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Spartan

European population figures

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All cities i Finland with a population above 100 000., All figures are estimates for 2002.

Helsinki, 574 700

Espoo, 224 400

Tampere, 199 200

Vantaa, 186 000

Turku, 176 600

Oulu, 122 900

Finland overall: 5 214 512 (Estimated July 2004)

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Why are there no central areas for high-rises in Oslo. It seems that sprawl is conroling Norwegian cities. Is this the case or am I wrong?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, we can't find any larger skyline areas, first of all because the cities are quite small, and don't need much of taller high-rise buildings. The city area is also very large so they do not need to built tall and dense. Other cities like Trondheim and Bergen have a central which content a lot of historic buildings. And its almost impassible to built taller buildings in here, because many has strong opinions about high-rise and dense building. But Oslo and Stavanger is two cities which may create a area very central dominated by high-rise buildings. Stavanger already have one, though is quite small but large for such a small city.

And there is a lot of opposition against high-rise buildings, especally in Oslo. There are a lot of opposition against every project which content high-rise buildings, and the city council has started to agree with the opposition in most matters. But perhaps we will see some 20 storey buildings comming up in front of Radisson SAS Plaza Hotel and Posthuset in close future.

See this one:

http://www.urbanplanet.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=7418

But you find this opposition in every Norwegian city today, and not one single high-rise building has been approved this year, exept one in Trondheim which was approved last week.

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Thanks for clearing it up! Also, I thought Helsinki was larger than that. Is that just the metro area only?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No this is the city Helsinki. Helsinki's metro is larger and has a population on 1 147 000. Thats about 50 000 inhabitants larger ten Oslo's metro area.

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That sounds right. Thanks for answering my question. I thought that Helsinki was larger than the previous number that you posted but I see that those numbers were just the city and not the metro.

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European cities do not have the same relation to skyscrapers as american cities have. In many cities it is forbidden to build high rise buildings (i.e Copenhagen). This is to make sure the city will continue to have the same historic architecture. High rise buildings will stand out and put other buildings in the shadow.

As I've visited many american cities, it seems they are more into mixing different architectures. Also, american cities grew (and some still grow rapidly) extremely rapidly, and are not as old as european cities. Therefore they may not have taken concerns to maintaining the "old". Either way, I think it's a matter of taste.

You can just imagine how it would look like if moscow's red square suddenly was surrounded by tall skyscrapers. The Basil cathedral would disspear from the skyline and the city horizon.

Oh, and I have a very new statistic from 2004 about the highest populated areas in Norway.... for the interested (christian? - maybe it was the same you had - SSB - Befolking og areal / Population and area

I was pleased to see where I live, T

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Well, here are some fresh population statistics from Norway, 1.1.2005.

Counties: (Ranking list, from most increase to most decrease)

Oslo ----- Growth: +7 568 ----- Population: 529 454

Akershus ----- Growth: +5 826 ----- Population: 494 444

Rogaland ----- Growth: +4 093 ----- Population: 392 941

Hordaland ----- Growth: +3 415 ----- Population: 448 474

Rogaland ----- Growth: +4 093 ----- Population: 392 941

S

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European cities do not have the same relation to skyscrapers as american cities have. In many cities it is forbidden to build high rise buildings (i.e Copenhagen). This is to make sure the city will continue to have the same historic architecture. High rise buildings will stand out and put other buildings in the shadow.

As I've visited many american cities, it seems they are more into mixing different architectures. Also, american cities grew (and some still grow rapidly) extremely rapidly, and are not as old as european cities. Therefore they may not have taken concerns to maintaining the "old". Either way, I think it's a matter of taste.

You can just imagine how it would look like if moscow's red square suddenly was surrounded by tall skyscrapers. The Basil cathedral would disspear from the skyline and the city horizon.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Right on Danteque. I think maybe the best case for this example would be Paris. Back in the 60's La Tour Montparnasse was ereceted right smack dab in the middle of left bank historical neighborhoods. Parisians vehemently detest this building. It is said by many that the best views of Paris can be seen from the top of Tour Montparnasse because you can't actucally see the building when looking across the city. This was built right around the time of the tragic urban renewal movements in the US. It was thought by many that this was the wave of the future, and Paris has an ugly eyesore as a result.

