The Bad News Report

[NcSc74]

I think economics and location did it.  Amazon and Apple proves that cities (metros) drive innovation and jobs.  The bigger the better.

  Texas has advantageous economics as compared to cities back east.  Also, you have to admit Austin's location is a plus.  Near Houston  and Dallas two very respected, mature  and large metros that can fuel the workforce.  Combine that with a high profile universities nearby i would question why not.  Secondly, Texas is Texas.  There is no identity crisis down there.  So I don't think HB2 played a huge role.  That is what drives me crazy about this subject.  The same time Charlotte was losing the All Star game due to HB2 Houston was hosting or gearing up to host the super bowl.  Didn't hear a peep about Texas politics but for some reason the media jumped all on NC.  I have my own thougts on that though.  NC was on the verge of being in true swing state status.  For some reason some folks thought the soul of the state would be lost forever and decided to let the farmers decide on NC's future.  A future in whcih people are moving to cities at an accelerated rate.  I truly hope NC finds its "equilibrium" and wake up from the 8 year slumber.  You were on your way to great things.  Anyway I digress.

 Truth is Charlotte needs about 3 million more people and Raleigh needs about 30 years of maturing before they start using their gravity to catch big fish like tech and bio giants attention.  Honeslty though, imagine if you lived in a state without RTP, SAS, Duke, BB&T and BoA.  Kind of puts things in to perspective.  NC did good to grow what it has but now ya gotta take it up a notch.  I don't see it as a huge loss.  I didnt really think NC had a shot.  Continue to diversify, learn from the setbacks but the biggest thing to do is know your auduence and cater to them.  Not how to do things 20 or 30 years ago.  Consolidate farmland, conserve land and return unused portions to nature.  Centralize services towards focus regions, stop spending money on rural projects tht serve very little citizens and grow your cities the smart way.  If people dont want to move for jobs maybe they are satisifed with where they are in life.  Don't build a boondoggle in the middle of nowhere where nonone will live or use the service.  

Rant over.  You are geting 2 more towers to add to that sexy skyline.  Others are still jealous and use your city as a benchmark; Charlotte is fine move on.

[Tennessine]

7 minutes ago, NcSc74 said:

 Rant over.  You are geting 2 more towers to add to that sexy skyline.  Others are still jealous and use your city as a benchmark; Charlotte is fine move on.

I can attest to that. In Nashville, we complain about never getting any serious height added to our skyline. We wish we could build the big boys like you have in Charlotte.

[KJHburg]

Enough of this bad apple news everyone go to your nearest Krispy Kreme tomorrow morning and get a 3 pack and coffee and relax.  We are still the  corporate home of the best doughnut in the world!  

[Dale]

4 minutes ago, KJHburg said:

Enough of this bad apple news everyone go to your nearest Krispy Kreme tomorrow morning and get a 3 pack and coffee and relax.  We are still the  corporate home of the best doughnut in the world!  

... and the largest city in the world commonly confused with Charleston, SC!

[UPNoDa]

If we are supposed to be the home of KK, why are there only two  (2) KK's inside the  485 beltway?  Seems strange.

Not really a food comparo, but my hometown of Cincy is home to Skyline Chili and if you Google map the area, there are over 40 locations.   Do Charlotteans not like KK?

[KJHburg]

1 minute ago, UPNoDa said:

If we are supposed to be the home of KK, why are there only two  (2) KK's inside the  485 beltway?  Seems strange.

Not really a food comparo, but my hometown of Cincy is home to Skyline Chili and if you Google map the area, there are over 40 locations.   Do Charlotteans not like KK?

More are coming just wait and KK just moved in their new offices a few months ago.

[UPNoDa]

Great, that earlier pic made my hungry for KK.

I miss seeing the "Hot Now" red neon sign out front when driving by other locations in the a.m.

[NCMike1990]

7 minutes ago, KJHburg said:

More are coming just wait and KK just moved in their new offices a few months ago.

Is there an uptown location in the works?

[DH17]

10 hours ago, CLT2014 said:

The RTP workforce is also packed full of IBM and Cisco type mentalities, which is the type of tech workforce a company like Apple doesn't want. They usually are good with clocking out at 4:45PM to take the kids to soccer practice and waiting for their retirement to kick in. 

I totally agree with this. There is nothing wrong with that mindset and the fintech here works well for the banks and financial companies. However, the true "tech" firms are such a different beast than a "traditional" industry that has developed technology capabilities to complement what they already do.

[DeleteMe]

Biz editorial perspective --

https://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/news/2018/12/13/editors-notebookapples-decision-looks-like-a.html

 

[DeleteMe]

8 hours ago, Dale said:

Hopefully, our city will eventually grow to such a status where we have the hippest companies which employees are worker drones who live in their cars.

Hilarious.   

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/13/technology/tech-talent-apple-tech-giants-west-coast.html?action=click&module=Top Stories&pgtype=Homepage

Edited December 14, 2018 by MACyr

[elrodvt]

I'm glad I consult to IBM so I can start going home early and stop patenting. Sweet.

