Downtown Norfolk Progress

[graysonelijah 15]

Here's a few stats from the 2008 downtown report card:

Downtown employees:

30,000

Downtown residents:

3800

Students at downtown

Norfolk

[graysonelijah 15]

Here's my take on the progress going on downtown.

With 3454 housing units downtown, we can expect the population to increase to about 5,000 within the next year or two.

With all the new buildings coming online, we can expect employment to increase.

With TCC expanding, we can expect more students at the downtown campus (adding daytime population to the city)

Downtown hotel rooms will continue to increase.

[Mobius57 0]

Im young(and hip?) and want to live in downtown but am afraid i cannot afford it now.

[graysonelijah 15]

I dunno If this will help, but not too many young people can afford to live in the new luxury apartments, but if you look in some of the apartments on granby, some rent for half of what they're asking for in the belmont, 201, etc.

[Mobius57 0]

Grr.. i keep listenting for news on the westin but hear none.. westin westin westin westin :0

i like the building reder too much

[Telmnstr 1]

I dunno If this will help, but not too many young people can afford to live in the new luxury apartments, but if you look in some of the apartments on granby, some rent for half of what they're asking for in the belmont, 201, etc.

Where? 411 Granby or whatever that place is (which I have beef with, damage on my car from when I was looking at apartments, and the beotchs at Cooke And Neff said they weren't responsible even though their sales guy told me to follow him through the gate). I think it was around $1100 for a 1 bedroom or 2 bedroom? So-called hardwood floors (some cheap laminate junk). Built to milk the young. Probably good for bringing home "something to poke on" from the bars tho :-)

The building I'm in has emptied out quite a bit. It's probably one of the more affordable joints. Crusty appliances, crusty HVAC results in high power bills. . A friend was in the building across the street till he moved in with his girlfriend out in VaBeach, and said that 3 units in that building are now available.

Actually, if you take the future prospects of the USA, figure in that much of the income has come from construction, building and financing of that construction, the huge overrun in housing, the sheer overpricedness of housing compared to the income of the people (especially when you remove all the money made FROM that same housing), I'd say... these people building these things are right stupid! Think about how many high end McMansions are all over Hampton Roads. Where I grew up, dropping my dox, on Butts Station Road. Across the street? $700K+ neighborhood. Down the road on one side, the nice field? $600K+ homes. The other field? $300-400K townhomes and homes running up to $2+ million. None of this existed. Where'd all the money come from? What hugely successful businesses rake in the dough and distribute it to their employees like that? How many of those people themselves were involved in the housing/construction/finance world themselves, and were telling themselves they were it, and that they were so smart and good that their new income would continue to roll in at that level forever, only to have it stop?

Once someone goes through a foreclosure and their credit gets wacked, I'm willing to bet the morons that built these fancy apartment buildings are going to reject those people based on failed credit check. Remember, up until very recently it took more credit worthiness to rent an apartment than to (in some cases) buy a $700K home.

I don't mean to be a downer on this all the time, but these are thieves that committed this fraud and there is little to no punishment being extended. If anything, the people (bankers) who helped drive this are being rewarded.

[lil-bear 40]

Looking to the future when light rail is operational, the Macarthur Station will open up the possability for at least two more towers. The block just south-east of the station is the big monsterous city garage, and the parcels just to the west of the station where two small buildings now stand would be ripe for redevelopment.

I think that one day it could be feasible! Anyone agree?

[lil-bear 40]

macarthur station site

Here is a link on Google Maps!

I wanted to copy the pic and draw on it for references, but i don't know how!

Edited July 30, 2009 by lil-bear

[graysonelijah 15]

I truly think once the recession is over, unemployment is back to normal, lending isn't so complicated, we will get a couple more towers.

[brikkman 69]

macarthur station site

Here is a link on Google Maps!

I wanted to copy the pic and draw on it for references, but i don't know how!

I get upset everytime someone mentions that station. So much potiental down the drain.

