Cities Without Rail Transit Systems

[Urbanrailfan]

Current systems:

Heavy Rail: Boston - MBTA, New York - NYC Subway, Chicago - CTA "The L", Philadelphia - SEPTA, Cleveland - RTA, San Francisco - BART, Los Angeles - METRO, Miami - METRO, Atlanta - MARTA, Washington - METRO and Baltimore - MTA Subway.

Light Rail: Sacramento - RT, San Francisco - MUNI, San Jose - VTA, Los Angeles - METRO, San Diego - Red Trolley, Denver - RTD, New Orleans - RTA Streetcars, Baltimore - MTA LRT, Boston - MBTA Green Line, Minneapolis - Hiawatha Line, St. Louis - Metrolink, New Jersey - NJ Transit (Newark, Hudson, etc.), Buffalo - Metro, Cleveland - RTA LRT, Portland - TRIMET, Philadelphia - SEPTA Streetcars & Rail, Pittsburgh - Port Authority & Inclines, Memphis - MATA Streetcars, Dallas - DART, Houston - METRO, Salt Lake City - UTA.

Other rail: Little Rock Main Street Car, SF Cable Cars, Detroit People Mover, Disney Monorail, Las Vegas Monorail, Miami Metromover, Clarian Hospital PM in Indianapolis(?), Dallas McKinney Av. Trolley and Jacksonville People Mover, Los Colinas PM.

Commuter: SF Caltrain, LA Metrolink, Dallas Trinity Express, Chicago METRA, Long Island Railroad, Miami Tri-Met, Philly's SEPTA Regional Rail, Boston's Regional T-Rail and MARC between Baltimore and DC.

Under construction: Norfolk, Charlotte, Raleigh/Durham, Seattle, Phoenix.

Disapproved rail plans: Austin, San Antonio, Tucson and Kansas City.

Subway plans never brought up: Detroit

Other cities not having it or proposed: Albuquerque, El paso, Fort Worth (which lost the Tandy Subway), Riverside/San Bernardino, Fresno, Richmond, and Rochester.

Would you live in a city with a current rail system, one under construction, no rail at all, or whatever? Would you even live in a city that would plan to have Bus Rapid Transit or Personal Rapid Transit? What would you say about BRT and PRT being an alternative rail for cities that did not want light rail?

Websites: www.lightrailnow.org

[monsoon]

[Guest donaltopablo]

Albuquerque, El paso

I don't expect to see either of these cities propose a rail system any time soon. Although their city populations are fairly sizeable, their metro populations are still relatively small, half of the size of most other cities that are even considering rail mass transit.

[Urbanrailfan]

Take Fresno, CA, for example, then. 2000 Census pop - 430,000; metro pop. 800,000. http://home.lightspeed.net/~abarbour/fast.html FAST is proposing a Sky Train system for the city of Fresno. Would Fresno people be ready for this type of deal? Otherwise Fresno would have to have 500,000 people in the city at least, whatever the current census estimates are now. And FAX Transit is not even that extensive with 20 bus routes roughly.

www.orlandomonorail.org Orlando Monorail is competing against transit system LYNX to build a rail system from I-Drive area along Interstate 4 to downtown. Orlando metro is 1.3 million with 200,000 in city limits.

www.austinmonorail.org Austin definitely needs a rail system for a city of 700,000, but I doubt many people are paying attention to the idea of monorail transit. Austin's LRT plan narrowly got voted down 50/50. But anyways, on the website, they have maps drawn out to where proposed monorail routes would be, and out of the way of the Texas State Capitol building view. Light rail on Austin should be back on the ballot, because Capital Metro could be signing a deathwish on this new so called All Systems Go proposal - BRT running in narrow thoroughfares in stuck up traffic and commuter rail that doesn't even go anywhere near Austin's business and college core. www.capmetro.austin.tx.us

[danwxman]

There is a proposed commuter rail for Harrisburg, PA called Corridor One. It woud link up the downtown, airport and nearby Lancaster, PA. It's been approved by two of the counties involved and has all the federal funding, but one of the counties involved refuses to give it approval. If it does go through, I believe Harrisburg would be the smallest market in the country to actually have a commuter rail system.

[monsoon]

[urbanguy]

Light rail proposals for Honolulu have been brought up many times and have been shot down but i think it will happen eventually and yeah it would definately work public transportation ridership here is extremely high and many people commute from the burbs to town everyday so it would also help relieve traffic on the highways. Currently under construction are BRT lines but bleh... Anyway there is a proposal for light rail downtown from the harbor waterfront to the cbd and i think into chinatown. Anyhow ill keep ya folks posted when i find out more info about that!

[Cotuit]

Technically, Providence has Commuter Rail to Boston, but it doesn't have any rail to support itself. I think the city is much too small right now to support the expense that would go into a light rail or heavy rail system. We do have actve proposals however to extend Commuter Rail south of Providence, this I think we can support.

So would I live in a city without rail, the answer is (aside from the Commuter Rail to Boston) I do. I would also support a BRT system in Providence, there is talk about reopening an abandoned rail tunnel under College Hill to East Providence and running a BRTlike system through there, I would and do support that, as long as it is able to be upgraded to light rail at some future date when the need is there. If Rhode Island and Massachusettts could work together on transit, a BRT system along Route 195 to Fall River and New Bedford could also benefit the region.

[Urbanrailfan]

What Light Rail in Austin would have looked like in 2007 had it not been voted down so narrowly 50/50.

