Greenville Transit

[greenvillegrows]

Actually, I may have partially answered my own question. Charleston did something similar in 2006. The plan they funded with a 1/2 cent sales tax: http://www.smallchangeforbigchange.org/pre...rtationPlan.pdf

What they sent to the US Justice Department for approval of the vote: http://www.smallchangeforbigchange.org/ord...0Referendum.pdf

The website explaining: http://www.smallchangeforbigchange.org/

Still don't know who in Greenville puts the ordinance on the ballot.

Can anyone say "referendum"?

Charleston County South Carolina puts over $7 million into their transit system. Greenville County puts something like $250,000. The City supposedly puts in a little more. I don't know what individual municipalities put into the Charleston system. Does anyone really think that Greenville is trying to come up with a real transit system? If so, show me the money! Our elected politicians, our government managers, our civic employees, our community volunteers, and the news media have apparantly spent thousands of hours discussing how to be more frugal with our transit spending. What the? Who is spending the time necessary discussing how to spend more money?

$500,000 versus $7,000,000 plus. How do you save your way into a real transit system?

[GvilleSC]

Hopefully when the City and County (maybe) come up with a new plan, they'll be in the same ballpark number wise. I think a plan should be in place first. There is no point in throwing money at the buses without laying out the future, expansions, etc. I didn't think the City was done discussing this issue and therefore the numbers don't represent the results of the City's plan to improve transit? What the county decides will be interesting as we go into the future. They can't ignore this issue.

Edited July 7, 2007 by GvilleSC

[greenvillegrows]

What the county decides will be interesting as we go into the future. They can't ignore this issue.

Actually, they can ignore the issue. They have ignored the issue for many years. They just haven't ignored the issue recently. At least, they have been talking about the issue, but I'm not sure talking about it is actually the same as doing something about it.

[GvilleSC]

Actually, they can ignore the issue. They have ignored the issue for many years. They just haven't ignored the issue recently. At least, they have been talking about the issue, but I'm not sure talking about it is actually the same as doing something about it.

I know they can do whatever they want. What I mean is that if we want to see progression toward a better system, one that meets the needs of the Greenville area, they can't ignore the issue. The objective can't be reached without the County's support.

Edited July 7, 2007 by GvilleSC

[greenvillegrows]

"Two City Council members who voted to scrap the Greenville Transit Authority for a new city-led bus system eight weeks ago now say they are concerned that the city is rushing too quickly toward plan B without the input of riders or experts."

Link: http://greenvilleonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/.../707080312/1004

Does anyone else think this is an extremely strange turn of events? Vote to scrap the system several times over a period of months, after some kind of joint task force looks into the issue for months before that, but then don't agree to manage the GTA when it's all said and done, after even more time has passed because of a lack of input of riders or experts?

I thought it was the "experts" that city council was peeved at to begin with, thus the exit of the General Manager followed by deciding not to scrap the system. What have they been doing all this time? How did that go...

"Hey, I've got an idea - we don't like the way things are so let's shut it down and start over!"

"Yeh, that sounds like a great idea!"

"Let's blame management, OK?"

"Perfect!"

"Wait, you mean that someone wants us to actually take responsibility now? No way!"

"We don't pick up the stones, we just throw them!"

I have to say, I'm very disappointed. I expected better from the City of Greenville. Well, I hoped for better, anyway.

[Spartan]

I am suprised by the City's council memebers' statements, given that many experts have voices their opinion, and I'm pretty sure they had many meetings with the riders themselves who stated their views on the situation. But I'm not suprised by the turn of events. Its a shame too. Greenville's leaders need to wake up and get with it.

[vicupstate]

What the council signed off on BEFORE was a plan that was supported by the city and county jointly. This new plan is just the city alone, except for funding from the county. Given the change of circumstances, it is not unusual that the council members want to know the impact/differences between Plan B and the original plan.

You can't get a full understand of the situation from a couple of pargraphs written by a reporter either.

[greenvillegrows]

Summary of results from local survey about transit.

Graphic included.

