Greenville Transit

[GvilleSC]

4 minutes ago, PuppiesandKittens said:

Thanks for sharing the info about the new garage.  I may have read too quickly, but it looks like the service increases are aspirational--maybe they'll happen, but it looks like funding (and more buses) would be needed.  Hopefully I'm wrong and the significant service increases are definite.

I think you're right -- that the numbers cited are the possibilities afforded by the new facility. No firm plans in place yet to actually reach that capacity. 

[Tigers81]

I don't love that they went out of town for this contract with a GC from atlanta but oh well..

[vicupstate]

There will be a Greenlink presentation to the Planning Commission at a specially called workshop  on August 1 at 12:00 noon.  Might want to dial in to see what is planned. 

[gman430]

Bids are out for 31 new bus shelters along current routes.

[gman430]

As part of RAISE, USDOT has awarded a $5.8 million grant to Greenlink: Greenlink to get $5.8 million for bus stop improvements (wspa.com) Money will be used to build 336 new bus stop shelters with push button solar lighting and benches. Page 129 for full info: RAISE 2022 FACT SHEETS (transportation.gov)

Edited August 12, 2022 by gman430

[PuppiesandKittens]

Why is there no local leadership that pushes for significantly improved transportation in Greenville?

I get it; it's a car-oriented city.  But the solution that government offers--build more roads and try to slow down development that would put more traffic on the roads--isn't going to fix the problem of growing traffic congestion.  Rush hour traffic, and traffic along I-85, are far worse than they were 20 or 30 (and certainly 40) years ago, and simply building more roads just pushes traffic congestion back a few years.

There is effectively no mass transit in Greenville County.  Greenlink is so skeletal that it's not a viable transportation option for anyone who has an alternative.

There is also effectively no mass transit (other than airlines, if that counts) around the Upstate and to Charlotte and Atlanta.

There is no emphasis on carpooling, cycling, or other high-density, mixed-use development.

The Atlanta-Greenville-Charlotte-Raleigh corridor is relatively densely populated, and similarly-sized cities and corridors elsewhere in the US have far better transportation options.

Each of these could at least help provide alternatives for people who are sick of traffic and don't want to get stuck in it.  Even if only a small percentage of people took mass transit (once mass transit became a viable option), carpooled, cycled or lived or worked in a mixed-use development, those people who chose those options would be free of the pain of driving in traffic.

The response from some in the area- "the free market results in cars and roads as we have them, and anything else is Communism"- is not true.  Politically, I'm a Libertarian or a Mitt Romney Republican, and plenty of people like me think that we can do better.

Edited November 24, 2022 by PuppiesandKittens

[Horatio Nelson]

22 hours ago, PuppiesandKittens said:

Why is there no local leadership that pushes for significantly improved transportation in Greenville?

I get it; it's a car-oriented city.  But the solution that government offers--build more roads and try to slow down development that would put more traffic on the roads--isn't going to fix the problem of growing traffic congestion.  Rush hour traffic, and traffic along I-85, are far worse than they were 20 or 30 (and certainly 40) years ago, and simply building more roads just pushes traffic congestion back a few years.

There is effectively no mass transit in Greenville County.  Greenlink is so skeletal that it's not a viable transportation option for anyone who has an alternative.

There is also effectively no mass transit (other than airlines, if that counts) around the Upstate and to Charlotte and Atlanta.

There is no emphasis on carpooling, cycling, or other high-density, mixed-use development.

The Atlanta-Greenville-Charlotte-Raleigh corridor is relatively densely populated, and similarly-sized cities and corridors elsewhere in the US have far better transportation options.

Each of these could at least help provide alternatives for people who are sick of traffic and don't want to get stuck in it.  Even if only a small percentage of people took mass transit (once mass transit became a viable option), carpooled, cycled or lived or worked in a mixed-use development, those people who chose those options would be free of the pain of driving in traffic.

The response from some in the area- "the free market results in cars and roads as we have them, and anything else is Communism"- is not true.  Politically, I'm a Libertarian or a Mitt Romney Republican, and plenty of people like me think that we can do better.