[mistermetaj 29]

I get upset everytime someone mentions that station. So much potiental down the drain.

What is so wrong with having a good public green space in the city? Norfolk has relatively few of them and TPP is very disconnected to the city. I think it is a great idea.

The real potential for more development lies in the stand alone parking garages that are still littered throughout the city. That's where we could use some more DE like towers.

[brikkman 69]

What is so wrong with having a good public green space in the city? Norfolk has relatively few of them and TPP is very disconnected to the city. I think it is a great idea.

The real potential for more development lies in the stand alone parking garages that are still littered throughout the city. That's where we could use some more DE like towers.

Just thought that should have been the best station on the line, especially if you are going to tear down a building. The green public space, not really feeling it, not right now. If it were that much demand for greenspace, I think we would have seen more people on the lot next to MacAuther center and across from it where they are building the TCC building. I actually liked that little area, good transistion from the mall to granby street and when they had dj's and things out there, people seem to just hang around. Not saying it couldn't happen in this new green space, just wished they would have step back from that idea just a tad and consider other options. Also, I think it was a great opportunity for something unique to the city to be placed there.

[graysonelijah 15]

It still will be the best station on the line, if theydo it right with the cafe's, newstands, etc.

The best place for a tower at this time is the lot next tothe courtyard by mariott.

[Telmnstr 1]

The final chunk of library comes down this afternoon or tomorrow.

Friend that lives over in Ghent said vacancies like mad. They were gonna move to a different apartment that was much better/nicer and a cheaper or the same cost, but got screwed by a 90-day-notice-before-lease-is-up-or-it-auto-renews clause.

[virginia pe 9]

Looking to the future when light rail is operational, the Macarthur Station will open up the possability for at least two more towers. The block just south-east of the station is the big monsterous city garage, and the parcels just to the west of the station where two small buildings now stand would be ripe for redevelopment.

I think that one day it could be feasible! Anyone agree?

That parking garage is not city-owned. It is owned by Bank of America.

I do not see the Monticello Arcade (the building immediately east of Dominion Enterprises) being torn down any time soon. And City Centre is relatively new, and I think Norfolk Southern may be a major tenant, so the building should be financially solid. I think a developer could find other sites for a tower that would be easier to develop than having to tear down those two buildings.

I still think the most logical place for a tower near Macarthur Station is above the station.

[brikkman 69]

I still think the most logical place for a tower near Macarthur Station is above the station.

Hi-Five

edit:

Also would have been nice if they block the street next to the library and build out so that the footprint could be larger thus creating a more dynamic use for the building other than just business.

But I guess Norfolk getting getting LRT is the most unique thing that's going to happen in the near future (so sad).

Edited July 31, 2009 by brikkman

[mistermetaj 29]

That parking garage is not city-owned. It is owned by Bank of America.

I do not see the Monticello Arcade (the building immediately east of Dominion Enterprises) being torn down any time soon. And City Centre is relatively new, and I think Norfolk Southern may be a major tenant, so the building should be financially solid. I think a developer could find other sites for a tower that would be easier to develop than having to tear down those two buildings.

I still think the most logical place for a tower near Macarthur Station is above the station.

I would hope that no one would ever try to rip down the monticello arcade. It should be a Norfolk landmark by now.

[lil-bear 40]

I would hope that no one would ever try to rip down the monticello arcade. It should be a Norfolk landmark by now.

I never mentioned ripping the arcade down......I was talking about the City Centre building and the small building the houses the maritime association or something.....

Both of them are small insigificant buildings! I will predict that eventually a larger tower will take that plot of land.

It's front doors could be facing the LR station!

Time will tell!

[Telmnstr 1]

Oh teddy bear, if you rip down those buildings you mention I'll have to sit outside!

City Centre is actually way different than it looks! I had no idea until I had to go in past the Chartway branch. It's 4 floors.

It's a shame the waterfall thing is gone. I noticed (and it was confirmed) that long ago there was a water fountain thing on the 2nd floor that had water that fell down a funky wall to the 1st floor around the elevators.