I think you guys are completely wrong and if you work in tech arrogant as well. All these companies are filled with very smart dedicated people. The problem is they get no cut for decisions good or bad. While their disgustingly paid leadership makes wrong choice after wrong choice. 

It's all about the wall street board culture. Other than abject failure the people in charge have no repercussions for bad decisions. They're on each other's boards. But a mid level manager makes a bad choice bye, bye. Sooner or later every publicly owned company seems to succumb to it in today's culture.

This board is anonymous right? ;-)

[videtur quam contuor]

10 hours ago, KJHburg said:

More are coming just wait and KK just moved in their new offices a few months ago.

Sadly, they do not offer crullers at their store. Clerk says they are available only as a packaged good at grocers and other outlets. What a crock.

[KJHburg]

9 hours ago, MACyr said:

Biz editorial perspective --

https://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/news/2018/12/13/editors-notebookapples-decision-looks-like-a.html

 

I saw this and he is quite negative as I have read all of his editorials.   The best source of tech news in this state is WRALTechwire which is an offshoot of a Raleigh tv station WRAL

https://www.wraltechwire.com/

Here is what Lexis Nexis has to say about the Raleigh tech labor force

https://www.wraltechwire.com/2018/12/13/no-apple-army-amazon-heres-why-one-tech-firm-lexisnexis-loves-the-triangle/

Pendo Software seems to love Raleigh too just announcing a 590 job expansion they could have moved anywhere  announced Dec. 3

https://www.wraltechwire.com/2018/12/03/raleigh-based-software-firm-to-add-590-jobs-downtown/

and Cary Wake County are home to the designers and owners of the number 1 game worldwide Epic Games and Fortnite

they just raked in $1.25 Billion in financing https://www.wraltechwire.com/2018/10/26/triangle-reaction-to-epic-games-epic-1-25b-funding-wow-great-news/

Maybe one day we will find out about why Apple chose to expand in Austin where they already had 6000 employees and maybe we won't.   But great TECH jobs are available in North Carolina in both Raleigh Durham and yes even here in Charlotte.  

23 minutes ago, tarhoosier said:

Sadly, they do not offer crullers at their store. Clerk says they are available only as a packaged good at grocers and other outlets. What a crock.

I will look into this matter. 

Edited December 14, 2018 by KJHburg

[Ingram]

17 hours ago, NcSc74 said:

Rant over.  You are geting 2 more towers to add to that sexy skyline.  Others are still jealous and use your city as a benchmark; Charlotte is fine move on.

 

Exactly, I have no idea why someone would want to soccer mom another forum.

[Exile]

10 hours ago, elrodvt said:

I'm glad I consult to IBM so I can start going home early and stop patenting. Sweet.

I think you guys are completely wrong and if you work in tech arrogant as well. All these companies are filled with very smart dedicated people. The problem is they get no cut for decisions good or bad. While their disgustingly paid leadership makes wrong choice after wrong choice. 

It's all about the wall street board culture. Other than abject failure the people in charge have no repercussions for bad decisions. They're on each other's boards. But a mid level manager makes a bad choice bye, bye. Sooner or later every publicly owned company seems to succumb to it in today's culture.

This board is anonymous right? ;-)

Well, absent moral hazard, eventually even the top guys' bad decisions will catch up with them. But you're right about disgustingly paid leadership. E.g., what did Marissa Mayer get paid to run Yahoo into the ground? And people complain about payouts to failed college football coaches.

[kermit]

Its certainly not scientific but the poll attached to the TBJ article linked above suggests that public opinion is that the Legislature bears the bulk of the blame for the Apple failure. My initial post on this subject was a quote from Business NC about lingering effects of HB2 on Apple's decision. These and other sources make it clear that a significant portion of the public and press believes that NC's political shift to the right has become an impediment to economic development. Regardless of the "truth" of that belief, the fact that large portions of informed observers (the TBJ poll) and the press (as evidenced by the TBJ, Business NC and the NandO)  appear to share this view is problematic for our future. Since public opinion tends to make its way into CEO opinion, this image, true or not, is something that needs to be corrected before it metastasizes.

Imagine how much better we would be doing if there were no cultural issues to fight against.

Edited December 17, 2018 by kermit

[EllAyyDub]

The whole thing was fake news.  I don't know where the rumor that Apple was coming came from, but that's all it was - a rumor blown way out of proportion.

Apple is going to Austin because they want to go there, not because they don't want to go to Raleigh.

[CLT2014]

2 hours ago, KJHburg said:

I saw this and he is quite negative as I have read all of his editorials.   The best source of tech news in this state is WRALTechwire which is an offshoot of a Raleigh tv station WRAL

https://www.wraltechwire.com/

WRAL's reporting and "jumping the gun" based on insiders is what now makes the Raleigh area and NC look like fools. If they hadn't broken the news the Apple and Raleigh was a done deal and wrote articles that continued to defend their initial article, the public perception would not be such an embarrassment. My guess is their sources were less influential politicians or assistants that wanted to sound more important that they actually are within the Legislature, while those more closely involved such as the Governor gave no indication things were so certain. 