Most (if not all) of the high rise development in the Paris area is in the suburbs. There is La Defense the west and tons of high rise apt in the St Denis and areas close to the air port. Kind of a backwards city when compared to US cities, but the french have managed to preserve a truly remarkable heritage of historic architecture in central Paris, a truly human scaled city.

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I thought Paris was bigger than 2 mil...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Greater Paris is about 13 million people. The city of Paris is 2 million. I don't know why population figures for cities are even done. If you live in St. Denis in France, your a few miles from the City of Paris. You take that metro into Paris to work, shop, party and eat. Cities are not isolated islands from their surrounding areas, so why show population figures as though they were?

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Hello all... ooohh, my first post here..

Well, I make my first post in something that I have studied a bit over the last few years, that is metropolitan area populations for European cities.

One of the differences between Europe and much of the rest of the world in regards to city population figures is that "metropolitan area" population figures are quite a new concept.

Traditionally, European cities differ from country to country in how they usually have represented their cities population size. Some (such as Germany) have traditionally only used "city proper" figures. Others use city proper and "urban area" figures (which differ greatly in terms of defition from urban area figures in other country's). Some use the term "metropolitan, but mean something quite different, such as France, where metropolitan area's means urban area, Britain, where a metropolitan county is a 1960's definition based on political borders that are no longer used (or updated) or Italy, where it generally refers to a political boundary called a province.

This means that many European's natually don't have a concept of the general "international" definition that we mean, when we reference a metropolitan area. A good decription can be found here Wikipedia, but in general, this means the wider area surrounding a city based on commuter percentages and economic influence of the core city (or group of cities).

These days, most cities in Europe have started to provide true metropolitan figures such as those I've listed below, using the criteria mentioned above. The problem is that they are so new (both in publication and concept) that few people actually realize them. These day's they can often be found at the official city website, or from official documents, but some are quite hard to find, such as those from Italy where they still have no official metropolitan statistics (although there are endless discussions to provide them).

Some of the figures below may be surprising, such as London with 18million. But all you have to do is realize that a metropolitan area can include large swarves of countryside or open land, as long as the population in these area's are "connected" to the core city or surrounding cities and urban area's by commuting and economic ties. London's 18million again has been officially anounced only as recent as last year (references, incl. official government publications can be found here )

Anyway, here is the list. This by the way, took myself and other people assisting several months to compile (problems with all the different languages found across europe, and differing definitions and forumulars proved to be a headache). These are all metropolitan figures, and can be compared only with metropolitan figures from other country's - not urban area, or city proper.

So... here's the list. As you can see, it gives a completely different perspective on the size of European cities when comparing against those of other country's.

enjoy:

United Kingdom

London: 18million

Manchester/Liverpool: 4.8million

Birmingham: 3million

Leeds/Bradford: 1.8million

Glasgow: 1.4million

Sheffield: 1.2million

Newcastle: 1.1million

Germany

Rhein/Ruhr: 12million

Frankfurt (Rhein/Main): 4.9million

Berlin: 4.3million

Hamburg: 3.5million

Munich: 3million

Leipzig/Halle: 2.5million

Stuttgart: 2.5million

Mannheim (Rhein/Neckar): 2.5million

Hannover: 1.1million

Bremen 1.1million

Dresden: 1million

Nurnberg: 1million

Chemnitz - Zwickau: 1million

Saarbr

Edited by justme

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Welcome to the forum justme!

That was an informative post. Do you know when France last did a census? I have always heard that Marseille was the second largest city/metro, not Lyon.

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Welcome to the forum justme!

That was an informative post. Do you know when France last did a census? I have always heard that Marseille was the second largest city/metro, not Lyon.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thanks Spartan.

