cwetteland

Light Rail

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New proposal to Orange County to build a Mag-Lev from OIA to the Convention Center with stops at the SunRail station on Sand Lake Road and FL Mall. Would provide HSR-SunRail and SunRail-OIA linkage to replace a bus connector. Project would be privately funded, but they request Beachline right-of-way. Needs governmental approval from FDOT, Belle Isle, Orange Co. etc. etc..

Personally would like to see a single "Rail Pass" that you swipe when you get on and when you get off regardless of intermodals for a single charge.

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New proposal to Orange County to build a Mag-Lev from OIA to the Convention Center with stops at the SunRail station on Sand Lake Road and FL Mall. Would provide HSR-SunRail and SunRail-OIA linkage to replace a bus connector. Project would be privately funded, but they request Beachline right-of-way. Needs governmental approval from FDOT, Belle Isle, Orange Co. etc. etc..

Personally would like to see a single "Rail Pass" that you swipe when you get on and when you get off regardless of intermodals for a single charge.

Holy crap...that sounds ideal! What could stand in the way of this getting done?

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BTW, even though the word mag-lev keeps being used, this article states that the trains would have a top speed of 45mph (and would cost $12 to ride).

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^I agree -- that said, if this is how the missing link can be created, I think it's a good start.

The "one pass" for all is just logistical and can be worked out by the City and others.

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Holy crap...that sounds ideal! What could stand in the way of this getting done?

The citizens of Orlando / Belle Isle.

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^ I question the accuracy of that graphic because I'm pretty sure this group is talking about putting the rail line down the median of 528, just like the high-speed rail line. That's why they're saying that the right-of-way already exists, they're trying to get it for free, and the line would be elevated (to share space with HSR.

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^I agree -- that said, if this is how the missing link can be created, I think it's a good start.

The "one pass" for all is just logistical and can be worked out by the City and others.

From a private company perspective this is a great way to get a foot in the door for an OIA to Port Canaveral segment. Additionally, if it pans out ... it could set it self up as an experienced operator of of HSR feeder lines elsewhere in the state. Just think of phase II HSR going down I-95 wiith only a stop in Melborne and W Palm. These Mag-Lev trains could set up a parallel line that collects at all the other coastal cities and feeds into the two HSR stops. You live in Jupiter and want to take rail to Disney but are 30 miles from a station. You jump on Mag-Lev to Melborne and then HSR to the mouse (if they move it out of Celebration ... that's another topic on another thread).

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BTW, even though the word mag-lev keeps being used, this article states that the trains would have a top speed of 45mph (and would cost $12 to ride).

I thought maglev was a type of train, is it related specifically to speed?

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I thought maglev was a type of train, is it related specifically to speed?

It is, but nearly every time I've heard mag-lev mentioned, speeds upwards of 100mph have been in discussion.

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From a private company perspective this is a great way to get a foot in the door for an OIA to Port Canaveral segment. Additionally, if it pans out ... it could set it self up as an experienced operator of of HSR feeder lines elsewhere in the state.

What I find ironic is that I think this 3rd rail line could be much more successful than the commuter and HSR lines, and leave it to independent investors to recognize that potential.

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^I thought the same thing; why not just extend their proposal North to downtown Orlando?

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I guess it's OK but I don't completely understand how this could happen. "Privately funded" to me sounds like I-Drive money. However, they will already have an airport-convention center connection with HSR and this thing will just be a complete duplicate, except for a stops at the mall and Sun Rail. Seems like an extremely expensive option compared to just connecting HSR and Sun Rail and I can't understand whether the cash would come from. Downtown Orlando to downtown Tampa using three trains is just nuts and not at all realistic.

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Light rail or mag lev? Or are they already trying to confuse the issue?

Mag Lev comes in different types. the more well known is high speed, like the Transrapid in China. But there are also low speed mag lev systems as well, for instance Linimo in japan. But light rail is a different animal, much more conventional.

I think you may have too many options going here, especially since this looks liek ti is replicating the connection between the airport and the convention center.

But, interesting about the financing proposal. This is how the monorail in Seattle (which is profitable) got started.

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Holy crap...that sounds ideal! What could stand in the way of this getting done?

I am sure Mears will (pardon me)... railroad this.

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This proposal should have a direct connection to Universal Studios.

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I guess it's OK but I don't completely understand how this could happen. "Privately funded" to me sounds like I-Drive money. However, they will already have an airport-convention center connection with HSR and this thing will just be a complete duplicate, except for a stops at the mall and Sun Rail. Seems like an extremely expensive option compared to just connecting HSR and Sun Rail and I can't understand whether the cash would come from. Downtown Orlando to downtown Tampa using three trains is just nuts and not at all realistic.

I am with you bub. I doubt I would travel to Tampa if it took three types of transportation. That does not include how I would get to the station.

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Alright, I continue to hear people say "I will not do this, will not do that" regarding station changes and accessibility. Truth is, it's easier to get around NYC, Boston, and Chicago by car or cab. That said, this is about lifestyle changes. I live in Boston, and have a car, but, I walk to work and use the T whenever I can. It is not the most convenient option, but it is an option, and having alternative modes of mass transit promotes pedestrianized, urban spaces. At the end of the day, my lifestyle is vastly improved by having the option to walk to work, to take a train, being able to get out and do things that don't require me to sit in traffic. For me to get from where I live to the high speed train (Acela at South Station in Boston) I have to hop on the Green Line and then make a second connection to the Red Line at Park Street in order to get to South Station. It's really not that big a deal.

