Nashville Bits and Pieces

[glamdring269]

13 hours ago, chris holman said:

https://worldpopulationreview.com/us-cities

According to this Nashville is the 20th largest city in the US. 

I looked at the list and thought it pretty amazing that Nashville is above cities like Boston and just a smidge behind a city like Denver. I've been to both of those cities and it just didn't make sense. Then I realized the reason is density. Nashville and Jacksonville are way out of whack relative to the top 20 cities. Even Austin has more than twice the population density relative to Nashville. Anyone know what "Nashville" means in the context of this measurement? Nashville? Davidson County? "Greater Nashville area"?

 

Edited February 3, 2023 by glamdring269

[Luvemtall]

I believe it’s the city proper. Doesn’t include the MSA. 

[donNdonelson2]

30 minutes ago, glamdring269 said:

I looked at the list and thought it pretty amazing that Nashville is above cities like Boston and just a smidge behind a city like Denver. I've been to both of those cities and it just didn't make sense. Then I realized the reason is density. Nashville and Jacksonville are way out of whack relative to the top 20 cities. Even Austin has more than twice the population density relative to Nashville. Anyone know what "Nashville" means in the context of this measurement? Nashville? Davidson County? "Greater Nashville area"?

 

Keep in mind that Nashville IS all of Davidson County, and Jacksonville IS all of Duval County. Both are metropolitan governments that incorporate the entire county into the city.

[jjbradleyBrooklyn]

20 hours ago, smeagolsfree said:

I spoke to Brichar4 about this and the folks that are doing the editing above him on the Nashville wiki page only wany buildings 300' or taller. They do not realize there is no consistency between other city wiki pages as some start at 200 and others start at 300. 

Wiki is a hodgepodge because it is editor run and not professionally ran as anyone can contribute and edit. Brichar4 does a great job keeping it up as before no one had been doing it. When the current under construction is finished, we will have 42 over 300.

Ah, ok, this makes sense. Thanks for the detail here!

Also, wow, yeah, for Nashville to soon have 42 buildings over 300 feet high is phenomenal. Nashville is with the big boys and girls now for skyscrapers.

I can recall when I thought Nashville was impressive for having 14 or 15 skyscrapers over 300 feet. And that was not very long ago--maybe 2010?

I think Nashville may even surpass Charlotte with buildings over 300 feet. Nashville's come a long way, baby!

Edited February 3, 2023 by jjbradleyBrooklyn

[smeagolsfree]

3 minutes ago, jjbradleyBrooklyn said:

Ah, ok, this makes sense. Thanks for the detail here!

Also, wow, yeah, for Nashville to soon have 42 buildings over 300 feet high is phenomenal. Nashville is with the big boys and girls now for skyscrapers.

I can recall when I thought Nashville was impressive for having 14 or 15 skyscrapers over 300 feet. And that was not very long ago--maybe 2010?

I think Nashville may even surpass Charlotte with buildings over 300 feet. Nashville's come a long way, baby!

Well with that being said I do not like comparing cities, but I already have and with what Charlotte has under construction according to Wiki, Nashville will move one ahead to their 42 over 300. I will say Charlotte makes up for it with much taller buildings overall than Nashville has right now. Completed they have an 871', 786', 659', 632', & a 629' under construction that are all taller than our current tallest.

We do have well over 32 buildings proposed over 300' whereas they only have 11 over 300 footers proposed.

[glamdring269]

Speaking of density, I was poking around at the largest cities in TN and noticed that Murfreesboro is the densest of the larger cities and it's not even close. The population growth is simply insane. I moved to middle TN and originally Murfreesboro in 1995 and remember back then being told it was the fastest growing city in the US (or maybe that was Rutherford County) and it really hasn't slowed down.  Originally from Knoxville and would not surprise me if Murfreesboro and Clarksville pass both Knoxville and Chattanooga when the 2030 census rolls around. Will just depend on if the land runs dry I guess.

https://worldpopulationreview.com/states/cities/tennessee

Rank	Name	2023 Population	2020 Census	Annual Change	Density (mi²)	Area (mi²)
1	Nashville	715,913	689,447	1.25%	1,505	475.54
2	Memphis	628,970	633,104	-0.22%	1,982	317.36
3	Knoxville	194,301	190,740	0.61%	1,968	98.71
4	Chattanooga	185,125	181,099	0.73%	1,295	142.96
5	Clarksville	176,859	166,722	1.95%	1,790	98.80
6	Murfreesboro	165,972	152,769	2.72%	2,690	61.71
7	Franklin	89,745	83,454	2.39%	2,158	41.58
8	Johnson City	73,413	71,046	1.09%	1,704	43.09
9	Jackson	69,102	68,205	0.43%	1,185	58.30
10	Hendersonville	64,867	61,753	1.63%	2,066	31.39

