SouthPark Mall

[Kenneth Disraili-Jean]

Oh Steven!

You've been talking to Nicole Bostic, I just know it!!!

[Temeteron]

Oh Steven!

You've been talking to Nicole Bostic, I just know it!!!

Oh please, i talked to her, she wouldnt tell me anything haha

[Kenneth Disraili-Jean]

^^^^ Well Temeteron, where do you think Nicole will place the new Zara Boutique? I had to ask since Steven has the prediction thing kicking!!

[Temeteron]

^^^^ Well Temeteron, where do you think Nicole will place the new Zara Boutique? I had to ask since Steven has the prediction thing kicking!!

Its hard to say, lets see, (thinking....) if its going to be in the Macy*s wing....since Bombay is closed, and Champs closed that leaves 2 stores Children's Place and Hallmark to have to move....those two stores are both fairly new(or have been moved there recently i should say).....so i dont know if that will work....unless she decides to put it in the main entrance wing where Banana Republic, Guess, and Gap is.....that would really need some shifting around.....And the only spot in the high end wing would be Sigrid Olsen but thats not a big enough spot.....I have no idea what Nicole has up her sleeve...

[StevenRocks]

Oh Steven!

You've been talking to Nicole Bostic, I just know it!!!

Nope, never met her, but it seems like the Macy's wing would be a good fit for Zara. Either there or in place of the horribly oversize Express store next to Dillard's.

[kickazzz2000]

Ok guys, maybe A/X is the bottom of Mr. Armani's line, but Charlotte with a hip, affluent population could certainly support an Emporio Armani Boutique, and I know you can buy online, but they don't offer as many threads, colors, or the supply of sizes that their boutiques do.

I guess we will have to wait for CHICAGO to get theirs first...

[Kenneth Disraili-Jean]

I too find that bizaare that Chicago doesn't have an Emporio Armani SOMEWHERE on Michigan Avenue.

[Temeteron]

Stores I feel need to leave SP:

Likely to leave:

one of the Ann Taylors

Marmi

Savor (QVC)

Torrid

Pacific Green

Unlikely to leave(but im still wishing):

Dillard's

Dick's

Coldwater Creek

Soma by Chico's

Chico's

Water Water Everywhere

Juicy Couture(so overated)

Frontgate

Stores I feel need to come to SP:

Likely:

Diesel

A/X

Gucci

Zara

H&M

Sisley

Sony Style

Club Monaco

French Connection

Marciano

Jimmy Choo

Barneys NY

Unlikely (but im still wishing):

Versace

Miss Sixty/Energie

Bloomingdale's

Dolce & Gabbana

Saks

Just Cavalli

Prada

Bottega Veneta

Oscar de la Renta

[Guest]

Stores I feel need to leave SP:

Likely to leave:

one of the Ann Taylors

Marmi

Savor (QVC)

Torrid

Pacific Green

Unlikely to leave(but im still wishing):

Dillard's

Dick's

Coldwater Creek

Soma by Chico's

Chico's

Water Water Everywhere

Juicy Couture(so overated)

Frontgate

Stores I feel need to come to SP:

Likely:

Diesel

A/X

Gucci

Zara

H&M

Sisley

Sony Style

Club Monaco

French Connection

Marciano

Jimmy Choo

Barneys NY

Unlikely (but im still wishing):

Versace

Miss Sixty/Energie

Bloomingdale's

Dolce & Gabbana

Saks

Just Cavalli

Prada

Bottega Veneta

Oscar de la Renta

I'm glad we have people like nicole bostic. But I'm sure u jest, if so I assure we are laughing with you. You want Dillards to leave, are you serious, I would call that one of the best dillards in the country, even though they screwed up the exterior. Footlocker, Champs and Finish Line are closing, so why would you want Dicks to leave, there has to be someone to fill in that niche. There has to be a balance of stores in a small market like charlotte, and your superlux plan belongs in LA. Lets not forget that the enclosed mall is a dead past, and urban retail is the future. Can we please let Center City Share some wealth. I do agree Juicy is overrated, but I see so many juicy shopping bags at South Park its ridiculous. Keep in mind this is all about the business of making money, not trying to pee further than Atlanta. And about Saks, I have some pretty good sources that say its coming to Village at Lake Norman, and if we had a saks at southpark it would either put neimens outta business or commit a murder suicide in business terms. Savor has great deals and does gppd business, it really just needs better exposure, it was a first of a kind for QVC, and might still be a one of a kind, as my girlfriend puts it, "its a bargain store for the rich."

