Downtown Orlando Project Discussion

[elefants]

1 hour ago, RedStar25 said:

I was just in a discussion with a potential buyer of the Old OUC plant. What they want to use it for would be awesome. 

World's largest bouncy castle?

[spenser1058]

16 minutes ago, elefants said:

World's largest bouncy castle?

Since we’re doubling down on tourism to keep our record of 50 out of 50 in wages intact, I think it should be the new Mystery Fun House!

Of course, I’m sure Buddy’s ready to give the bulldozers a workout and build some generic apartments that his developer friends  will make a fortune off of.

[spenser1058]

29 S. Orange Ave., which had been City Arts prior to their move to Magnolia, has been sold to a New York firm. No word on the plans (PLEASE don’t let it be another bar).

Once upon a time, it was a drug store and owned by the family of my elementary school bud, Eddie Webman. Apparently, it was still in the family and he was listed as the seller. Even as Orlando disappears, it’s good to know some of the FFO’s are still with us.

 

https://www.bizjournals.com/orlando/news/2021/06/28/weissman-new-york-retail-sale-sell-buy.html?ana=maz

From OBJ

[spenser1058]

Orlando City Council approves $575,000 for improved lighting downtown and in Parramore:

https://www.wftv.com/news/orlando-city-council-votes-upgrade-downtown-lighting-improve-safety/45XCV7VSLJH6NJZUH36WX53LKI/

From WFTV 
 

 

[codypet]

17 hours ago, spenser1058 said:

29 S. Orange Ave., which had been City Arts prior to their move to Magnolia, has been sold to a New York firm. No word on the plans (PLEASE don’t let it be another bar).

Once upon a time, it was a drug store and owned by the family of my elementary school bud, Eddie Webman. Apparently, it was still in the family and he was listed as the seller. Even as Orlando disappears, it’s good to know some of the FFO’s are still with us.

 

https://www.bizjournals.com/orlando/news/2021/06/28/weissman-new-york-retail-sale-sell-buy.html?ana=maz

From OBJ

BAR Orlando is back!

[dcluley98]

On the way home today, they were tearing down that old condemned/abandoned house on Colonial in between Orange and Magnolia.  This at one point had a "for sale for development" sign in front of it, though I have not seen any concrete plans for the lot: 

 

[orlandocity87]

12 hours ago, dcluley98 said:

On the way home today, they were tearing down that old condemned/abandoned house on Colonial in between Orange and Magnolia.  This at one point had a "for sale for development" sign in front of it, though I have not seen any concrete plans for the lot: 

This rendering was associated with the lot a few years ago, but I'm guessing it's just illustrative: https://www.loopnet.com/Listing/59-E-Colonial-Dr-Orlando-FL/16327792/ 

[Alleri459]

9 hours ago, orlandocity87 said:

This rendering was associated with the lot a few years ago, but I'm guessing it's just illustrative: https://www.loopnet.com/Listing/59-E-Colonial-Dr-Orlando-FL/16327792/ 

I really like these small footprint buildings, for any use. They add human scale density, and do much more for affordability.

Edited June 30, 2021 by aleonrivera

[JFW657]

12 hours ago, orlandocity87 said:

This rendering was associated with the lot a few years ago, but I'm guessing it's just illustrative: https://www.loopnet.com/Listing/59-E-Colonial-Dr-Orlando-FL/16327792/ 

Yeah, it's too nice looking of a design to go up in DTO. 

[spenser1058]

22 minutes ago, JFW657 said:

Yeah, it's too nice looking of a design to go up in DTO. 

Don’t worry, instead of housing real people can afford, they’ll build more storage units! Stuff you don’t need must be the priority!

[AmIReal]

this is your chance @spenser1058... the Tinker and Metcalf buildings are on the market $1.8M and $10.5M respectively.  This is your chance to make/ save history and it would make you the landlord to OW.

https://www.bizjournals.com/orlando/news/2021/07/07/exclusive-historic-tinker-and-metcalf-buildings.html

[spenser1058]

Wells Fargo to leave midtown and split space to WP and something closer to downtown?

I was unable to get the link to post but it’s in OBJ

[AmIReal]

37 minutes ago, spenser1058 said:

Wells Fargo to leave midtown and split space to WP and something closer to downtown?

I was unable to get the link to post but it’s in OBJ

https://www.bizjournals.com/orlando/news/2021/07/09/florida-orlando-bank-office-real-estate.html

 

[idroveazamboni]

https://www.governing.com/now/we-can-zone-our-way-out-of-a-downtown-recession?fbclid=IwAR3o4sWMjXrwIZukRti6bUoTiJOVx1oIxRsTdFgDtBMnvRwxqzxgrE0a-m8

https://www.mynews13.com/fl/orlando/news/2021/06/29/business-incentives

[codypet]

They haven't operated the branch since Covid started but they have 3 floors of that building and have been there since First Union.  That building has already had a ton of tenants go.  Most after the new Suntrust building went up.

[spenser1058]

2 minutes ago, codypet said:

They haven't operated the branch since Covid started but they have 3 floors of that building and have been there since First Union.  That building has already had a ton of tenants go.  Most after the new Suntrust building went up.