[Pdt2f]

5 hours ago, glamdring269 said:

Speaking of density, I was poking around at the largest cities in TN and noticed that Murfreesboro is the densest of the larger cities and it's not even close. The population growth is simply insane. I moved to middle TN and originally Murfreesboro in 1995 and remember back then being told it was the fastest growing city in the US (or maybe that was Rutherford County) and it really hasn't slowed down.  Originally from Knoxville and would not surprise me if Murfreesboro and Clarksville pass both Knoxville and Chattanooga when the 2030 census rolls around. Will just depend on if the land runs dry I guess.

https://worldpopulationreview.com/states/cities/tennessee

Rank	Name	2023 Population	2020 Census	Annual Change	Density (mi²)	Area (mi²)
1	Nashville	715,913	689,447	1.25%	1,505	475.54
2	Memphis	628,970	633,104	-0.22%	1,982	317.36
3	Knoxville	194,301	190,740	0.61%	1,968	98.71
4	Chattanooga	185,125	181,099	0.73%	1,295	142.96
5	Clarksville	176,859	166,722	1.95%	1,790	98.80
6	Murfreesboro	165,972	152,769	2.72%	2,690	61.71
7	Franklin	89,745	83,454	2.39%	2,158	41.58
8	Johnson City	73,413	71,046	1.09%	1,704	43.09
9	Jackson	69,102	68,205	0.43%	1,185	58.30
10	Hendersonville	64,867	61,753	1.63%	2,066	31.39

I’d be interested to see the population and density of the pre-consolidation Nashville city limits. It would obviously be a much higher population density but I’m not sure what percentage of the population of Nashville nowadays lives in areas like Madison, Bellevue, Hermitage, and Bellevue that didn’t used to be in the city proper. 

[tragenvol]

7 hours ago, glamdring269 said:

 would not surprise me if Murfreesboro and Clarksville pass both Knoxville and Chattanooga when the 2030 census rolls around. Will just depend on if the land runs dry I guess.

The difference being that Knoxville's MSA is nearly 900K; whereas, Murfreesboro is only a part of Nashville's MSA.  Clarksville's MSA is approximately 300K. 

[glamdring269]

2 hours ago, tragenvol said:

The difference being that Knoxville's MSA is nearly 900K; whereas, Murfreesboro is only a part of Nashville's MSA.  Clarksville's MSA is approximately 300K. 

I get what you’re saying but I was comparing cities not MSAs.

[MLBrumby]

If this is true, then it simply shows one more aspect of the silliness of renaming streets in the city (especially the numbered streets IMO) as in this case it becomes tit-for-tat. At the very least there should be a policy against naming anything for someone still living. 

Nashville is hard enough to navigate around as it is without disruptive name changes and all that can confuse people. Instead, Metro Council should have found places to commemorate great leaders, such as the Roundabout on 8th for Rosa Parks... and the Hall of Fame park renamed for Rep. Lewis, rather and it's a lot less disruptive to the businesses that have their addresses on those streets.  Some large cities actually note commemorative names on special plates beneath the official street names on signs. But Metro always seems to do things bassackward, and now this spat is bubbling up.  I hope someone who knows Freddie or whoever becomes mayor will resolve to restore all numbered street names and as part of the resolution to designate those people commemorated in names of public spaces and parks. 

https://fox17.com/news/instagram/google-news-politics-ridiculous-bill-renames-part-of-nashville-road-from-civil-rights-leader-to-trump-john-lewis-tennessee#

[Pdt2f]

1 hour ago, MLBrumby said:

If this is true, then it simply shows one more aspect of the silliness of renaming streets in the city (especially the numbered streets IMO) as in this case it becomes tit-for-tat. At the very least there should be a policy against naming anything for someone still living. 

Nashville is hard enough to navigate around as it is without disruptive name changes and all that can confuse people. Instead, Metro Council should have found places to commemorate great leaders, such as the Roundabout on 8th for Rosa Parks... and the Hall of Fame park renamed for Rep. Lewis, rather and it's a lot less disruptive to the businesses that have their addresses on those streets.  Some large cities actually note commemorative names on special plates beneath the official street names on signs. But Metro always seems to do things bassackward, and now this spat is bubbling up.  I hope someone who knows Freddie or whoever becomes mayor will resolve to restore all numbered street names and as part of the resolution to designate those people commemorated in names of public spaces and parks. 

https://fox17.com/news/instagram/google-news-politics-ridiculous-bill-renames-part-of-nashville-road-from-civil-rights-leader-to-trump-john-lewis-tennessee#

I can’t stand all the renamed streets. I’d be 100% in favor of renaming completely to a number or letter system, simply for ease of getting around and giving directions. The problem is that any attempt to do so will be construed as an attack on the civil rights leader legacies or whatever. I think if this change is to be made the impetus would have to come from the state, since city leaders wouldn’t have the political capital to make the change. 