WRALTechwire loses a lot of respect on this IMO. 

Edited December 14, 2018 by CLT2014

[rancenc]

2 hours ago, CLT2014 said:

WRAL's reporting and "jumping the gun" based on insiders is what now makes the Raleigh area and NC look like fools. If they hadn't broken the news the Apple and Raleigh was a done deal and wrote articles that continued to defend their initial article, the public perception would not be such an embarrassment. My guess is their sources were less influential politicians or assistants that wanted to sound more important that they actually are within the Legislature, while those more closely involved such as the Governor gave no indication things were so certain. 

WRALTechwire loses a lot of respect on this IMO. 

Very valid point!! Plus at the end of the day, Apple's decision seems to be based heavily on geography and current infrastucture.  If you look at the major expansions and additions of staff.; Austin  already has huge Apple presence as it is, plus I believe that Intel which is a big supplier to Apple has a large presence in the Austin area.  All of the other locations are on the West Coast and probably due to the fact, that Apple's major suppliers are Chinese based.  I did see Pittsburgh and NYC were listed for additions in the next 3 years.  But I agree with the premature announcements of WRAL...they were blabbing prematurely.

 

[DeleteMe]

4 hours ago, CLT2014 said:

WRAL's reporting and "jumping the gun" based on insiders is what now makes the Raleigh area and NC look like fools. If they hadn't broken the news the Apple and Raleigh was a done deal and wrote articles that continued to defend their initial article, the public perception would not be such an embarrassment. My guess is their sources were less influential politicians or assistants that wanted to sound more important that they actually are within the Legislature, while those more closely involved such as the Governor gave no indication things were so certain. 

WRALTechwire loses a lot of respect on this IMO. 

You nailed it.  As much as I like it, and am glad we have it, WRAL Techwire is not a superior source of information.  Media sources are all subject to failures -- but "jumping the gun" and your analysis, I think hits the nail on the head.  

Edited December 14, 2018 by MACyr

[DeleteMe]

6 hours ago, KJHburg said:

I saw this and he is quite negative as I have read all of his editorials.   The best source of tech news in this state is WRALTechwire which is an offshoot of a Raleigh tv station WRAL

https://www.wraltechwire.com/

Here is what Lexis Nexis has to say about the Raleigh tech labor force

https://www.wraltechwire.com/2018/12/13/no-apple-army-amazon-heres-why-one-tech-firm-lexisnexis-loves-the-triangle/

Pendo Software seems to love Raleigh too just announcing a 590 job expansion they could have moved anywhere  announced Dec. 3

https://www.wraltechwire.com/2018/12/03/raleigh-based-software-firm-to-add-590-jobs-downtown/

and Cary Wake County are home to the designers and owners of the number 1 game worldwide Epic Games and Fortnite

they just raked in $1.25 Billion in financing https://www.wraltechwire.com/2018/10/26/triangle-reaction-to-epic-games-epic-1-25b-funding-wow-great-news/

Maybe one day we will find out about why Apple chose to expand in Austin where they already had 6000 employees and maybe we won't.   But great TECH jobs are available in North Carolina in both Raleigh Durham and yes even here in Charlotte.  

I will look into this matter. 

The sky definitely isn't falling but the economic development and recruitment game is very much a battle of cities/regions and states.  We can't rest on our laurels.  NC wouldn't have made it out of the 19th century without massive public sector involvement and that's a related, but different subject.  

[Dale]

6 hours ago, kermit said:

Its certainly not scientific but the poll attached to the TBJ article linked above suggests that public opinion is that the Legislature bears the bulk of the blame for the Apple failure. My initial post on this subject was a quote from Business NC about lingering effects of HB2 on Apple's decision. These and other sources make it clear that a significant portion of the public and press believes that NC's political shift to the right has become an impediment to economic development. Regardless of the "truth" of that belief, the fact that large portions of informed observers (the TBJ poll) and the press (as evidenced by the TBJ, Business NC and the NandO)  appear to share this view is problematic for our future. Since public opinion tends to make its way into CEO opinion, this image, true or not, is something that needs to be corrected before it metastasize's.

Imagine how much better we would be doing if there were no cultural issues to fight against.

What cultural issues does glowing-growing NC have to combat that we don’t slide into to backwaters ?

[kermit]

4 minutes ago, Dale said:

What cultural issues does glowing-growing NC have to combat that we don’t slide into to backwaters ?

That a large portion of residents and the press believe that the NCGA is moving the state backwards rather than forwards.

[DMann]

We can't, everyone will be moving here as the sea level rises and weather patterns change.  Also, getting a balance in the NCGA would help.