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tozmervo

MLS in Charlotte - 2021

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Not much changed but this is what was shared two months ago by Jenkins Peer at a community event 

https://www.mecknc.gov/ParkandRec/CapitalProjects/Documents/MemorialSadium_Pubilc Meeting Boards.pdf

Biggest takeaway is more permanent seats than the rendering that was shared prior.  In all reality it's the same architect that contributed to UNCC's football stadium and we're getting a clone with some "historical elements" in center city.

Cool PDF though showing the greenway integrating with the site of the stadium.  I want to say someone at the meeting mentioned more relating to public access to Memorial when an event wasn't going on but I'm drawing a blank now.  Hopefully more information comes out sooner or later on the progress.

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20 hours ago, elrodvt said:

No shade?? 

Ultimately, I think this is the best option. I can see the initial team playing in BOA for the first few years, but eventually leveraging their profits and savings towards Memorial Stadium. It just makes sense to use the stadium in this manner. I consider this to be where the public funds are really expended, and eventually private funding can contribute to the shade structure and expansion of concessions/luxury boxes. 

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On 4/23/2019 at 7:00 PM, tozmervo said:

The renovation will enable the field to be used in multiple ways for a variety of sports and events, and it will not inhibit future construction of tiered seating, etc. What exactly are you looking for?

I'm looking for them not to cheap out on everything they do. I would rather reduce scope and build some iconic buildings that will attract people. A good example is Denver's Union station. A bad example is CLT upgrades or seemingly most public or public/private projects here. It's like a disease down here. Competitive doesn't have to mean lowest cost. I don't want to lay everything on city staff. But there is an endemic issue somewhere...

I'm also a bit skeptical that they've built things to easily modify memorial. When it actually comes up will we see another fiasco? 

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So the biggest Ponzi Schemes of this decade:

1) Theranos - jumping up and down for years screaming that, if you've ever been in a lab, the idea that a box smaller than a budget copy machine could do meaningful blood work is a joke, had almost nobody saying the emperor had no clothes (this will be important in a sec).  That on top of the fact that Holmes' entire premise was built on her dislike of needles, and that even if you spike a critical lab Theranos can't help you because they don't do imaging and biopsies that would actually confirm a diagnosis (which don't cost $3, which, by the way is what Medicare already pays for basic lab work (BMP/CMP/CBC/D-Dimer/Pro Time/etc), but I digress);

2) Tesla - virtually all of Musk's cash flow comes from deposits on vehicles he hasn't made and/or new equity/debt offerings.  There's IP value there, but little else. Still doesn't stop people from pumping billions of dollars a year into a company that by any other metric is not a going concern;

3) MLS Soccer - the TV deal is $90m versus the NFL's deal of $255m, even though the NFL draws 30-60x as many viewers for a given game.  That math is entirely unsustainable, and ESPN/Fox/Univision bet on the come in an epic fail of epic fails. It's a garbage product that is entirely unsustainable - baseball, already a regional sport, will become a Regional SportTM when its current tv deal expires - from a financial perspective, and the only way they've stayed afloat is the Tesla/Theranos model of bilking the Greater Fool.  Tepper's no dummy, and the upside COULD be like investing in Amazon in 2001, but the downside could be Pets.com.  Do you throw $200m at something that might be worth $2b in twenty years but could also be worth zero a lot sooner?  

Uber doesn't cash flow either, and though its stock price has fallen it's stabilized at $40 for god knows what reason.  MLS isn't a game changer like Theranos or Amazon or Tesla; like Uber, it's got massive barriers to entry with tons of competition and no funding mechanism that lets it continue operations outside of debt/equity offerings.  MLS is a hood ornament, and if we get it or don't, save this post for ten years from now and I'm willing to bet a dozen dozen donuts MLS is significantly smaller with a smaller cultural impact than golf without Tiger.