As far as I know the plan for Greenlink is once they've finished their new Bus Maintenance facility is to increase the frequency of the buses from once an hour to once every thirty minutes which still isn't great but at least gets the system into the realm of usefulness.

And I would say that you are wrong on their being no emphasis on building mixed use that's the city's entire 2040 plan. The node and corridor plan is a great idea to shape the city into something that has the density to maintain a better bus system at the very least and the expansion of the Swamp Rabbit Trail along the Lauren's road corridor next year will do loads for the bike and walkability in that direction.

I say all this knowing we are miles away from being good in terms of multi-modal transportation but I'd say Greenville is proceeding a very good clip considering the part of the country we are in and our relationship with transportation that doesn't start with C and end with R.

[PuppiesandKittens]

On 11/25/2022 at 1:07 PM, Horatio Nelson said:

As far as I know the plan for Greenlink is once they've finished their new Bus Maintenance facility is to increase the frequency of the buses from once an hour to once every thirty minutes which still isn't great but at least gets the system into the realm of usefulness.

And I would say that you are wrong on their being no emphasis on building mixed use that's the city's entire 2040 plan. The node and corridor plan is a great idea to shape the city into something that has the density to maintain a better bus system at the very least and the expansion of the Swamp Rabbit Trail along the Lauren's road corridor next year will do loads for the bike and walkability in that direction.

I say all this knowing we are miles away from being good in terms of multi-modal transportation but I'd say Greenville is proceeding a very good clip considering the part of the country we are in and our relationship with transportation that doesn't start with C and end with R.

Thanks; good points.  While I appreciate the efforts that are being made, ideally Greenville would have (1) a transit link to GSP Airport and (2) regular intercity transit between Atlanta and Charlotte.

I would think that a private company could offer:

1. Buses every half hour or hour between downtown, the Haywood Mall area and the airport.  Perhaps it would circle around downtown hotels or drop people off on demand within say a half a mile of its regular route.

2. Buses every hour or so (or at least at rush hour) between uptown Charlotte, the Charlotte airport, Spartanburg, GSP Airport, downtown Greenville, suburban or midtown Atlanta and the Atlanta airport.

Does anyone already offer this?  (I guess that Greyhound offers Charlotte-Atlanta but I’m thinking higher-end buses would appeal to people who would otherwise drive; trains are probably too expensive to start and operate.). If not, why not; is there not enough demand?

[motonenterprises]

4 hours ago, PuppiesandKittens said:

Thanks; good points.  While I appreciate the efforts that are being made, ideally Greenville would have (1) a transit link to GSP Airport and (2) regular intercity transit between Atlanta and Charlotte.

I would think that a private company could offer:

1. Buses every half hour or hour between downtown, the Haywood Mall area and the airport.  Perhaps it would circle around downtown hotels or drop people off on demand within say a half a mile of its regular route.

2. Buses every hour or so (or at least at rush hour) between uptown Charlotte, the Charlotte airport, Spartanburg, GSP Airport, downtown Greenville, suburban or midtown Atlanta and the Atlanta airport.

Does anyone already offer this?  (I guess that Greyhound offers Charlotte-Atlanta but I’m thinking higher-end buses would appeal to people who would otherwise drive; trains are probably too expensive to start and operate.). If not, why not; is there not enough demand?

I agree. The areas should tie in with transit.

[PuppiesandKittens]

On 12/22/2022 at 11:51 AM, motonenterprises said:

I agree. The areas should tie in with transit.

Thanks.  There is a big need for better ground transportation in the Charlotte-Atlanta corridor.  More passenger trains, also with stations at airports, is my preference, but any type of enhanced transportation options that do not require a person to drive along I-85 would be fine.

There doesn’t seem to be any regional leadership for this, although I am confident that it would have good public support.  (The “public transportation is Communism” crowd likely isn’t a majority.)

I am aware that there have been numerous studies about building a high-speed rail system, but that’s a pie-in-the sky plan, those studies have been done regularly since the 1990s and improved transportation is often done in a step-by-step approach, such as speeding up a train a bit here, adding a train there, etc.

