, the outfield still needs work, and I am sure there is a long list of other things that need to be finished. Just breath people, it is not done. The features that make this park what it was planned to be are not even represented in this photo. 

 

Maybe we would get a better park if attendance was higher. The Isotopes had over 200K more in attendance in 2014. Memphis had 60K more. Also, I am guessing our 2014 numbers were higher due to it being the last year as well. In the Pacific Coast League we were 14 out of 16 in attendance. (51 overall in Minor League)

Edited March 23, 2015 by bigeasy

[AgentNorth]

I see it the other way. I believe in the good ole saying of "if you build it they will come." If our stadium looked anything like the auto zone park in Memphis, our attendance would go through the roof. There are so many who go to sporting events for the "experience" and not just the game itself. Theres no "experience" factor with this stadium. Better love some baseball, because it looks more bland than some college stadiums. You would think that going to a sounds game, would seem like a huge step up from a Vanderbilt game. Won't be the case with this stadium.

[Bezoar]

Today's view.  

 

[CenterHill]

Today's view.  

 

 

Everything looks better in the sunshine.  

 

There was mention of the number of permanent seats being smaller than Greer.     I wonder what the additional capacity of the outfield berms will be?    One of the articles said GA tickets for berm seating (standing) would be $7.   Less than the price of a beer.    

 

I do hope the greenway (that's it in the foreground) will remain open during games.     

[arkitekte]

At least hold judgement until it is finished people. I just don't understand why the members on this site rarely, if ever, have anything positive to say about the developments in the city. I am sure there is a project somewhere we can be positive about? I am not going to say the park is a failure before they even hold one game at it. The lighting sucks in the picture, the field is not finished, the seats are not done, the outfield still needs work, and I am sure there is a long list of other things that need to be finished. Just breath people, it is not done. The features that make this park what it was planned to be are not even represented in this photo. 

 

Maybe we would get a better park if attendance was higher. The Isotopes had over 200K more in attendance in 2014. Memphis had 60K more. Also, I am guessing our 2014 numbers were higher due to it being the last year as well. In the Pacific Coast League we were 14 out of 16 in attendance. (51 overall in Minor League)

 

There's rarely any building that honestly needs the final product with every screw and mullion in place to tell whether or not it was done right. Out of all of the projects that we have going on in Nashville, large or small, boxy or boxy, can we honestly say "throughout construction I was worried, but now that it's complete the design was well thought out."? 

 

This is a water melon to a grape comparison, but in a sense they're geared to do both; spark development. Was there at any time through construction of the MCC where we were at all worried about the final product? Maybe the green roof or the guitar on top, but that stuff is menial to the final product. If an 80% complete photo of the interior of a ballpark has people like "what is this noise" then there's cause for concern. 

 

Form follows function and all of that jazz, size of any stadium or house for that matter doesn't dictate how well it's done. If the features of the park aren't shown in the photo, then this shouldn't be a ball park. I've said it before, don't expect much from firms that put out those generic Revit renderings. If you can't graphically display your design in an appeasing manner, then that will carry over to the final product. 

Edited March 24, 2015 by arkitekte

[UTgrad09]

Out of all of the projects that we have going on in Nashville, large or small, boxy or boxy, can we honestly say "throughout construction I was worried, but now that it's complete the design was well thought out."? 

 

It's complete now, but one that sticks out is the Homewood Suites on West End. It's not a spectacular piece, but the rendering looked awful, but what came out of construction actually looked decent.

[bhibbs]

I cant see all photos posted on here while at work....hopefully this one hasnt been posted already:

[MLBrumby]

Speaking of hotels, I'm a little surprised that a limited service hotel of 150+ rooms has not been announced for this part of town, chiefly adjacent to the ballpark.  So where is the closest hotel?  Would it be the Capitol View hotel when that gets built?  Or one across the river?

[UTgrad09]

Speaking of hotels, I'm a little surprised that a limited service hotel of 150+ rooms has not been announced for this part of town, chiefly adjacent to the ballpark.  So where is the closest hotel?  Would it be the Capitol View hotel when that gets built?  Or one across the river?

 

I'd say the Doubletree is the closest. 1/2 mile to the edge of the stadium. Actually, a lot of the downtown hotels would be considered within walking distance. Aside from that, I don't think anyone sane would stay at the hotels across the river.

 

Not sure exactly where the hotel at Capitol View will be, but it wouldn't be any closer than the Doubletree.

