Venue Tower at the BOB - 20 Monroe Live - House of Blues/Live Nation Venue

[Khorasaurus1]

1 minute ago, joeDowntown said:

Do your sources have any ideas on when they may announce plans? I'm sure this has a lot of hurdles to go through with the Kent Country board, sale of property, etc. etc. 

I do think a venue north of the S-Curve would be great (but also wonder what happens to the area previously targeted for the Amphitheater). 

Joe

If it's north of the S-Curve, then there's no County Board issue, correct? 

Related question - the steam plant is basically a fixed object, right? It can't really go anywhere? Seems like it's going to become kind of a sore thumb surrounded by so many active urban uses. 

 

[Cookin_peacocks]

1 hour ago, joeDowntown said:

Do your sources have any ideas on when they may announce plans? I'm sure this has a lot of hurdles to go through with the Kent Country board, sale of property, etc. etc. 

I do think a venue north of the S-Curve would be great (but also wonder what happens to the area previously targeted for the Amphitheater). 

Joe

No, I know that through the city, they are thinking a few years down the line at most. 

 

Other source just says they're leaning heavily on north of 131.

[GRDadof3]

1 hour ago, joeDowntown said:

Do your sources have any ideas on when they may announce plans? I'm sure this has a lot of hurdles to go through with the Kent Country board, sale of property, etc. etc. 

I do think a venue north of the S-Curve would be great (but also wonder what happens to the area previously targeted for the Amphitheater). 

Joe

Now that the city has picked up the tab to remove the largest hurdle, the sewer line move, I think the land south of the s-curve will be ripe for development. Even if the amphitheater goes in north of the s-curve (which I hope it does). The Market and Fulton site is so large it could totally be an amphitheater and casino/mixed use/residential. Does anyone see the Amway families embracing a casino there though? 

I just want to see this happen:

[Cookin_peacocks]

I've literally debated walking in and asking the people who work in there directly, but I am too socially awkward to do it with any finesse unless I'm drunk (and at that point, I'm still awkward, just unaware)

 

Come on, dad. Bite the bullet. Walk in and ask 

[Chester Cheeto]

Gun Lake is likely going to be busy with their property south of Wayland to get too involved with anything downtown anytime soon. Their casino could potentially be much more visible from 131 in the near future, like Firekeepers visible, just on a smaller scale. I don't think they would want to vulture themselves by drawing people away from their current location.

https://www.500nations.com/casinos/miGunLakeCasino.asp

I didn't want to say anything because it hadn't been announced as far as I knew, but I just found this article so it must not be too big a secret, too bad they don't have a rendering of the hotel.

[GRDadof3]

37 minutes ago, Cookin_peacocks said:

I've literally debated walking in and asking the people who work in there directly, but I am too socially awkward to do it with any finesse unless I'm drunk (and at that point, I'm still awkward, just unaware)

 

Come on, dad. Bite the bullet. Walk in and ask 

The people who would have the answers (Tom Welch, Carol Van Andel, Dick Devos and the Grand Action board) you won't find sitting in the office there. It's probably just a receptionist, if anyone. 

In looking at their website, I know one person who sits on their advisory committee personally. I could reach out to her....  I don't think anyone else would talk to me, haha. 

Did you mean yourself "Dad" or were you addressing that to me Dad.  

[joeDowntown]

1 hour ago, NoDustBusterNoMore said:

Gun Lake is likely going to be busy with their property south of Wayland to get too involved with anything downtown anytime soon. Their casino could potentially be much more visible from 131 in the near future, like Firekeepers visible, just on a smaller scale. I don't think they would want to vulture themselves by drawing people away from their current location.

https://www.500nations.com/casinos/miGunLakeCasino.asp

I didn't want to say anything because it hadn't been announced as far as I knew, but I just found this article so it must not be too big a secret, too bad they don't have a rendering of the hotel.