If there are any existing local groups that could take the lead on pushing for this, I’d appreciate knowing.  Otherwise, it’s time to start one.

Edited January 7 by PuppiesandKittens

[GvilleSC]

I support a stop being at the airport, but Greenville also needs a stop downtown, IMO. 

[NewlyUpstate]

2 hours ago, GvilleSC said:

I support a stop being at the airport, but Greenville also needs a stop downtown, IMO. 

With true high speed rail, only one of these options will be possible. There's some major pros to each (if at GSP, intermodal tickets could be purchased in the future where your connection to ATL or CLT is via train. If downtown, you'll see more tourist traffic from CLT and ATL). This is why there just needs to be good connectivity between GSP and downtown by default without requiring a regional train to also provide that same service.

[gman430]

We’ll all be dead before high speed rail gets built here. Keep dreaming. 

[GvilleSC]

21 hours ago, NewlyUpstate said:

With true high speed rail, only one of these options will be possible. There's some major pros to each (if at GSP, intermodal tickets could be purchased in the future where your connection to ATL or CLT is via train. If downtown, you'll see more tourist traffic from CLT and ATL). This is why there just needs to be good connectivity between GSP and downtown by default without requiring a regional train to also provide that same service.

Exactly. I would much prefer the stop being downtown as a tourism driver, but understand that the infrastructure at the airport would support local use (parking, general ease of access).  Maybe one day... 

[gman430]

On 8/12/2022 at 1:41 AM, gman430 said:

As part of RAISE, USDOT has awarded a $5.8 million grant to Greenlink: Greenlink to get $5.8 million for bus stop improvements (wspa.com) Money will be used to build 336 new bus stop shelters with push button solar lighting and benches. Page 129 for full info: RAISE 2022 FACT SHEETS (transportation.gov)

Looks like these are starting to be installed. Noticed a few of them going up along Wade Hampton Blvd. More sleek and modern looking than the old ones. 

[gman430]

Good to see Greenville County Council finally starting to wake up: 

https://www.postandcourier.com/greenville/politics/expanded-public-transit-could-add-2b-to-greenville-economy-study/article_8680cf98-bee7-11ed-afe2-2b6e74c2807e.html

[gman430]

Here a pdf file on the study: 

https://bloximages.newyork1.vip.townnews.com/postandcourier.com/content/tncms/assets/v3/editorial/6/90/6902d9c8-bf6b-11ed-a48f-2b83701c7429/640b6d7b45c6f.pdf.pdf

[PuppiesandKittens]

So there is an advocacy group for better transit: I hadn’t heard of it until recently:

https://greenvilleconnects.org

[MISTER GVL]

I drove for Greenlink and currently serve as a volunteer (Adopt a Stop Program)! One of the major concerns is driver recruitment and retention. One of the solutions is bringing the part time bus operator position back. 

[MISTER GVL]

I believe CONSTRUCTION has started on the NEW Transit Facility at Arcadia Drive off of Rutherford. This will make way for new routes to begin (if they can employ bus drivers) and additional development next to Fluor Field!

[RestedTraveler]

On 4/20/2023 at 7:40 AM, MISTER GVL said:

I believe CONSTRUCTION has started on the NEW Transit Facility at Arcadia Drive off of Rutherford. This will make way for new routes to begin (if they can employ bus drivers) and additional development next to Fluor Field!

Being able to staff is a huge problem for a lot of transit systems these days.  Here in Denver, RTD recently had to combine four rail lines into two because of staffing woes.  Staffing woes lead to service problems.  Service problems lead to ridership shortages.  Ridership shortages lead to more cutbacks.  It’s a vicious cycle.  RTD used to be a hallmark transit system that other cities looked to as an example and now it’s struggling horribly.

[MISTER GVL]

[gman430]

SCDOT Commission voted to provide GTA with $8,603,597 in federal funding and $1,800,000 in state mass transit funding for a total of $10.7 million for the new maintenance facility. With the current appraisal of Augusta Street properties, the new OEM facility is tentatively funded excluding the CNG station.

[MISTER GVL]

The facility is coming along nicely. Has windows now!