France like the U.S. uses three main different models to define it's city's metro at a national level. This is actually quite unique in Europe, and France has one of the most comprehensive urban statistical databases in the continent.

The French government agency called the INSEE (the national statistics office of France) Is the equivilent of the American census Bureau.

The three levels are "city proper", "urban area" (unit

Edited by justme

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Some data about the cities in Slovakia:

Bratislava: 428 th. (2001 census), although around 600-700 th. in metro

Kosice: 236 th. (2001 census)

These are two most important and populous cities.

Other cities with population more than 60.000

Presov 93 th.

Nitra 88 th.

Zilina 86 th.

Banska Bystrica 83 th.

Trnava 73 th.

Martin 61 th.

It surely depends, for example Bratislava and Trnava could made one and it almost is one metropolitan area (highway, plus very good rail connection). The same is valid for eastern Slovakian Presov and Kosice.

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Czech republic (2004 estimate)

Prague: 1.166.000

Brno: 370.000

Ostrava: 313.000

Plzen: 164.000

Olomouc: 101.000

Liberec: 98.000

Ceske Budejovice: 95.000

Hradec Kralove: 95.000

Usti nad Labem: 94.000

Zlin: 79.000

Still, these are the official numbers, taking into account the number of permamnent residents in the city boundary. If taking inot account the metro areas, the numbers could be at least 30% higher.

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There's no way the UK has a population of 60,270,708. In 2001 it had 58,500,000. Growing only about 250-500,000 since the last census.

Well, there is a tangle due at an adjustement with the last census. See by yourself (from Eurostat).

Population of United Kingdom (1,000 for years 2002 & 2003)

1950 : 50 616 000

1960 : 52 164 400

1970 : 55 546 400

1975 : 56 231 256

1980 : 56 284 953

1990 : 57 459 319

1999 : 59 391 145

2000 : 59 623 406

2001 : 59 862 820 (est.)

2002 : 59 139.9

2003 : 59 328.9

2004 : 59 673 084

From theses results we can reasonably estimate 60 millions this year.

Population of Ireland.

1950 : 2 969 000

1960 : 2 835 500

1970 : 2 943 300

1975 : 3 163 900

1980 : 3 392 800

1990 : 3 506 970

1999 : 3 732 201

2000 : 3 777 763

2001 : 3 832 973

2002 : 3 899 876

2003 : 3 963 665

2004 : 4 072 732 (est.)

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Updating from Insee for the french municipalities.

name of the city (population census 1999) population 2004

Paris (2 125 246) 2 142 800

Marseille (798 430) 795 600

Lyon (445 452) 468 300

Toulouse (390 350) 426 700

Nice (342 738) 339 000

Nantes (270 251) 276 200

Strasbourg (264 115) 273 100

Montpellier (225 392) 244 700

Bordeaux (215 363) 229 500

Lille (184 657) 222 400

Rennes (206 229) 209 100

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It's all very interesting, because at the same time, the population of Germany, Italy, and Spain are beginning to fall. They probably will never grow again as women have so few children over here that even with mass immigration, the population will fall almost indefinitely (unless, of course, there's a baby boom, which doesn't seem likely).

The population of Germans in Germany is projected to fall from some ca. 75 million today to 57 million by 2050. It's all very interesting.

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It's all very interesting, because at the same time, the population of Germany, Italy, and Spain are beginning to fall. They probably will never grow again as women have so few children over here that even with mass immigration, the population will fall almost indefinitely (unless, of course, there's a baby boom, which doesn't seem likely).

The population of Germans in Germany is projected to fall from some ca. 75 million today to 57 million by 2050. It's all very interesting.

I agree with you Snowguy.

Looking at these results from Insee, the stats regarding Germany are impressive and possibly premonitory for all Europe.

Natural increase in the European Union (total from 1999 to 2003).

Total European Union (25 countries) : 1 261 000

France : 1 129 000 (

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