Midtown has definitely turned out differently from what was envisioned up there when Olympia & York first built that building with Florida National as the anchor. Along with the Radisson and Gateway Center, what was supposed to be a series of high rise mixed-use buildings along Orange became middling apartment complexes after the Great Recession. Of course, as soon as VMC breaks ground, everything will be fine!

[codypet]

Even the apartment complexes that were originally envisioned where at least 20 or 25 stories.  The ones in the 2007 2008 timeframe

 

[Uncommon]

Building permit sought for Art 2 Park by Dr. Phillip’s Charities: 

https://www.bizjournals.com/orlando/news/2021/07/14/orlando-downtown-florida-building.html

[jrs2]

I was looking at Tampa on google map and they've got a lot construction going on in that Waterside project just past the arena.  I was like, wow, that's more than Orlando.  Well, that's not entirely accurate for a couple of reasons.  First, downtown isn't on the water; the big hotels don't get built in downtown; they go to I-Drive or near WDW.  Tampa now has a JW downtown.  Well, Orlando now has a second JW in Bonnet Creek.  check.  The next reason is that the City gave a lot of incentives to kickstart Medical City which is in BFE but is in the city limits.  There are like many projects that have been built there so far and that's city property and there's new projects u/c.  That development could have been downtown (for another day) under the right circumstances now that we see how Advent and ORHS are really ramping up development of their competing downtown campuses.

the development downtown over the past 2-3 years has been the following projects by comparison, from various different developers:

-Modera

-MAA Robinson

-Society Orlando (u/c)

-Radius (u/c)

-Dual Brand across from Radius

-The Julian (CV)

-Modera (CV) (u/c)

-EA (CV) (u/c)

-520 Church

-CSP Phase I

-DPAC Phase II

-Orl Magic Training Facility (u/c)

Ivanhoe area:

-Lakehouse

-The Yard (still u/c...)

Not counting Advent (3-4 projects) or Orlando Health (4-5 projects) projects, Downtown Orlando has had a lot of construction downtown the past 2-3 years; it's just more spread out and by different developers. And if you go back 2 more years in time, yet another handful of projects added to that list, like Novel, Citi, 420, UCF, Union West, Amelia Ct, Exploria Stadium, OPD HQ, etc...

The conclusion: two completely different cities, both developing differently based on factors unique to each.

[AmIReal]

On 7/15/2021 at 3:44 PM, jrs2 said:

I was looking at Tampa on google map and they've got a lot construction going on in that Waterside project just past the arena.  I was like, wow, that's more than Orlando.  Well, that's not entirely accurate for a couple of reasons.  First, downtown isn't on the water; the big hotels don't get built in downtown; they go to I-Drive or near WDW.  Tampa now has a JW downtown.  Well, Orlando now has a second JW in Bonnet Creek.  check.  The next reason is that the City gave a lot of incentives to kickstart Medical City which is in BFE but is in the city limits.  There are like many projects that have been built there so far and that's city property and there's new projects u/c.  That development could have been downtown (for another day) under the right circumstances now that we see how Advent and ORHS are really ramping up development of their competing downtown campuses.

the development downtown over the past 2-3 years has been the following projects by comparison, from various different developers:

-Modera

-MAA Robinson

-Society Orlando (u/c)

-Radius (u/c)

-Dual Brand across from Radius

-The Julian (CV)

-Modera (CV) (u/c)

-EA (CV) (u/c)

-520 Church

-CSP Phase I

-DPAC Phase II

-Orl Magic Training Facility (u/c)

Ivanhoe area:

-Lakehouse

-The Yard (still u/c...)

Not counting Advent (3-4 projects) or Orlando Health (4-5 projects) projects, Downtown Orlando has had a lot of construction downtown the past 2-3 years; it's just more spread out and by different developers. And if you go back 2 more years in time, yet another handful of projects added to that list, like Novel, Citi, 420, UCF, Union West, Amelia Ct, Exploria Stadium, OPD HQ, etc...

The conclusion: two completely different cities, both developing differently based on factors unique to each.

I don't know how accurate the OBJ/TBJ Cranewatch is, but...

 

 

[Uncommon]

15 minutes ago, AmIReal said:

I don't know how accurate the OBJ/TBJ Cranewatch is, but...

 

 

I’ve found that OBJ is a lot more on-the-ball than TBBJ. For St. Pete, there are dozens of projects — approved and under construction — that don’t appear on TBBJ.

I used stpeterising.com as a resource for St. Pete. There are lots of towers under construction or waiting to begin construction.

I haven't found a website or anything as succinct for Tampa though. In addition to Water Street, there are two 30 story towers either about to begin construction or approved.

[AmIReal]

23 minutes ago, Uncommon said:

I’ve found that OBJ is a lot more on-the-ball than TBBJ. For St. Pete, there are dozens of projects — approved and under construction — that don’t appear on TBBJ.

I used stpeterising.com as a resource for St. Pete. There are lots of towers under construction or waiting to begin construction.

I haven't found a website or anything as succinct for Tampa though. In addition to Water Street, there are two 30 story towers either about to begin construction or approved.