81% of respondants said it was very important for Greenville to have a good mass transit system. Only 3% said it wasn't important.

What percentage of Greenville City Council or County Council members will prove that they think having a good mass transit system is important?

[whitehourseview]

Summary of results from local survey about transit.

Graphic included.

81% of respondants said it was very important for Greenville to have a good mass transit system. Only 3% said it wasn't important.

What percentage of Greenville City Council or County Council members will prove that they think having a good mass transit system is important?

Thinking something is important and having the ability to do something about it due to budgetary restrictions are different issues sometimes.

[Spartan]

Assuming that poll is accurate, it would be feasable to have some sort of transit tax in place in Greenville County to support GTA. 81% is very encouraging, but I think they need to do a more scientific poll before they make any decisions. Many people agree with transit in principle, but when it comes time to pay for it, they change their mind. But like I said, that poll is encouraging. I hope that is a silver lining for GTA.

[adrockc2]

A video showing the absolute ridiculousness one must go through to use GTA.

[greenvillegrows]

Thinking something is important and having the ability to do something about it due to budgetary restrictions are different issues sometimes.

I think the above statement is interesting considering the way the WYFF video ends. Other cities prioritize the funding needed for better transit. Citing "budgetary restrictions" is just another way of saying that someone doesn't think the issue is important enough to fund.

Edited July 24, 2007 by greenvillegrows

[goodbye]

According to The Greenville News, the GTA board unanimously voted to hand over operation of the organization to the City.

[gvillenative]

In my opinion a bus only system under ANY management will not work. Move forward with light rail I for one will not even entertain the thought of using GTA till then. I live just outside of downtown Greenville near the hospital and work in Fountain Inn. For one the buses don't even really go anywhere they go on the outskirts of the city limits and they go downtown. Heck the CAT from little ole Clemson goes to Anderson and sometimes out this way. I think I would much rather CAT take over and be the Regional Transit Authority. It's ran way better than GTA has ever been ran. I wouldn't be surprised if Clemson, Anderson , Seneca and all points in between got light rail before Greenville does. GTA is ineffective, scrap it bring in the CAT and watch it grow. For those who are sitting there saying nay nay gvillenative go to the Clemson area and find out for yourself. You're saying to yourself well Clemson is a university they need CAT, well Furman is a university as well heck let them start up a transit system, I'm gonna quit before my brain explodes.

That's my rant and I'm sticking to it.

[Spartan]

I am glad that Greenville has made this decision. This is a good move for GTA's future.

I can't stress enough that its going to take more than throwing CAT leadership at GTA to make it work. Its not just management, its cooperation. Clemson knows that if they didn't have that bus, parking would be hundreds of times worse than it already is. So, the various cities in the area and the university work together to make things happen. And as I have pointed out before, one of the reasons the CATbus works so well is because it has an adequate level dedicated funding. You can take a look at Charlotte, which also has dedicated funding, and see the same thing. The system here works pretty well. Its not perfect, but you can see where the dedicated funds make it work. Greenville City and County seem to have realized this stuation, and I hope that this move is a sign of things to come.

[greenvillegrows]

I think I would much rather CAT take over and be the Regional Transit Authority. It's ran way better than GTA has ever been ran. GTA is ineffective, scrap it bring in the CAT and watch it grow.

The issue is, has been, and continues to be funding. Do you think Clemson will fund Greenville's transportation? No. Greenville has to fund Greenville's transportation. The problem is they don't. Maybe turning over management to Greenville will somehow enable our fair leaders to catch up.

[greenvillegrows]

Mass Transit Plan being presented August 21, 2007 at 1:00 at the Carolina First Center. Draws some interesting conclusions about the state of the GTA and Mass Transit in Greenville.

[adrockc2]

Mass Transit Plan being presented August 21, 2007 at 1:00 at the Carolina First Center. Draws some interesting conclusions about the state of the GTA and Mass Transit in Greenville.