Edited by Tyrone Wiggum
Raspberry filled even
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I have posted this earlier n the MLB thread. Baseball as a national broadcast fares poorly. As a regional broadcast it is outstanding. In 12 of the 29 franchise (not Toronto) regional networks they are #1 in prime time April through September.  Eight more are second or third. Looking at cable only the numbers are even higher. Baseball is a nationwide sport with strong regional following. Most viewers are less interested seeing two out of market teams play. Many teams and owners have interests in the regional sports networks (RSN) and the high ratings satisfy their advertisers. The market is fractured, so to speak, but with a total performance that makes MLB a force.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/maurybrown/2018/10/04/2018-mlb-regional-tv-ratings-in-primetime-shows-continued-strong-popularity/#44a1f16f6257

Will MLS follow the baseball model or continue with national broadcasts? 

Also MLB reports attendance as tickets sold since they share revenue based on those numbers. I do not know that the arrangement is in MLS but I read that they use tickets distributed in the announced numbers. They may have an internal number for tickets sold used by the league.

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On 6/2/2019 at 1:18 PM, tarhoosier said:

I have posted this earlier n the MLB thread. Baseball as a national broadcast fares poorly. As a regional broadcast it is outstanding. In 12 of the 29 franchise (not Toronto) regional networks they are #1 in prime time April through September.  Eight more are second or third. Looking at cable only the numbers are even higher. Baseball is a nationwide sport with strong regional following. Most viewers are less interested seeing two out of market teams play. Many teams and owners have interests in the regional sports networks (RSN) and the high ratings satisfy their advertisers. The market is fractured, so to speak, but with a total performance that makes MLB a force.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/maurybrown/2018/10/04/2018-mlb-regional-tv-ratings-in-primetime-shows-continued-strong-popularity/#44a1f16f6257

Will MLS follow the baseball model or continue with national broadcasts? 

I’d say MLS already follows the baseball model. Very few games are national, there are featured matchups on ESPN, Fox, TSN, and Univision every weekend, but the bulk of the matches are served up on local and regional sports channels, and carried nationwide via ESPN+. I watch the league every weekend and just open up ESPN+ and pick the match I want to watch. 

Edited by JoshuaDrown
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^ I am impressed with Mint City. It manages to be original, unique and historically relevant. Nice job (IMO).

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Triangle Business Journal has an article about the Proposed Downtown Soccer Stadium and Development in Raleigh.    Charlotte has an up hill climb to win the 30th Team.  From in state and out of state competition.

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I wonder how the US team would draw in Charlotte, the crowd in Cleveland on Saturday was pathetic. Maybe its better that we keep getting Mexico in the Gold Cup.

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On 6/23/2019 at 8:13 AM, kermit said:

^ I am impressed with Mint City. It manages to be original, unique and historically relevant. Nice job (IMO).

Turns out there is another group called The Queen's Firm founded in 2007 to do the same thing,

http://www.thequeensfirm.com/

1965140730_ScreenShot2019-06-25at11_26_25AM.png.a39ffcf444726054e1c2f68043d0d5bb.png

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23 hours ago, Hushpuppy321 said:

Triangle Business Journal has an article about the Proposed Downtown Soccer Stadium and Development in Raleigh.    Charlotte has an up hill climb to win the 30th Team.  From in state and out of state competition.

there's a big hill, but from what I hear Tepper's got a $12B front loader chipping away and making it smooth. 

Only international game I can find that happened in Raleigh, was a 2011 Juventus friendly at Carter Finley and only 16,000 people showed up. 

Edited by ricky_davis_fan_21
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The Raleigh proposal is a of a major 20,000 seat soccer stadium and huge mixed use development.  However it is contingent upon the Wake County Interlocal agreement to use hotel taxes and that is not approved yet.  Given MLS penchant for billionaires I think Mr Tepper will eventually get his MLS team here in our existing stadium. 

I hope this happens in Raleigh and with Kane Development behind it (Raleigh's largest and leader developer) it may indeed happen.

 https://www.wraltechwire.com/2019/06/24/draft-with-1-9b-malik/

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Just now, KJHburg said:

The Raleigh proposal is a of a major 20,000 seat soccer stadium and huge mixed use development.  However it is contingent upon the Wake County Interlocal agreement to use hotel taxes and that is not approved yet.  Given MLS penchant for billionaires I think Mr Tepper will eventually get his MLS team here in our existing stadium. 

