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^^^ someone has been in the Charlotte O archives today LOL.  I was at the grand opening of CityFLOP I mean Cityfair look for me amongst the crowd.  Plus I attended my MBA classes at UNC-Cityfair on the 3rd floor above the food court.  

Edited by KJHburg
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11 hours ago, KJHburg said:

^^^ someone has been in the Charlotte O archives today LOL.  I was at the grand opening of CityFLOP I mean Cityfair look for me amongst the crowd.  Plus I attended my MBA classes at UNC-Cityfair on the 3rd floor above the food court.  

Say what you want about CItyFair, it was always busy at lunch (at least for the 4 years I was uptown).  Now at night, it failed there for sure. 

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2 minutes ago, Cityplanner said:

Yes, it was always packed for lunch.  At least in the 1990s.  It wasn’t that nice of a building; maybe if it were more elegant or architecturally interesting that might have helped.

What stores were there when it first opened (other than the food court)?  By the ‘90s it was just office space and a food court.

Z Gallerie, Fat Tuesday,  Benneton from my memory.  the food places did great but the retail not so much.  

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here is the urban format Target many of you desire for uptown or Southend.  I think it would work better in Southend.  This is one on Hillsborough St in Raleigh and there is another on the ground floor of office tower in downtown Chapel Hill.   I have been to the one in Chapel Hill and I would describe it as a Walgreens on steroids.  Meaning it sells high volume items in this case some Carolina apparel etc.  

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I regularly shop at urban Targets in Manhattan.

I do because that’s the only realistic option; a regular Target is too far away.

An urban Target is better than no Target but if a regular Target is reasonably close by, shopping at an urban Target makes no sense: why go to a store that has 1/4 the selection of one that’s also close by?

With a real Target at Midtown, the only reason I see to have an urban Target is to have one right in the middle of Uptown, for office workers who need something and it doesn’t suit to stop at Midtown on the way home to get it.

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I think SouthEnd should get a full size Target. Maybe an entire metropolitan type development.

Specifically, there is this are in Merrifield, VA I went to before. The Dunn Loring & Merrifield area reminded me of Charlotte so I go every now and then when I want a taste of home.

It’s more urban than it looks (apartments, street level retail, etc) 

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I would love a copy of that to go where that trailer park is in SouthEnd. Maybe it is too close to metropolitan. Which is a shame because I’m not the biggest fan. The only part that isn’t completely covered by parking deck is a few food places along the busy road. The Target side has a normal sized drive-thru and the parking deck is ridiculously covering most of the development. 

Edited by AirNostrumMAD
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Yes, Can't believe Target and Best Buy and Trader Joes signed on to this design.  They lack inviting front entrances at Metropolitan.  Parking garages covering up everything.  A striking example of the fact that just because developments are vertical, doesn't mean they're pedestrian-scaled and appropriate for urban vitality.  

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4 hours ago, RANYC said:

Yes, Can't believe Target and Best Buy and Trader Joes signed on to this design.  They lack inviting front entrances at Metropolitan.  Parking garages covering up everything.  A striking example of the fact that just because developments are vertical, doesn't mean they're pedestrian-scaled and appropriate for urban vitality.  

some of the best performing sales per sq foot in the region, just cant imagine why they would sign on.

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5 hours ago, RANYC said:

Yes, Can't believe Target and Best Buy and Trader Joes signed on to this design.  They lack inviting front entrances at Metropolitan.  Parking garages covering up everything.  A striking example of the fact that just because developments are vertical, doesn't mean they're pedestrian-scaled and appropriate for urban vitality.  

Agreed re: lack of great design; it may be that Target and Best Buy had built similar multilevel "big-box" shopping centers before in the same style and figured it made sense to use the same design, just as other retailers have similar designs for shopping centers that they anchor.  The outer boroughs of NYC have a few Target-anchored shopping centers that are similar....meaning that the Bronx and uptown Charlotte have similar retail designs.

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17 hours ago, The Real Clayton said:

some of the best performing sales per sq foot in the region, just cant imagine why they would sign on.

Hi Snark.  My comment wasn't a critique of the commercial opportunity of the location.  I mean, while there are several vacancies at Metropolitan and while there is always room for improvement, Target is a big brand that people follow and Target wouldn't be there if Metropolitan didn't make commercial sense.  The point was the missed opportunity that the design represents.  Instead of a pedestrian-friendly design encouraging people to gather and linger...something akin to a walkable shopping village or shopping main street, people generally park and get what they need and get back in their cars and drive away.

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18 hours ago, The Real Clayton said:

some of the best performing sales per sq foot in the region, just cant imagine why they would sign on.


You think the Target and Wendy’s add to the urban fabric of the city and is a great walkable development and aesthetically inviting? Great walkability and interacts great with the sidewalk?

 

I completely  disagree.