[glamdring269]

Nevermind. Probably not the place for this discussion.

Edited February 4, 2023 by glamdring269

[smeagolsfree]

I am neither advocating for nor against TennCare here, but it looks as if 300k individuals will be being cut from TennCare roles. All I am saying here is that a larger number of the cuts will be in red counties as a higher % of rural counties have more individuals on TennCare. Many of these counties are the same counties that lost their hospital because of state cuts. There is also a bill that will add a $10 surcharge on every prescription if a pharmacy writes under a certain number of scrips per year. I think it was 850k. Again, this hurts the Mom & Pop Pharmacies in mainly rural areas and seems to be paving the way for Walgreens to just take over. 

The news report I saw inferred this was a state law. They were not very clear. It looks as if Nashville is not the only area of the state the legislature is trying to screw.

As I have said in previous posts things can change when the government starts playing with your, healthcare, Social Security, and your taxes. 

[jjbradleyBrooklyn]

On 2/3/2023 at 12:51 PM, glamdring269 said:

Speaking of density, I was poking around at the largest cities in TN and noticed that Murfreesboro is the densest of the larger cities and it's not even close. The population growth is simply insane. I moved to middle TN and originally Murfreesboro in 1995 and remember back then being told it was the fastest growing city in the US (or maybe that was Rutherford County) and it really hasn't slowed down.  Originally from Knoxville and would not surprise me if Murfreesboro and Clarksville pass both Knoxville and Chattanooga when the 2030 census rolls around. Will just depend on if the land runs dry I guess.

https://worldpopulationreview.com/states/cities/tennessee

Rank	Name	2023 Population	2020 Census	Annual Change	Density (mi²)	Area (mi²)
1	Nashville	715,913	689,447	1.25%	1,505	475.54
2	Memphis	628,970	633,104	-0.22%	1,982	317.36
3	Knoxville	194,301	190,740	0.61%	1,968	98.71
4	Chattanooga	185,125	181,099	0.73%	1,295	142.96
5	Clarksville	176,859	166,722	1.95%	1,790	98.80
6	Murfreesboro	165,972	152,769	2.72%	2,690	61.71
7	Franklin	89,745	83,454	2.39%	2,158	41.58
8	Johnson City	73,413	71,046	1.09%	1,704	43.09
9	Jackson	69,102	68,205	0.43%	1,185	58.30
10	Hendersonville	64,867	61,753	1.63%	2,066	31.39

Great snapshot and information! Thanks for posting.

At this growth rate, Franklin will most likely pass 100k by 2030. 

And as others mentioned Clarksville and Murfreesboro will pass Chattanooga and Knoxville by 2030-2035, too.

I feel like the Memphis decline was a long time coming. Memphis is gentrifying pretty well in many areas, but the job and high pay  growth isn't there to support a lot of in-migration.

 

[glamdring269]

1 hour ago, jjbradleyBrooklyn said:

I feel like the Memphis decline was a long time coming. Memphis is gentrifying pretty well in many areas, but the job and high pay  growth isn't there to support a lot of in-migration.

 

It will be really interesting to see what type of impact the Ford EV investment (somewhat) near Memphis will have on the area. Some suppliers will likely need to localize to support as well.

https://www.commercialappeal.com/story/money/business/development/2021/09/27/ford-electric-vehicles-memphis-regional-megasite-new-jobs/5884664001/

 

[samsonh]

1 hour ago, smeagolsfree said:

I am neither advocating for nor against TennCare here, but it looks as if 300k individuals will be being cut from TennCare roles. All I am saying here is that a larger number of the cuts will be in red counties as a higher % of rural counties have more individuals on TennCare. Many of these counties are the same counties that lost their hospital because of state cuts. There is also a bill that will add a $10 surcharge on every prescription if a pharmacy writes under a certain number of scrips per year. I think it was 850k. Again, this hurts the Mom & Pop Pharmacies in mainly rural areas and seems to be paving the way for Walgreens to just take over. 

The news report I saw inferred this was a state law. They were not very clear. It looks as if Nashville is not the only area of the state the legislature is trying to screw.

As I have said in previous posts things can change when the government starts playing with your, healthcare, Social Security, and your taxes. 

https://www.wkrn.com/news/tennessee-politics/notice-an-increase-in-your-prescription-drug-prices-youre-not-alone/
 

here is the prescription topic. Will definitely harm small businesses and rural areas and yet they keep voting for these guys. Amazing.