There an article on woodtv from may where they talk about the next expansion (hotel). They’re just finishing the interchange they footed the bill for. I’d have a hard time seeing Gun Lake cannibalize what they built out on Wayland for a huge complex downtown. Maybe they wish they could have built downtown years ago but to build some shiny hotel downtown would probably cut their business on wayland by50-60% (if not more). 

im not opposed to a casino downtown, but they aren’t the huge draw they were made out to be years ago. What I think would be more interesting is a bit of an upscale, boutique casino downtown with card games and a sports book (and very few slots) that caters to a younger (sub 70) crowd. I’ve heard of small, boutique casinos like this before. 

unless someone knows something, I think we’re all basing this on GLC having naming rights to a venue that is now transferring ownership. Probably a pretty weak link to speculate a huge casino being built downtown…

Joe

[ZAP!]

13 hours ago, Khorasaurus1 said:

If it's north of the S-Curve, then there's no County Board issue, correct? 

Related question - the steam plant is basically a fixed object, right? It can't really go anywhere? Seems like it's going to become kind of a sore thumb surrounded by so many active urban uses. 

 

A steam plant is an active urban use as far as I'm concerned — a city can't be all tasting rooms and boutique hotels. That said, the steam plant isn't only full of immobile equipment. It exists at the nexus of a massive, underground network of steam pipes that crisscrosses a huge swath of downtown, so I'd doubt if anything could reasonably be done to it. I'm no steam engineer, though.

[Khorasaurus1]

5 hours ago, ZAP! said:

A steam plant is an active urban use as far as I'm concerned — a city can't be all tasting rooms and boutique hotels. That said, the steam plant isn't only full of immobile equipment. It exists at the nexus of a massive, underground network of steam pipes that crisscrosses a huge swath of downtown, so I'd doubt if anything could reasonably be done to it. I'm no steam engineer, though.

Obviously the steam plant is important to have. It's just that it has no street level activity and, well, produces a bunch of steam that floats over the area. 

[GRDadof3]

5 hours ago, ZAP! said:

A steam plant is an active urban use as far as I'm concerned — a city can't be all tasting rooms and boutique hotels. That said, the steam plant isn't only full of immobile equipment. It exists at the nexus of a massive, underground network of steam pipes that crisscrosses a huge swath of downtown, so I'd doubt if anything could reasonably be done to it. I'm no steam engineer, though.

I like the steam plant. I think it adds texture to downtown. 

[GR_Urbanist]

I've always loved the steam plant as well. The massive cloud of steam in the winter is very beutiful especially when the sun is out. Gives it a film noir look at night.

The only change I would like to see is for them to de-brick its windows, and put our beloved Steam Pig out front.

[grandrollerz]

I like the steam plant too, but it needs to say "i'm a steam plant" cuz it looks kinda industrial and polluting.  A good old greenwashing of the whole corner.  Murals on the whole thing touting the benefits of steam, etc, etc.

and does anyone know if there is a reason that none of the smoke (err steam) stacks and the substation can't be screened and hidden?  I think the same thing about the  substation next to the new SH/GVSU parking ramp. It sticks out.   I get they serve a purpose, but it could look better

 

[GRDadof3]

6 hours ago, grandrollerz said:

I like the steam plant too, but it needs to say "i'm a steam plant" cuz it looks kinda industrial and polluting.  A good old greenwashing of the whole corner.  Murals on the whole thing touting the benefits of steam, etc, etc.

and does anyone know if there is a reason that none of the smoke (err steam) stacks and the substation can't be screened and hidden?  I think the same thing about the  substation next to the new SH/GVSU parking ramp. It sticks out.   I get they serve a purpose, but it could look better

 

The steam plant was renovated not long ago to add more transparent windows, to see the inner workings and for the windows to look nicer. Almost feels like it could be updated again. 

I do agree the electrical substation thingy on the Western side is a bit electronica. 