Edited by AirNostrumMAD
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1 hour ago, AirNostrumMAD said:


You think the Target and Wendy’s add to the urban fabric of the city and is a great walkable development and aesthetically inviting? Great walkability and interacts great with the sidewalk?

I completely  disagree.

He was just saying that despite the urban design, the location is what mattered to the retailers that signed on to Metropolitan. There are very few "big box" locations in close proximity to the high income zip codes in Dilworth, Eastover, Elizabeth, Myers Park, South End, et.  If you want access to that population of consumers the Metropolitan is a pretty good location as a retailer. 

Despite the favorable income demographics though, the population in that area is very dependent on driving and loathes the Metropolitan parking structure. Unless you have the type of gravitational pull as Trader Joe's, people don't like going there. Hence some of the retailers are extremely successful like Target and Trader Joe's, while others seems to struggle and you have the tough lease for the Floor 3 vacant Staples... unless you are a truly amazing store, nobody will want to park up there. 

Edited by CLT2014
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54 minutes ago, CLT2014 said:

He was just saying that despite the urban design, the location is what mattered to the retailers that signed on to Metropolitan. There are very few "big box" locations in close proximity to the high income zip codes in Dilworth, Eastover, Elizabeth, Myers Park, South End, et.  If you want access to that population of consumers the Metropolitan is a pretty good location as a retailer. 

Despite the favorable income demographics though, the population in that area is very dependent on driving and loathes the Metropolitan parking structure. Unless you have the type of gravitational pull as Trader Joe's, people don't like going there. Hence some of the retailers are extremely successful like Target and Trader Joe's, while others seems to struggle and you have the tough lease for the Floor 3 vacant Staples... unless you are a truly amazing store, nobody will want to park up there. 


I get all that but we were only talking about the urban design not being great.
 

And if it came across as anything but discussing urban design, well, oops - that wasn’t the intention. 
 

 

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28 minutes ago, AirNostrumMAD said:


I get all that but we were only talking about the urban design not being great.
 

And if it came across as anything but discussing urban design, well, oops - that wasn’t the intention. 

Got it. I agree on the design. Isn't really great for anything. If it wasn't for the location and lack of competition for big box locations in that area, it would be a colossal flop. It is like everything bad about a suburban shopping center design met everything bad about urban life and collided into one giant parking garage purgatory. 

Edited by CLT2014
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On 2/1/2021 at 9:28 AM, RANYC said:

Hi Snark.  My comment wasn't a critique of the commercial opportunity of the location.  I mean, while there are several vacancies at Metropolitan and while there is always room for improvement, Target is a big brand that people follow and Target wouldn't be there if Metropolitan didn't make commercial sense.  The point was the missed opportunity that the design represents.  Instead of a pedestrian-friendly design encouraging people to gather and linger...something akin to a walkable shopping village or shopping main street, people generally park and get what they need and get back in their cars and drive away.

Hii!!!

So, I do absolutely agree its design is not the best. However, based on its adjacent lack of walkable population density, its relatively poor transit connectivity, and the fact that none of the adjacent mixed-use developments have ever materialized — other than Pappas's midtown project which has become a hospital annex vs a mixed use community — I'm not sure Metropolitan is destined to be a urban destination. Throw a street car down Harvey Gantt St to Kenilworth to East Blvd on the other hand... now then Metropolitan becomes a urban destination. Despite being so close, its simultaneously so far.

Edited by The Real Clayton
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Late to the conversation, but I worked at the Metropolitan Target for 3 years in college, I had cart duty from time to time (very dangerous in that deck) and often had to go to the lower levels to retrieve carts. I can't count how many people had to ask me "how to get to Target" from there. Including my own mother. When the Metropolitan was built, whoever was tasked with the design clearly was worried that if they made it too urban (IE; no visible parking) they might drive away customers. As a result you have a ground level space that is virtually invisible (not to mention the former Staples/Marshalls space across the street) and a deck that wasn't even full on black friday, even pre-covid when the entire Target building was occupied. 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Generally in this part of the country auto parts stores are found in areas of a city where people do their own auto repair, minor to major. These areas tend to cluster near the Pay Your Utility Bills/We Cash Checks/Quick Loan stores (Almost-a-banc) and off brand mobil phones/ minutes stores. They are large and franchised, but fit conveniently with smaller local owned personal service businesses. Use Google maps for Charlotte and search Auto Parts stores and see that the affluent wedge of south Charlotte has none, unless you count South Boulevard and Monroe Road. 

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  • 2 years later...

The decade when shopping malls were the rage!!  Charlotte had Eastland Mall which was the largest along with Southpark which underwent it's first major renovation in the latter part of the decade and downtown Charlotte boosted two department stores during that time frame.  Freedom Mall was a vibrant center along with Midtown Mall (where the Metropolitan is located).  

https://www.thepeoplehistory.com/80sclothes.html

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