Its all about Balance.

[ScottCLT]

Unlikely to leave(but im still wishing):

Frontgate

What's wrong with Frontgate? I love that store!

[AuLukey]

I find it ironic that people push for there to be high-end retail uptown, yet it all seems to go to Southpark. What will it take for this trend to shift to get the appropriate types of retail stores in uptown? Charlotte isn't large enough to really constitute having two high-end shopping districts.

I honestly think that Southpark may be the reason we haven't seen high-end retail shift uptown thus lowering the appeal of including retail space in uptown developments to developers. There needs to be some kind of catalyst to change this growing trend.

[Kenneth Disraili-Jean]

Ah people, don't be so hard on Temeteron, after all it's only a "wishlist", and we all can wish.

The stores he would like to see come that are a possibility is very reasonalble for one of the fastest growing cities in the Southeast.

Not sure about Barney's though.

And the latter is truely a "wishlist", that WILL come true one day if Charlotte keeps up the pace, afterall I never thought Charlotte would get an Hermes over some of the other major Southern cities, so if the demand is there, it will come, and every city has it's luxury mall so don't blame SouthPark for the wooes of Uptown.

And Dick's needs to be in a power center not next to an upscale shopping mall, and as far as Dillard's I can't say anything because I have never seen it or been in it.

[Temeteron]

I find it ironic that people push for there to be high-end retail uptown, yet it all seems to go to Southpark. What will it take for this trend to shift to get the appropriate types of retail stores in uptown? Charlotte isn't large enough to really constitute having two high-end shopping districts.

I honestly think that Southpark may be the reason we haven't seen high-end retail shift uptown thus lowering the appeal of including retail space in uptown developments to developers. There needs to be some kind of catalyst to change this growing trend.

This situation has happened (and is still happening) in a lot of cities across the country, especially in the South. Unfortunately people rely heavily on the automobile and suburban lifestyle here, then add the fact that downtown never had an appeal for people to go to until just recently (past 5 years or so), which makes it difficult to lure retail there. Even Atlanta for example, they've had their fashion destinations not in downtown area either (Lenox Square and Phipps Plaza in Buckhead). They are just now getting high end retail closer to Midtown. What I don't understand is, if we are trying to lure activity downtown then why the heck are they building a Saks out in Lake Norman? Not only will that be a pain for us Charlotteans but also for out of towners....people don't want to go to 3 or 4 or 5 different districts to get their shopping done! Unless you are NYC or Miami there is no need for more than one or two high end destinations.

[bork]

This situation has happened (and is still happening) in a lot of cities across the country, especially in the South. Unfortunately people rely heavily on the automobile and suburban lifestyle here, then add the fact that downtown never had an appeal for people to go to until just recently (past 5 years or so), which makes it difficult to lure retail there. Even Atlanta for example, they've had their fashion destinations not in downtown area either (Lenox Square and Phipps Plaza in Buckhead). They are just now getting high end retail closer to Midtown. What I don't understand is, if we are trying to lure activity downtown then why the heck are they building a Saks out in Lake Norman? Not only will that be a pain for us Charlotteans but also for out of towners....people don't want to go to 3 or 4 or 5 different districts to get their shopping done! Unless you are NYC or Miami there is no need for more than one or two high end destinations.

They're building a Saks at LKN because of demographics. While I am all for retail uptown - who wants to be the exec at a large dept store to take that gamble? The demographics of Cornelius are far superior to uptown I'm sure - esp if you go into a 1,3,5 mile radius.

I think the catalyst for downtown retail needs to be - a) more completed condo towers to increase demographics and population and b) proven success starting with something like a bookstore or a smaller shop that can prove people will buy... give the midtown stores some time to establish a proven track record as well.

Anyway, back to Southpark mall

[83alphaunder]

Back to southpark indeed. I was in the area this weekend and I noticed a large blue fixed tower crane over behind the burget king, what is going on back there anybody know?

[Raintree21]

That is discussed in another thread I believe. They tore down the section 8 housing complex behind the Burger King and are rebuilding it as a mixed income community.

[Temeteron]

Retail is wanted uptown by most of us, but what are you guys' thoughts on having high end stores at Phillip's Place? That center seems to be overshadowed by SP

[DigitalSky]

I don't think it was ever the goal of Philips Place to be a competitor to SouthPark, but rather a complement. They seem to have high end retail, but not necessarily well known chains, and cater to a slightly different, smaller and perhaps more upper-echelon crowd.

