Downtown Orlando Project Discussion

[bic]

Blatant rip-off of the PAMM but that's a nice-looking police station. Shame about its isolation relative to the CBD though.

[JFW657]

I like the design well enough, it just looks kinda small.

You'd think a city the size of Orlando would need a somewhat bigger police HQ.

Of course, I suppose there's always the possibility for future additions.

Should have the space for it on that parcel.

[spenser1058]

The story noted it's actually smaller than what it's replacing because they've decentralized how officers are assigned now.

[JFW657]

I dunno. I'd feel better if the building was bigger.

I'd feel more protected.

And served.

[spenser1058]

Where have you gone, Joe Friday!?!

[HankStrong]

Where's the Dunkin Donuts going? 

[JFW657]

They'll have a concession inside the building.

Possibly in the lobby or the cafeteria.

[jrs2]

Dunkin Donuts food truck.

[JFW657]

Or a guy who circulates throughout the building all day on a continuous route, pushing a Dunkin Donuts cart.

 

With coffee, of course.

 

Hell, where do I sign up????  

[Jernigan]

So is the tattoo and gyro place on the corner of 50/Orange it's own parcel?

Have to laugh (sadly) about the idea of these 2 big projects with MamaB and gyro/tattoo holding out keeping the intersection scaled back

[jack]

Whatever happens on the sentinel's property, I am sure someone will try and buy the gyro and tattoo place. If not, we can look across the street to mama b's and see what the end result will be. 

[jrs2]

The Lexington Court project, at Lexington, Concord, and Hughey, is u/c.  You can see concrete pylons coming out of the ground from I-4.

 

It is just south of the Crowne Plaza hotel property.  It's only a block off Amelia and Crescent Central is only 3 blocks away; it's a block off Colonial and Steelhouse is only 2-3 blocks away from that direction.

 

it will be the second residential project on the west side of I-4 (joining Cityview).

 

Another empty lot...gone.

 

So, regarding close-in CBD projects:

 

1.  Steelhouse was completed over a year ago

2.  Skyhouse was completed less than a year ago

3.  Aloft conversion was completed less than a year ago

4.  NORA is nearing completion now

5.  Crescent broke ground less than a year ago

6.  Residence Inn broke ground less than a year ago

7.  Artisan 420 broke ground two months ago

8.  Ustler's 4-story office on North Orange broke ground about two months ago

9.  Lexington Court broke ground in August

10.  Former Marriott/Sheraton near Amway Arena is being gutted and converted to new hotel

11.  DPAC Phase I is nearing completion

12.  Church St. Exchange bldg conversion to office space is complete

Edited September 10, 2014 by jrs2

[FLheat]

The Catholic church property on the corner of Ridgewood and Cathcart has begun renovations to convert the old church into townhome residences.

[sunshine]

So there are obviously demand for apartments downtown, so it is a city problem not to force them to build tall. Agree?

[jrs2]

^^

personally, I don't know (regarding height).

 

^^

 

But, I will say this...if you look at the Lexington Court renderings on Bungalower's page (http://bungalower.com/2014/08/new-renderings-lexington-court-apartments-built-downtown/), I think this is a great project.  It brings life to that block; it eliminates an empty lot; it compliments Crowne Plaza; it offers a nice 5+ story design; it is very visible from I-4; it extends the "lived in area" with a newer development on the other side of I-4; etc.

 

It just does so much to "extend" the viable residential area of downtown.  It causes the casual observer to ignore I-4's presence so it's not viewed as a "barrier" to development.  I think this project will be a springboard for other projects on that side of I-4 b/c it will alter peoples' perspectives on how that side of I-4 is perceived as a viable place to live and play.

 

Aside from talk of it here, this has pretty much flown under the radar; in a way its an extra new project thrown into the mix while people have been focused on just the main projects to get built along Orange Ave.  While we've been waiting for The Sevens and Citi Tower to break ground, Artisan 420 and Lexington Court both broke ground.  I think that's great.

 

Lexington Court adds residential next to Crowne Plaza; The Residence Inn adds hotel next to Camden and Steelhouse; similar dynamic.  I think having residential next to hotels helps out the residential and also helps out the hotels.

Edited September 11, 2014 by jrs2

[jack]

So there are obviously demand for apartments downtown, so it is a city problem not to force them to build tall. Agree?

No, it is an affordability problem and a demand problem. Building higher cost more which translates into higher rents. We need wealthier people in Orlando so we can have taller towers. And will will need more people choosing to love downtown to increase the demand. 

[sunshine]

The demand is there if they keep proposing them. But the proposal are mostly generic low rise, cookie cutter design, that look more suitable for eola south or sodo. 2 to 3 more of skyhouse will make downtown more attractive to people that doesn't know about downtown orlando.

[cwetteland]

So there are obviously demand for apartments downtown, so it is a city problem not to force them to build tall. Agree?