Going into Downtown Austin

Past the University of Texas campus

NOTE: similar LRT vehicles shown here are used on Portland's Tri-Met system.

[KCghettoboi]

Why is every city voting down lightrail purposal's?...

[monsoon]

[Guest donaltopablo]

It is too bad that others are voting it down.

No doubt indeed. Not to mention bigger cities like Atlanta which are not investing wisely in new and expanding mass transit systems.

[BigCityAttitude]

I didn't know Burlington had a commuter rail system... Where did it link? Really a commuter rail shouldn't have happened in Burlington yet... Not enough urbanity nearby

Edit: Don't bash me for this, but I really dislike Charlotte's trolley. It's very ugly...

[mjtinmemphis]

Why is every city voting down lightrail purposal's?...

One would have to consider that alot of the metro's that are trying to get light rail are under 1.5 million without much of a high density population. Most metro's with a successful light rail systems like Portland and St. Louis had high ridership on bus lines before the light rail was talked about. Where as people residing in Nashville and Memphis don't have the ridership nor the urban population to make the expensive rail system work.

An excellent alternative for Nashville and Memphis with a population between 1 and 1.5 million residents with relatively small cores is something called BRT's that is much cheaper than light rail and alot more efficient than buses.

[Richhamleigh, DC]

Louisville & Cincinnatti have recently voted down light rail plans.

[ElGobernador]

Houston voters also approved rail expansion.

[wolfdawg54]

Jacksonville does not have light rail unfortunately. It would be very expensive though because the city is so spread out.

[Urbanrailfan]

Jacksonville does not have light rail unfortunately. It would be very expensive though because the city is so spread out.

That probably explains why that 1.5 mile Skyway system was originally part of a more extensive monorail system that never got built a long time ago. But I heard that JTA is doing a study right now about Light Rail extensions or possibly Bus Rapid Transit in the city.

[jolive]

Charlotte does not and it is because if idiots like this guy:

This elected official DOES NOT support LRT. The people who choose to live in the high density development that it requires to have even a hint of a prayer to work, subject themselves and their children to higher pollution, that is a fact. For six billion dollars over twenty years the county could give a 60,000 people A YEAR $5000 towards the purchase of a hybrid vehicle, or GIVE 12,000 people a year for 20 years (240,000 hybrids) this would have a real impact on air quality. LRT is a sham and serves NO REAL PURPOSE as relates to air quality or congestion around the transit lines which is where we are luring/persuading people to live and work. Roads work, traffic patterns that eliminate congestion and jobs scattered over wider areas rather than grouped within cities are the answer. Smart growth is equivalent to calling prohibition "smart drinking". It doesn't work. I have been consistent in my views and have now been elected to two offices and re-elected twice more. Thanks

Jim Puckett

Mecklenburg County Commissioner

However, Charlotte is in the process.

[Troy.One]

North San Diego County (Oceanside to Escondido via Vista and San Marcos/Cal State) is getting underway or is underway on a 22-mile/15-station SPRINTER rail project. They are using DMUs and operating them as light-rail.

With the COASTER commuter rail and MetroLink/AmTrak pax. stations in North County towns and on down into San Diego, they'll be tied into San Diego's light rail and Los Angeles' rail lines as well. And, Orange County's light rail as well - if it's built (2009?) ...

OCTA (Orange Co.) is still working on a starter light-rail line (The Centerline) and I have no clue of it's status other than FTA recommended I believe.

[Urbanrailfan]

And, Orange County's light rail as well - if it's built (2009?) ...

OCTA (Orange Co.) is still working on a starter light-rail line (The Centerline) and I have no clue of it's status other than FTA recommended I believe.

More than half of the cities located in Orange County turned down the Centerline propsal recently.

[mjtinmemphis]

LRT is a big part of what is the urban experience. I like the idea of having the option to either drive or take Mass Transit to where I need to go. I don't think that LRT is for every city. St. Louis Denver Dallas Portland are all cities that are good for light rail. However Nashville Memphis and Austin are not urbanised enough to have lrt. If the city doesn't have the money to do the rail system the right way (without runnning it like a street car) they don't need to make the investment.

[samsonyuen]

Detroit has a bit of a rail transit in its People Mover. San Diego, Charlotte, Orlando.

The six largest cities in Canada (the ones above one million) all have rail transit, Ottawa having the least.

[Urbanrailfan]

LRT is a big part of what is the urban experience. I like the idea of having the option to either drive or take Mass Transit to where I need to go. I don't think that LRT is for every city. St. Louis Denver Dallas Portland are all cities that are good for light rail. However Nashville Memphis and Austin are not urbanised enough to have lrt. If the city doesn't have the money to do the rail system the right way (without runnning it like a street car) they don't need to make the investment.

The only metro less than a million to have light rail is Tacoma (180,000), Pierce County with 700,000. The LRT system is The Link, the shortest system in the country with 1.5 miles and 5 stations. Hard to believe, is it?

Tacoma Link and the Portland Streetcar are the only two systems to use these postmodern streetcars.

[Troy.One]

The Tacoma Link is small, really small.

A 'modern streetcar' and nothing more - 3 of them to be exact.

Free.

It'll be nice to see it develop further, become more useful for more people,

and be more integrated into the future regional 'system' someday.

Quite a long time from now.

And, 3 cities in Orange Counties OCTA are still on board for possible LRT according to their site.