[Kenneth Disraili-Jean]

^^^^ It appears from thier website that you are correct, specialty highend retail not too far from SouthPark, but where exactly are they going to build the new SAKS?

And instead of a power center store like Dick's next to an upscale shopping mall, it seems to me they would have wanted to add SAKS to the rooster of "specialty stores" along with Neiman Marcus and Nordstrom, unless Simion Properties and Nicole Bostic, the marketing director think having three in one mall would be too much.

[83alphaunder]

And instead of a power center store like Dick's next to an upscale shopping mall, it seems to me they would have wanted to add SAKS to the rooster of "specialty stores" along with Neiman Marcus and Nordstrom, unless Simion Properties and Nicole Bostic, the marketing director think having three in one mall would be too much.

I think this was mentioned before but Neimens and Saks in the same mall, in a market the size of charlotte, that is business suicide. It would put both stores of of business, or kill Neimens. Even though I believe Neimens is on a level above saks, it doesn't have the name recognition Saks does.

Lets list a couple names, and see if they have both names.

Lennox Square: Nope,

King of Prussia: No,

Fashion Island: No,

South Coast Plaza: No.

Tyson Corners: No

Biltmore Fashion Park: No

Woodfield: No

Of the most luxurious, largest, and most well known malls in the US, I can only think of three malls that has both, the Galleria in Houston, Somerset Collection in Troy, MI, and Cherry Creek Shopping Center in Denver. Atlanta has them accross the street from eachother but not in the same mall. I could be wrong, but even if there are others, I guarantee you can't find any charlotte sized markets that have a mall with both.

[kickazzz2000]

I think this was mentioned before but Neimens and Saks in the same mall, in a market the size of charlotte, that is business suicide. It would put both stores of of business, or kill Neimens. Even though I believe Neimens is on a level above saks, it doesn't have the name recognition Saks does.

Lets list a couple names, and see if they have both names.

Lennox Square: Nope,

King of Prussia: No,

Fashion Island: No,

South Coast Plaza: No.

Tyson Corners: No

Biltmore Fashion Park: No

Woodfield: No

Of the most luxurious, largest, and most well known malls in the US, I can only think of three malls that has both, the Galleria in Houston, Somerset Collection in Troy, MI, and Cherry Creek Shopping Center in Denver. Atlanta has them accross the street from eachother but not in the same mall. I could be wrong, but even if there are others, I guarantee you can't find any charlotte sized markets that have a mall with both.

Plaza Frontenac has only two anchors...Neiman Marcus and Saks Fifth Avenue.

[atlrvr]

Saks and Nieman's are in adjacent malls connected by overstreet pedestrian walkways in Boston, but you point is well taken, as Boston is probably the #5 most established retail market in the US.

I do think Saks at LKN is a bit silly, and will underperform, similar to their store in Raleigh. I would think a 2nd location of Nordstrom's there would be more logical.

I do think a smaller urban Saks, similar to the one in Charleston, would ultimately be more successful, even though Saks has acknowledged that their urban stores don't do particularly well.

[DigitalSky]

Saks and Nieman's are in adjacent malls connected by overstreet pedestrian walkways in Boston, but you point is well taken, as Boston is probably the #5 most established retail market in the US.

I do think Saks at LKN is a bit silly, and will underperform, similar to their store in Raleigh. I would think a 2nd location of Nordstrom's there would be more logical.

I do think a smaller urban Saks, similar to the one in Charleston, would ultimately be more successful, even though Saks has acknowledged that their urban stores don't do particularly well.

I think Saks at LKN would do better than Saks in Raleigh.

[brokenraven]

The Saks in Raleigh is off of Capitol Boulevard (aka hell), which makes no sense whatsoever. I'm sure they could have chosen a better location and gotten better results than what's happening now. Similarly, whether or not a Saks would do well in Charlotte, I think, depends on where it goes. Putting the Saks on Capitol in Raleigh would be the rough equivalent of putting a Saks on Independence. It just doesn't make sense.

[DigitalSky]

The Saks in Raleigh is off of Capitol Boulevard (aka hell), which makes no sense whatsoever. I'm sure they could have chosen a better location and gotten better results than what's happening now. Similarly, whether or not a Saks would do well in Charlotte, I think, depends on where it goes. Putting the Saks on Capitol in Raleigh would be the rough equivalent of putting a Saks on Independence. It just doesn't make sense.

Amen. You hit the nail on the head.. in my opinion. Saks would do well at Lake Norman, because of the concentration of high income and its proximity to Charlotte AND it not being in SouthPark where there would be an overtly competitive atmosphere for high-end retail.