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Downtown Orlando Project Discussion

sunshine

By sunshine
in Orlando

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popsiclebrandon
popsiclebrandon

Stayed at the DoubleTree this weekend and took this photo from the room.  

klstorey
klstorey

My friend grabbed some shots of downtown while flying into ORL. This one really shows how the I-4/408 interchange is coming along.  Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

KJHburg
KJHburg

I think Lake Eola Park is one of the best urban parks in the country.  Today.  Haven't been to Orlando in 10 years or more and there is a lot more life downtown and around this park.  Great to see an

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Boomer136 Hamlet

Boomer136

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Walking around downtown tonight, I didn't find crossing traffic a problem. Far less scarier than crossing roads in Rio or New York or even the two lane roads in Lakeland. I think the case has been overstated. If you want a pedestrian mall I say look to one of the east-west roads. Church is almost one now.

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jrs2 Metropolis

jrs2

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So, these projects are currently U/C in and around downtown:

 

1.  Crescent Central

2.  Residence Inn

3.  Lexington Court

4.  Artisan 420

5.  Brownstones at Thornton Park

6.  MLS Stadium

7.  NORA- finishing touches

8.  Citrus Bowl renovations

9.  FH Women's Tower

10.  FH- Biomed bldg

11.  FH- The Ivy- finishing touches

12.  ORHS Bed Tower- finishing touches

13.  ORHS ER Bldg

14.  ORHS Hampton Inn

15.  Mills Park- retail outparcels

 

other?

 

Recently completed:

 

1.  Skyhouse

2.  Steelhouse

3.  Church Street Exchange redo for office

4.  Federal Courthouse Plaza

5.  Mills Park- retail & Residential

6.  FH  HQ bldg

7.  DPAC Phase I

8.  Sunrail: Phase I stations at FH, ORHS, Lynx, Church Street.

9.  Lymmo Line E-W corridor (Central Blvd)

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AndyPok1 Burg

AndyPok1

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Walking around downtown tonight, I didn't find crossing traffic a problem. Far less scarier than crossing roads in Rio or New York or even the two lane roads in Lakeland. I think the case has been overstated. If you want a pedestrian mall I say look to one of the east-west roads. Church is almost one now.

 

Agreed.  Every major US city that I can think off of the top of my head has a downtown core consisting of alternating one-way streets.  Why is it suddenly bad?

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smileguy Burg

smileguy

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Agreed.  Every major US city that I can think off of the top of my head has a downtown core consisting of alternating one-way streets.  Why is it suddenly bad?

 

I don't think it's suddenly bad, I think it's always been bad for a pedestrian-friendly environment, but that's been a secondary concern to moving the most number of people (in cars). With more people on foot comes more responsibility to keep them safe.

I also think it's difficult with the street grid being interrupted by Lake Eola. East of I-4, there are only two northbound through streets, and one southbound. If one shuts down, it causes major headaches. In other cities with a larger grid, the traffic simply choses an alternate route. 

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spenser1058 Gigalopolis

spenser1058

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One-way pairs also create a racetrack mentality among drivers- it's why they were created, to move cars quickly and compete with the new superhighways in the 'burbs (it didn't work - the downtowns died anyway until the traffic in the 'burbs ended up just as bad). Restoring two-way traffic, allowing parking on both sides of the street and yes, Glenda's brick streets from Hades are all "traffic-calming" devices meant to encourage pedestrians and get drivers out of their cars.

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John Hargrove Hamlet

John Hargrove

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Getting rid of the Orange Ave one-way racetrack sounds like a really bad idea. I understand the goals from an urban development standpoint, but it sounds like a great way to make traffic during rush hour a lot worse. If downtown becomes a parking lot during rush hour (even more so than now), I can't imagine that being a positive for attracting large employers to the CBD.

 

There are a lot of people who need to get to the 408 E/W ramps from somewhere along Orange during that time. Reducing the number of southbound lanes sounds like it would be a severe detriment.

 

Not everyone has the ability to live in the core.

 

Am I missing something?

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spenser1058 Gigalopolis

spenser1058

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What they did by making Orange Avenue one way was to encourage a lot of folks who have no reason to be downtown to go through it (the late Martin Andersen also wanted his trucks to get in and out of the Sentinel quickly). It does nothing to help downtown to have people driving through that are only trying to access the E/W Expressway (the same thing causes all sorts of suburbanites to exit I4 and clog up Anderson St around City Hall because the 408 ramps are backed up - I fight those folks every day). 

 

If London can limit autos and Bloomberg can restrict Broadway, there's no reason in the world Orange Avenue can't return to two way traffic. Passby traffic is doing nothing for downtown, it's making it inconvenient for pedestrians. Also, as Lou Treadway tried to tell us waaaaay back in the '80's, if you make it easy to drive and park downtown, transit will never flourish. It's more true today than it ever has been.

Edited by spenser1058
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John Hargrove Hamlet

John Hargrove

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Converting Orange would go hand in hand with a Rosalind conversion. The number of lanes SB would stay the same. 

 

I guess the question in my mind is what quantity of commuters are exiting downtown from parking garages which are west of Orange Ave? And what amount of the commuters east of I-4 need to get on Orange regardless, because they're going under 408 and not getting ON 408?

 

I don't think it is as simple as maintaining the same number of southbound and northbound lanes.

 

That all said, if all you care about is slowing down traffic for pedestrian safety, I understand. I just have concerns about flowing cars in and out of the CBD during rush hours. Mostly just posing the question -- my understanding of traffic flow is pretty much limited to playing thousands of hours of Sim City 4. :)

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prahaboheme City

prahaboheme

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I think of Miami Beach as an example where two-way streets exist, traffic congestion is at it's absolute peak, parking is limited and a challenge at best (have you tried getting into SB on a Friday night?), and somehow, it continues to flourish to points that are well beyond the measure of world class.  One might suggest even, that this degree of pain in vehicular access is a key driver to it's success as a world-class pedestrian environment (as spencer mentioned).  The last piece of the puzzle for Miami Beach is the Baylink connection to the airport and downtown Miami. Hopefully as the aging MB NIMBYs dwindle in numbers,  so too will the resistance to mass transit. I truly believe that South Beach's missing mass transit connection is this country's most glaring mass transit failure, perhaps outside of the 3rd Avenue Subway expansion in NYC (but they are dealing with that).  I digress, back to Orlando...

 

Like South Beach, Downtown Orlando is a place people want to be --  I think in some ways we are still coming to terms with this reality.  The reality that Downtown Orlando is no longer a drive-by CBD like Tampa, and other Sunbelt towns.  Unlike South Beach, Downtown Orlando has the highway infrastructure in place already to deal with the folks who do not wish to be downtown but drive through it; those people are also getting their I-4 Ultimate Makeover.  Why are we so concerned then with scaling downtown to the pedestrian, given all the benefits that we can see from cities that do it well with similarly scaled downtown environments?

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