NO.  By "force" do you mean, "zone"?  I'm pretty sure that if the properties were zoned for something that buyers weren't interested in building then the buyers wouldn't be buyers, and the properties would just be vacant lots. I'm pretty stoked that people are moving into the core at more than double the rate than any other large city in the the state, and if it's mid-rises that are doing the trick, then so be it. I'm more interested in a vibrant populated city core, than a high-rise ghost town, that looks cool from a distance.

Edited September 11, 2014 by cwetteland

[HankStrong]

Yeah, I'm not sure where the fascination for high-rises for residential living comes from.  I think the focus should be on getting people to live downtown.

 

I love a great skyline, I really do.  If you've ever driven up I-75 to Cincinnati, WOW, that is an amazing view.  You come around this huge, sweeping curve on the highway and BAM this beautiful city skyline hits you right in the face.  However, downtown Cincinnati is pretty much a ghost town after working hours.  Awesome business towers, very little residential, especially for anyone other than the lowest income people.  There are some seriously rough neighborhoods near downtown that make people who talk about the roughness of Parramore look silly.

 

Orlando needs a balance.  We could use some more big towers, but the mix of mid-rise residential provides an excellent level of balance to the city.  We need BODIES WHO SPEND MONEY downtown.  People buying groceries, going out to dinner, shopping for things they need, walking their dogs, going to events, basically... life!

 

 

ETA: link

https://www.google.com/search?q=downtown+cincinnati&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=kOQSVI_nKZCVyASPkoLQCg&ved=0CAgQ_AUoAQ&biw=1600&bih=1092

Edited September 12, 2014 by HankStrong

[FLheat]

Yeah, I'm not sure where the fascination for high-rises for residential living comes from.  I think the focus should be on getting people to live downtown.

 

If you could see sunsets or rainstorms from my perspective 27 stories up, that would answer your question.

[jack]

The demand is there if they keep proposing them. But the proposal are mostly generic low rise, cookie cutter design, that look more suitable for eola south or sodo. 2 to 3 more of skyhouse will make downtown more attractive to people that doesn't know about downtown orlando.

When I say demand, I mean demand for expensive high-rises. If you built a bunch of apartments that were affordable, i am sure they would fill up fast. But the luxury market is different and still untested. 

[HankStrong]

If you could see sunsets or rainstorms from my perspective 27 stories up, that would answer your question.

 

Realistically, what percentage of the population can afford to spend 2x-3x the rent (or 4x or more the sq. ft. price to buy) for a sunset?

 

I certainly understand the cool factor.  I do.  But how many of these towers could your reasonably fill? Orlando just isn't that hip.

 

 

Also... from another standpoint... I'm friends with a couple dozen OFD guys, including several that have previously worked at Station 1 (your fire department) and Station 6 (I'm guessing since they have a tower truck and are reasonably nearby, they'd be your backup) who are of the opinion that anything above 10-12 stories is not somewhere they'd want to live.  It's disturbing how much those kinds of conversations come up hanging out with firefighters.

 

That weighs pretty heavy with me, although I'm sure I'd fall in love with your view!

[John Hargrove]

I think the current cost of renting downtown Orlando -- even in the high-rises -- is quite a bit lower than most assume. When I moved in to downtown 5 years ago, I went from 1000sqft in Waterford @ $1100/month to about $1400/month for 800sqft on the 18th floor of a high-rise. 

 

On the flip side, my fuel costs went through the floor, and I no longer had to pay tolls on 408, which saved a $150-200/month on average.

 

I think the market in downtown has rebounded significantly since I moved 5 years ago, so the equation may not play out anymore. Also, if you don't work near the core, living there makes less sense.

 

I just wish people would look at the overall financial picture of moving into the core of a city, rather than the sticker shock of the rent itself.

 

All that said, if you have children, downtown is considerably less appealing for reasons that go well beyond cost.

Edited September 12, 2014 by castorvx

[AndyPok1]

I'm on 25th floor of 55W and life is good.  Splitting a 2/2, I'm paying less than what the rates NORA is advertising.  Everything downtown, mid or high is expensive at this point.

 

Edit to say that expensive is relative.  I don't consider it expensive, but you aren't really finding complexes for cheaper than $1000, which people that are accustomed to suburban or Disney or whatever, is skyhigh.

Edited September 12, 2014 by AndyPok1

[jrs2]

Downtown Orlando is densifying as of late.  Heading west on I-4 and approaching downtown, you see (in this order):

 

1.  a ton of construction at FH South

2.  The Ivy smack dab on I-4 on the left

3.  NORA up on the left past Lake Ivanhoe sandwiched between its neighbors

4.  the recent Steelhouse up on the left

5.  Residence Inn u/c rising above Camden

6.  Lexington up on the right literally right off of I-4, and that's going to be 5 stories but feel like 6-7.

7.  Crescent just up on the left past Lynx looking very massive ala its length

8.  ...and then Skyhouse tower bridging a gap between the Courthouse and The Vue (the lone recent tower)

 

each of these projects replace EMPTY LOTS with low rise bulk that fills gaps that probably should've never even been there, given the reputation Orlando has had for vibrant downtown living over the years.  That's a big win.  Each of these projects represents one less empty lot in a downtown striving to improve itself.