My guess is that those who say they will not make 2 station changes to get from point A to point B, probably will not use a train regardless of it's accessibility.

Edited by prahaboheme

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Alright, I continue to hear people say "I will not do this, will not do that" regarding station changes and accessibility. Truth is, it's easier to get around NYC, Boston, and Chicago by car or cab. That said, this is about lifestyle changes. I live in Boston, and have a car, but, I walk to work and use the T whenever I can. It is not the most convenient option, but it is an option, and having alternative modes of mass transit promotes pedestrianized, urban spaces. At the end of the day, my lifestyle is vastly improved by having the option to walk to work, to take a train, being able to get out and do things that don't require me to sit in traffic. For me to get from where I live to the high speed train (Acela at South Station in Boston) I have to hop on the Green Line and then make a second connection to the Red Line at Park Street in order to get to South Station. It's really not that big a deal.

My guess is that those who say they will not make 2 station changes to get from point A to point B, probably will not use a train regardless of it's accessibility.

Totally agree!

I haven't heard but I wonder if this group is considering making the same offer in the Tampa area ... downtown to airport.

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Two changes are reasonable. Any more and you may loose riders. Besides, a $30 ticket one way ticket to Tampa is pretty steep.

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I continue to be bothered by the fact that Downtown Orlando is getting no love when it comes to all this HSR talk.

I guess a Downtown Orlando stop is out of the question, right or wrong?

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New proposal to Orange County to build a Mag-Lev from OIA to the Convention Center with stops at the SunRail station on Sand Lake Road and FL Mall. Would provide HSR-SunRail and SunRail-OIA linkage to replace a bus connector. Project would be privately funded, but they request Beachline right-of-way. Needs governmental approval from FDOT, Belle Isle, Orange Co. etc. etc..

Personally would like to see a single "Rail Pass" that you swipe when you get on and when you get off regardless of intermodals for a single charge.

If I'm being thick-skulled, forgive me, but this doesn't really make sense to me. Why does it make more sense to spend 200+ million bucks (albeit supposedly privately funded) to connect HSR and SunRail (and add an extra necessary transfer) instead of just building a connection hub between the two? And if HSR is connecting the airport and the convention center to begin with, doesn't that cut into the ridership of this parallel line? I don't know, this sounds pie in the sky to me. Anyone care to convince me why this is an efficient/viable idea?

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If I'm being thick-skulled, forgive me, but this doesn't really make sense to me. Why does it make more sense to spend 200+ million bucks (albeit supposedly privately funded) to connect HSR and SunRail (and add an extra necessary transfer) instead of just building a connection hub between the two? And if HSR is connecting the airport and the convention center to begin with, doesn't that cut into the ridership of this parallel line? I don't know, this sounds pie in the sky to me. Anyone care to convince me why this is an efficient/viable idea?

So let's say that we ditch the light rail/mag-lev plan and do as you say, add a station connecting SunRail and HSR. At 16 daily roundtrips, HSR will run at a frequency of about 1 train per hour, or maybe every 30 minutes during rush hour and every hour and a half between. Then you'll have people complaining that when they land at the airport, they may have to wait an hour for a HSR train to take them on a 5 minute ride to the commuter rail transfer station. Light rail affords higher frequencies, which allows for greater frequencies and doesn't force the different rail agencies to coordinate their timetables.

I think the Florida Mall stands to get a lot from this new rail proposal. I'm sure business has been hurting a bit since the Millenia area started booming. Now, tourists and conventioneers staying on I-Drive will be able to hop on a short train ride to go to a mall and kill some time, rather than have to navigate the unfamiliar streets of local Orlando.

Furthermore, I'm sure the mag-lev system can be expanded if it proves to be successful. It could easily turn into the I-Drive circulator we've been waiting for...and possibly even extended out to Port Canaveral.

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So let's say that we ditch the light rail/mag-lev plan and do as you say, add a station connecting SunRail and HSR. At 16 daily roundtrips, HSR will run at a frequency of about 1 train per hour, or maybe every 30 minutes during rush hour and every hour and a half between. Then you'll have people complaining that when they land at the airport, they may have to wait an hour for a HSR train to take them on a 5 minute ride to the commuter rail transfer station. Light rail affords higher frequencies, which allows for greater frequencies and doesn't force the different rail agencies to coordinate their timetables.

I think the Florida Mall stands to get a lot from this new rail proposal. I'm sure business has been hurting a bit since the Millenia area started booming. Now, tourists and conventioneers staying on I-Drive will be able to hop on a short train ride to go to a mall and kill some time, rather than have to navigate the unfamiliar streets of local Orlando.

Furthermore, I'm sure the mag-lev system can be expanded if it proves to be successful. It could easily turn into the I-Drive circulator we've been waiting for...and possibly even extended out to Port Canaveral.

Fair points on future expansion and frequency. I guess my bigger concern is that this is being treated as the "missing link" between HSR and SunRail. It troubles me that we could build HSR and SunRail without a shared stop - especially for those taking the train to Orlando from Tampa.

Edited by uncreativeusername

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Are they still planning on building this Mag-Lev? but 412 to ride is rediculous.

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