I hope this happens in Raleigh and with Kane Development behind it (Raleigh's largest and leader developer) it may indeed happen.

 https://www.wraltechwire.com/2019/06/24/draft-with-1-9b-malik/

If its in our existing stadium, I only think that'll be temporary ;-)

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1 hour ago, ricky_davis_fan_21 said:

If its in our existing stadium, I only think that'll be temporary ;-)

If Tepper has a plan to build a MLS stadium, say on the existing practice fields starting in 2022 (or P+F site), I would venture there is no competition for an expansion team.   Deep pocket owner with existing  downtown location, and already in the NFL  ownership circle.   It would also put him as the wealthiest owner in MLS. 

 

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3 hours ago, ricky_davis_fan_21 said:

If its in our existing stadium, I only think that'll be temporary ;-)

New insider info, or speculation based on the idea that Charlotte Pipe might sell their land to the Panthers and the Panthers might build a stadium there?

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On 6/25/2019 at 11:48 AM, ricky_davis_fan_21 said:

If its in our existing stadium, I only think that'll be temporary ;-)

Of course you could be right, but I think Tepper's only interest in MLS is that he believes it can breathe life into BofA stadium 20 or so more days/year...an asset he already owns. I think he's looking for value. If he thought MLB would work at BofA, I think he'd be pursuing that instead of MLS. Even though I believe that, I think he could certainly change his mind after he tries having both teams play at one stadium and eventually make the move to build a separate MLS stadium.

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16 hours ago, CLT> said:

There is sooo much juicy goodness in that piece, but this is why Charlotte WILL get MLS:

“The country’s 23rd-largest media market fills the 630-mile wide hole between Washington and Atlanta, and Charlotte anchors a metro area of more than 2.5 million people. Glick said there are 26 Fortune 1000 companies within the potential club’s catchment area, with more on the way, and that the organization’s research indicates full season ticket commitments will be “in the high 20,000s, maybe in the 30,000s.” Sponsorship revenue will be “in the top quartile [of MLS] based on our initial conversations, at least,” he added.

Charlotte’s other asset is Tepper himself. MLS likes billionaires, and Tepper is one almost 12 times over. He’s the 118th wealthiest person in the world, according to Forbes, and now is the richest individual owner in the NFL (trailing Paul Allen’s estate) and likely would be in MLS (trailing CFG/Abu Dhabi). Heft like that is hard to ignore.”

For those who don’t know who Tom Glick is:

“And if claiming he was serious wasn’t enough to convince you he was serious, then the summer 2018 hiring of Tom Glick should have sent a message. If the Panthers’ president’s name sounds familiar to soccer fans, it’s because he’s the same Tom Glick who ran Derby County for four years and then spent another six with Manchester City and City Football Group. He helped launch New York City FC in 2015. You probably don’t hire someone like Glick if the NFL is all you care about.”

Edited by JoshuaDrown
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Sounds inevitable at this point.  I'd think a Miami style retrofit of BoA might be best for a soccer venue  but at this point with Pipe & Foundry opening let's go grandiose and have Tepper build our answer to Mercedes Benz stadium.  Opportunities of land like that opening somewhat "coincidentally" at the same time that the owner is talking about stadium options doesn't come up very often.  Let's go big with it and return the current stadiums land to the street grid like RDF may have drawn out a few weeks back

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I follow MLS closely and what I can tell you from what I read & know of the league and it's King Don Garber is this. I'm 90% certain Charlotte will get a team. I am 99.9% certain it will not be announced this summer. They're going to announce Sacramento Republic FC to join the league with Austin FC in 2021. They'll announce Saint Louis FC to join the league with team 30 in 2022. Now, team 30 could be Charlotte. I have a feeling that ultimately the league will expand to 32 before stopping. After SAC & STL join, Phoenix & Detroit are furthest along in discussions. Charlotte & Las Vegas are also to be in contention. I have a feeling of the 4 finalists I mentioned for 30-32, LV will be the odd one out. Every league is looking to Las Vegas right now and I get the impression MLS won't want to compete with that many new kids on the block. I think ultimately Detroit will be team 30 b/c Garber has a hard on for Detroit, with Phoenix Rising FC & Charlotte Independence rounding out the league by 2026 at the latest. 

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