They tore down the last part of the library last night, and it was dark out so the automatic 30 second camera was firing the flash which causes a reflection. Grrr.

Guess I'll let it go through the entire construction of the new site.

[graysonelijah 15]

I'm not for tearing down any active/ occupied buildings downtown, they need to build on the parking lot by the Courtyard by Mariott before they consider that, && after that they can tear down some of the density killing parking garages (Dominion Tower, Waterside, Town Point, York Street, etc.) I'm fine with there being no building on top of this light rail station, it's gonna be an amazing green/ open space in the center of our downtown. With green space being taken by TCC Student Center, later by a development on third tower lot (not that that's the most appealing space anyhow) there will come a time when you all will be glad the city left this space open.

[mlsimons 0]

I'm not for tearing down any active/ occupied buildings downtown, they need to build on the parking lot by the Courtyard by Mariott before they consider that

I hope something awesome/tall is built there too, but I'm also willing to wait for light rail and the new courthouse complex to be built...then that property will be really worth something, which means that building high will be the best option. That whole intersection will look really dense and urban one day, that surface lot is the last best spot for a downtown high-rise.

[graysonelijah 15]

Yeah, thing is, will there be demand for a skyscraper any time soon? Hotel market could be saturated, same with residential. Office? Who knows. I think all development of high rises needs to wait a couple years for a whole lot of demand to build, then build something at least 40 stories. I mean for real, will we be stuck in the 20-26 range foreveer? It's very unappealing.

Edited August 3, 2009 by varider

[mistermetaj 29]

Yeah, thing is, will there be demand for a skyscraper any time soon? Hotel market could be saturated, same with residential. Office? Who knows. I think all development of high rises needs to wait a couple years for a whole lot of demand to build, then build something at least 40 stories. I mean for real, will we be stuck in the 20-26 range foreveer? It's very unappealing.

Here is an idea, how about they tear down the BB&T building and BoA building and consolidate all of the office workers from there to a new 40 story building. It would add a large tower to Norfolk and rid us of two ugly highrises. One can always dream...

[Telmnstr 1]

Well if the rich get richer and the poor get poorer, perhaps all the businesses that succeed will wind up in class A space (skyscrapers), and all those that don't go away?

The BB&T building isn't bad inside. I used to work in there for a small tech company that went out of business. It was kind of neat because the company employed some of the "rock stars" from the world of the NetBSD operating system. The company started out in New York City, but they hired a CEO that happened to live in Virginia Beach, and he went ahead and got the office space in Norfolk.

Bank of America? I wish they'd go under. Between moving good paying jobs to India (from Hampton Roads), to their bad customer support and practices, to their taking of TARP and getting ready to pay billions in bonuses, to their security telling me I'm not allowed to take photos of their building from the public street, I'd rather see it on fire.

They already use a big portion of the NS tower as well.

But if anything, new business models are less people, more profits.

Companies like APEX (the people that make the crappy DVD players) use a model where there is like 13 or 23 Americans that work for the company. They outsource all R&D, engineering and manufacturing to China. They brought in like $13 billion in $$$$.

(Yes the Waffle Iron BofA building is kind of ugly. They could pimp it out with architectural lighting. They made their signs much larger already.)

Then you got Bank of Hampton Roads that has naming rights on TWO buildings downtown. Hell's tower (Dominion Tower) and the other ugly one. Yet the customer can't go to the Dominion Tower place and do anything. I used them. Nice people. No returns, no able to wire money to china for goods, etc. There is really no reason for them to exist.

Edited August 3, 2009 by Telmnstr

[graysonelijah 15]

Don't tear down Bank ofAmerica. Wait a couple years, get some suburban based companies to relocate, maybe some out of town companies, and build a 40 story office tower on the Courtyard lot. 10 floors of parking, 1 floor of retail, 1 maintenence floor, and 28 floors of office!