 

[Cookin_peacocks]

On 2/11/2022 at 5:02 PM, GRDadof3 said:

The people who would have the answers (Tom Welch, Carol Van Andel, Dick Devos and the Grand Action board) you won't find sitting in the office there. It's probably just a receptionist, if anyone. 

In looking at their website, I know one person who sits on their advisory committee personally. I could reach out to her....  I don't think anyone else would talk to me, haha. 

Did you mean yourself "Dad" or were you addressing that to me Dad.  

You! I know it's just receptionists I'm sure, but they have to know SOMETHING.

[cstonesparty]

16 hours ago, Cookin_peacocks said:

You! I know it's just receptionists I'm sure, but they have to know SOMETHING.

The receptionists at most places know EVERYTHING.  

[GRDadof3]

17 hours ago, Cookin_peacocks said:

You! I know it's just receptionists I'm sure, but they have to know SOMETHING.

I love your optimism. Go for it!

[wingbert]

On 2/12/2022 at 12:01 PM, GR_Urbanist said:

The only change I would like to see is for them to de-brick its windows, and put our beloved Steam Pig out front.

I could be wrong, but I think there are bits and pieces of the steam pig scattered around outside Schmohz brewery 

[Khorasaurus1]

This building and wall in Detroit hide a substation. They're not perfect, but there are some design features that could be replicated at the GR site: https://goo.gl/maps/QaqAa7UHFzVxg9ui9

I particularly like the decorative gate, compared to the chain link at the GR site. 

In typical Ilitch-land fashion, of course, the substation has the most care put into it out of anything on the block...

[joeDowntown]

1 hour ago, wingbert said:

I could be wrong, but I think there are bits and pieces of the steam pig scattered around outside Schmohz brewery 

I've noticed that too. Definitely Steam pig.

I agree, I love the steam plant. I do think they could do a bit better job with the fencing around the substation though.

Joe

[Cookin_peacocks]

3 hours ago, wingbert said:

I could be wrong, but I think there are bits and pieces of the steam pig scattered around outside Schmohz brewery 

The two jet turbine looking things? Is there any more of it?

[localtalent]

On 2/10/2022 at 4:09 PM, cstonesparty said:

I keep coming back to two complexities that may be involved with this deal (pure speculation)…. Tribal involvement and gambling.  To move either of those properties into tribal ownership isn’t there a process of putting the property into trust that goes through federal government?  And additional complexity if it includes gambling licensing?

It's not gambling related.  The tribes wouldn't want to pull traffic from their existing properties in the area.

[Prankster]

25 minutes ago, localtalent said:

It's not gambling related.  The tribes wouldn't want to pull traffic from their existing properties in the area.

Whatever the use may be, it sounds like they will run it like the McKay Tower, which they also own. 

When they bought it a few years ago, they said that they were trying to diversify their holdings and investments away from just gambling. 

Not sure what the final product will be for the BOB, but it will probably be used as a similar investment. 

[joeDowntown]

2 hours ago, Prankster said:

Whatever the use may be, it sounds like they will run it like the McKay Tower, which they also own. 

When they bought it a few years ago, they said that they were trying to diversify their holdings and investments away from just gambling. 

Not sure what the final product will be for the BOB, but it will probably be used as a similar investment. 

Does anyone actually have any indication that the Gun Lake tribe is buying it? They have naming rights right now, and we seem to have made some giant leap (with little or no evidence) that they are purchasing 20 Monroe Live.

Joe

[GR8scott]

5 hours ago, localtalent said:

It's not gambling related.  The tribes wouldn't want to pull traffic from their existing properties in the area.

If true that’s too bad as I’m not sure what would have a better tourism impact than a casino and the previous bob

[GRDadof3]

5 hours ago, joeDowntown said:

Does anyone actually have any indication that the Gun Lake tribe is buying it? They have naming rights right now, and we seem to have made some giant leap (with little or no evidence) that they are purchasing 20 Monroe Live.

Joe

True Joe. There were a lot of rumors it was going to be a hotel. People seemed pretty confident of that. It might be AHC.