Thanks for the link greenvillegrows. This plan offers several solutions to the mass transit issue. I prefer the LRT option and think it would be more beneficial in the long run. BRT could work just as well and any change to the current system is definitely a welcome step in the right direction. Whatever happens I hope the powers that be have the foresight to put plans into action now to improve the situation as soon as possible.

[gvillenative]

For all on here that have been to the Bay Area, as I recently have for the first time. I loved it, but I digress. The question I pose is this: say we get LRT is this going to be like BART light rail, or MUNI light rail? Although both are great I would much rather a BART, or more local example MARTA, style which has a track of it's own. Whereas the MUNI train is street level, for the most part, and would have to contend with traffic and yes have to stop at intersections. I want a train that gets me from A to B, with the only stops being at the various stations throughout. Don't get me wrong nothing wrong with the MUNI in the least; just not my idea of something I want to ride for 40 miles round trip a day. What would be the difference , the only thing would be me not driving the conductor would be the one dealing with the traffic. It would be great around downtown and maybe out to ICAR and The Point, not to Fountain Inn. I only say this because what I interpreted that report saying is that either way at some point either mode they mentioned would have to run along the street. I would ride a train from here to Fountain Inn everyday if it were on a line the whole way and never on the street. I don't mean to sound like I can't be satisfied , but Rapid Transit to me means not having to stop for anything but designated stations. Maybe I read too much into the report I hope that is the case and I'm over reacting.

[Spartan]

If Greenville were to get rail, it would be more like Charlotte's LRT, which is mostle grade separated, but mixed in some spots too. Charlotte's LYNX has stations and scheduled stops and what not. Nothing like SanFran. The MUNI trains in SanFran aren't quite the same though they are also considered light rail. BART is like MARTA in that it is entirely gradeseparated (meaning under or above ground in such a way that it never interferes with traffic and ususally carries much higher volumes of people. Those types of systems are not what Greenville would be looking at.

I actually htink the MUNI busses would be a good option for Greenville.

[gvillenative]

It would be a good idea for getting around the city of Greenville, but the people who work in the region, i.e. outside of the city would be out of luck. I understand Atl, and San Fran are far bigger than us, however I believe that a system like theirs would be better for getting people from Clemson to Greer, Travelers Rest to Fountain Inn and points in between. At grade level would be better suited for people who are just going out on errands not for people who have to be at work. In my mind, I could be wrong. It's just frustrating that they think about a certain group of people and not all of them. They want to do something about traffic they have to start thinking of the bigger picture not how to get people around Greenville itself. I love Greenville, I've lived here 26 of my 27 years but I don't want something thats just going to take me to Greenville, I hate driving back and forth to work everyday because to be quite honest people don't know how to drive and it irks the crap out of me, so their solution is get me out of my car so I can deal with traffic on the *explitive* train. How does that solve anything? Spartan I mean no disrespect to you I know you were trying to explain it for me and I thank you for it, I'm just having a hard time trying to understand their logic. They want to play numbers our region has 1.2 or so million people in it just not as densely populated if they were to think about the region as a whole they might get a lot more accomplished.

[JCT]

GTA is installing bike racks on their entire fleet of buses. There will be a press conference on Wednesday at 10am to demonstrate the new racks. I think this will be good for the transit system and for the city.

Read more here: http://bikegreenville.blogspot.com/2007/08...-follow-up.html

[gs3]

^ Excellent news. I hope this, along with the new bike racks downtown and additional bike lanes will encourage more usage of bikes.

[JCT]

Greenville News has an article today about the new bike racks

http://www.greenvilleonline.com/apps/pbcs....D=2007708230321

[greenvillegrows]

Article about the City of Greenville shooting down its own proposal of how to fix the GTA.

Nice quote at the end ""We've been so focused for the last 10 years on keeping it alive, we've never gotten around to what GTA will be when it grows up". Sounds accurate. Mayor White, City Manager Jim Bourey, and City Councilman David Suddeth may be willing to take responsibility for fixing Greenville's transit problems, but the rest of City Council seems to consider transit akin to the plague. Hot potato, hot potato!