[nashmoney]

I was checking out the Nashville sounds website for ticket info and found these pics that make me feel a little bit better about the stadium

 

firsttennesseepark.com

 

 

 

 

 

 

Nice pic from Aerial innovations!

 

Edited March 25, 2015 by nashmoney

[Vrtigo]

Yeah, that fisheye lens on the construction camera does not lend itself to an awe-inspiring picture--nor was it ever intended to.

 

As an aside, my company just announced our annual Summer shindig is going to include attending a Sounds game. I presume we'll end up with one of the private fieldside boxes, so I'll definitely be taking some photos while we're there.

Edited March 25, 2015 by Vrtigo

[donNdonelson2]

Go to the website for a better look at the park photos. Most of them do not have the distorted "fisheye" effect. The ballpark looks pretty good in the shots they've posted. I am optimistic that we will be pleased with the results.

[Hey_Hey]

Imagine the view when Paramount sprouts up in the midst of the other buildings in the CBD.

[Guest]

Imagine the view when Paramount sprouts up in the midst of the other buildings in the CBD.

Are you holding your breath? I'm not.

[BnaBreaker]

Are you holding your breath? I'm not.

 

Any particular reason?  Or are you just generally a pessimistic person?

[Guest]

Any particular reason? Or are you just generally a pessimistic person?

Total opinion, but based on the following reasons.

Swinging for the fences should be commended, but this is big time fantasy. 60 story 700' tall tower even in a hot market is very difficult to pull off. I doubt few understand the level of difficulty of a project when it soars over the current market. This is based on risk, not on ability.

Four architects have been attached to the project (six if you count previous proposals). Tony doesn't have private equity in the amount it takes to build a sixty story tower (few do) which means he is at the whim of the bank. Sixty stories just sounds like fantasy -- the costs of building explode over 400 feet due to the 911 provisions in the new IBC (international building code). Even the other big ambitious proposals I've seen lately none approach this kind of height in a market that doesn't have a 40 story residential building... Much less a 700 foot tall one.

Chicago architects are also used to a different market. That means a seasoned construction industry that understands prime materials and methods of construction. This market has never seen a real "premium" product regardless of what the developers try to sell. Mature markets like San Fran, New York, or Chicago laugh at what these things are selling for.

So add it all up... banker's are risk averse + new product and construction methods to a region + huge price tag + huge equity requirement + lots of other "easier" projects = low likelihood.

[UTgrad09]

Total opinion, but based on the following reasons.

Swinging for the fences should be commended, but this is big time fantasy. 60 story 700' tall tower even in a hot market is very difficult to pull off. I doubt few understand the level of difficulty of a project when it soars over the current market. This is based on risk, not on ability.

Four architects have been attached to the project (six if you count previous proposals). Tony doesn't have private equity in the amount it takes to build a sixty story tower (few do) which means he is at the whim of the bank. Sixty stories just sounds like fantasy -- the costs of building explode over 400 feet due to the 911 provisions in the new IBC (international building code). Even the other big ambitious proposals I've seen lately none approach this kind of height in a market that doesn't have a 40 story residential building... Much less a 700 foot tall one.

Chicago architects are also used to a different market. That means a seasoned construction industry that understands prime materials and methods of construction. This market has never seen a real "premium" product regardless of what the developers try to sell. Mature markets like San Fran, New York, or Chicago laugh at what these things are selling for.

So add it all up... banker's are risk averse + new product and construction methods to a region + huge price tag + huge equity requirement + lots of other "easier" projects = low likelihood.

 

It certainly isn't anything close to a sure thing, but I think you might have a different perspective, or at least a better understanding had you met Tony at our forum meet. 

[Guest]

It certainly isn't anything close to a sure thing, but I think you might have a different perspective, or at least a better understanding had you met Tony at our forum meet.

I should clarify that I REALLY would love to be wrong here.

[UTgrad09]

I should clarify that I REALLY would love to be wrong here.

 

And I'm not saying you won't be right, either. It is definitely a big, ambitious project. A lot of things have to fall in place for it to happen. 

 

One of the reasons for the redesign was to make this project realistic. 

 

I do think this sort of project has a window of time in which it can become reality. The market is red hot right now. If it is still red hot when construction can begin (more than a year away), then it is a possibility. If the market cools, then this will likely have to be shelved again.

[Paramount747]

Paramount discussions need to be in the Paramount thread, but I agree. Nashville's tallest tower will be the ATT for sometime. Nashville is a sub 500 foot city which is fine. Although I love tall buildings, a.k.a Paramount, hence my avatar, is a bit of a dream at this point.