[tragenvol]

3 hours ago, jjbradleyBrooklyn said:

And as others mentioned Clarksville and Murfreesboro will pass Chattanooga and Knoxville by 2030-2035, too.

 

Likely, but is that a fair comparison?  Both Chattanooga and Knoxville's city population has been stagnant by this metric for many decades.  But in no way are Clarksville and Murfreesboro comparable when measuring against those cities as a whole i.e., MSA.  E.g., Nashville has a larger city population than both Atlanta and Miami....what does that mean?  Nothing when comparing those three cities by their MSAs.

[Pdt2f]

2 hours ago, samsonh said:

https://www.wkrn.com/news/tennessee-politics/notice-an-increase-in-your-prescription-drug-prices-youre-not-alone/
 

here is the prescription topic. Will definitely harm small businesses and rural areas and yet they keep voting for these guys. Amazing.

Rural voters aren’t monolithic in the issues they prioritize in the ballot box. For some TennCare and prescription costs is a big deal, for others not so much. 

[Luvemtall]

2 hours ago, tragenvol said:

Likely, but is that a fair comparison?  Both Chattanooga and Knoxville's city population has been stagnant by this metric for many decades.  But in no way are Clarksville and Murfreesboro comparable when measuring against those cities as a whole i.e., MSA.  E.g., Nashville has a larger city population than both Atlanta and Miami....what does that mean?  Nothing when comparing those three cities by their MSAs.

There’s definitely truth to say that the MSA’s make a difference. But it’s also a subjective thing, in some respects. Yes, when certain cities are totaled including their MSA then of course they are larger, but all the ring cities and towns are in fact their own entities. say when looking at NYC for example, every town and city that surrounds it are connected for hundreds of miles , like all the way to Boston . There’s really no rural area in the tri-state . So those towns don’t count in certain counts , then they do in others . NYC and Boston could be in reality one massive MSA . I question some of the ways things are looked at some times. Point here is if counting JUST the city limits ( how it should be) then yes Nashville is larger then all but 19 other cities. 

[samsonh]

3 hours ago, Pdt2f said:

Rural voters aren’t monolithic in the issues they prioritize in the ballot box. For some TennCare and prescription costs is a big deal, for others not so much. 

This law has nothing to do with TennCare. It affects everyone who gets a Rx at a low volume pharmacy. 

[PaulChinetti]

I’ve read a number of articles and I don’t see the point of this law am I missing something?

[jjbradleyBrooklyn]

10 hours ago, glamdring269 said:

It will be really interesting to see what type of impact the Ford EV investment (somewhat) near Memphis will have on the area. Some suppliers will likely need to localize to support as well.

https://www.commercialappeal.com/story/money/business/development/2021/09/27/ford-electric-vehicles-memphis-regional-megasite-new-jobs/5884664001/

 

That's a good point. I'd be curious to hear how it impacts the population of  Memphis. It will probably stablize and increase the Memphis metro by a small magin, I would imagine.

8 hours ago, tragenvol said:

Likely, but is that a fair comparison?  Both Chattanooga and Knoxville's city population has been stagnant by this metric for many decades.  But in no way are Clarksville and Murfreesboro comparable when measuring against those cities as a whole i.e., MSA.  E.g., Nashville has a larger city population than both Atlanta and Miami....what does that mean?  Nothing when comparing those three cities by their MSAs.

Good point. Clarksville and Murfreesboro, although just fine cities in their own rights, are not as well-established, or truly "big city urban" cities like Knoxville or Chattanooga--especially with their downtowns. 

Clarksville and Murfreesboro have absolutely grown like weeds due to being in the Nashville region. 

[tragenvol]

16 hours ago, Luvemtall said:

 Point here is if counting JUST the city limits ( how it should be) then yes Nashville is larger then all but 19 other cities. 

It is, but that's a stretch, pardon the pun, as Nashville is an outlier in that practically the whole county's population and area is included in the city's limits rather than just what its true city limits might be sans metropolitan status.  Take a comparative look at area:  Nashville city limits (by area) dwarf both Atlanta and Miami's city limits (by area); so, objectively, is it really larger than either Atlanta and Miami by city population metric when factoring area and population density?  Fun with numbers - we could take population density and apply comparatively by discounting Nashville's city limits and Nashville would not be the 20th largest city by population in the country.

[nashville born]

Maybe we can create a string called, The Ones That Got Away.  Everyone could post projects they were really excited about that morphed, stalled, or died.  Who knows, maybe another developer will see and procure the design.  Three of mine:

[smeagolsfree]

I have a thread somewhere but as to where it is who knows, but there is the spread sheet I made.

NASHVILLE HIGH-RISE/MID-RISE PROJECTS CXL, NEVER BUILT - Google Sheets