Agreed. But dang that Orlando map is stuffed.

[Urbo]

On 7/15/2021 at 3:44 PM, jrs2 said:

I was looking at Tampa on google map and they've got a lot construction going on in that Waterside project just past the arena.  I was like, wow, that's more than Orlando.  Well, that's not entirely accurate for a couple of reasons.  First, downtown isn't on the water; the big hotels don't get built in downtown; they go to I-Drive or near WDW.  Tampa now has a JW downtown.  Well, Orlando now has a second JW in Bonnet Creek.  check.  The next reason is that the City gave a lot of incentives to kickstart Medical City which is in BFE but is in the city limits.  There are like many projects that have been built there so far and that's city property and there's new projects u/c.  That development could have been downtown (for another day) under the right circumstances now that we see how Advent and ORHS are really ramping up development of their competing downtown campuses.

the development downtown over the past 2-3 years has been the following projects by comparison, from various different developers:

-Modera

-MAA Robinson

-Society Orlando (u/c)

-Radius (u/c)

-Dual Brand across from Radius

-The Julian (CV)

-Modera (CV) (u/c)

-EA (CV) (u/c)

-520 Church

-CSP Phase I

-DPAC Phase II

-Orl Magic Training Facility (u/c)

Ivanhoe area:

-Lakehouse

-The Yard (still u/c...)

Not counting Advent (3-4 projects) or Orlando Health (4-5 projects) projects, Downtown Orlando has had a lot of construction downtown the past 2-3 years; it's just more spread out and by different developers. And if you go back 2 more years in time, yet another handful of projects added to that list, like Novel, Citi, 420, UCF, Union West, Amelia Ct, Exploria Stadium, OPD HQ, etc...

The conclusion: two completely different cities, both developing differently based on factors unique to each.

I recently went to Water Street Tampa and I was amazed. They really put an emphasis on urban design and architecture and I could just see how much more urbanized that development is making Tampa. Do you think a massive development of multiple city blocks can be of more benefit to urbanizing the core versus the various development projects through downtown?

[Uncommon]

7 hours ago, Urbo said:

I recently went to Water Street Tampa and I was amazed. They really put an emphasis on urban design and architecture and I could just see how much more urbanized that development is making Tampa. Do you think a massive development of multiple city blocks can be of more benefit to urbanizing the core versus the various development projects through downtown?

Depends on the developer. It would either be great or terrible based on the vision. I like what Vinik has envisioned for Tampa and I think it works really well. The skyline really does look a lot more dense. It’s still missing a signature building though. A 600- or 700-footer would be absolutely incredible.

[jrs2]

11 hours ago, Urbo said:

I recently went to Water Street Tampa and I was amazed. They really put an emphasis on urban design and architecture and I could just see how much more urbanized that development is making Tampa. Do you think a massive development of multiple city blocks can be of more benefit to urbanizing the core versus the various development projects through downtown?

that Water Street development reminds me of how they are developing Midtown ATL...in a way.  I really like it.   And I like the designs of the buildings.

Um, as to your question, I think drawing an analogy to development in downtown Orlando here and there vs a concise development like Water Street... well, CV in downtown is akin to the density of Water Street sans the 5 story apartment complex vs an apartment tower.  It creates a new quadrant of the downtown which I guess ensures that any one building is not isolated- which is good.  CV has done that as well.  Vinick in Tampa is a little like Ustler in ORL if one were to draw an analogy.

As for Eola South, that neighborhood has evolved over the past 15 years and had to survive the bust and mounted a decent recovery since then.  The Jackson and Star Tower no longer seem like they are islands back in there near Osceola Brownstones.  420 and 520 and CItiTower really brought those projects "closer" to Publix and Central and the Sanctuary/101 Eola core of places to eat.  Add also the other townhouses along Summerlin.

As for North Quarter, after Cheney Place et al at the end of the '90's, and 801 N. Orange during the boom,, NORA, Steelhouse, The Sevens, and the Residence Inn came in years later to fill in those gaps.  It took a while.

In the core, what, we had Robinson & Orange, CSP, Modera, Skyhouse, Radius, Hilton, and Society come/coming in after the bust which ended with Aspire/Dynetech.  that took a few years.

I feel like DTO suffered way more than other downtowns during the bust years and that it was literally on development life support all this time.  Miami has thrived all this time I believe b/c they really marketed the skyline and waterfront properties on the mainland- not even the beach mind you (not talking Sunny Isles), and investors have kept on developing.  I don't think DTO had that type of marketing at all, and the lure of Lake Eola Park by ratio to Miami is nowhere the lure that Miami's waterfront is to it's development zone.

At this point, I believe that the Sentinel property could become like Water Street with the right visionary.

But if you ask me what kind of development I prefer by comparison, I would say the Water Street type of development ala build it all and build it now.  How many businesses have gone out of business because they bought into a development where they were on the ground floor but had to wait for the supporting structures to get built which brought the people?   it's tragic.  At Water Street, you'll have educational, residential, office, and eateries etc., almost simultaneously.  The closest synergy to that in DTO I would say is/was Creative Village.  But online classes is a beotch for that kind of synergistic development.