MIAMI | Dadeland, Kendall area

[KendallKid]

Wow, I got a lot of feedback for that little post...I didn

[Brickell]

Wow, I got a lot of feedback for that little post...I didn

[metropolis]

by the way...as far as I know one of the confirmed tenants at Dowtown Dadeland (that's the 7 buildings...7 stories each) is Krispy Kreme, so unless that has changed, then there'll be another one there.

[Paul]

They stopped making new metrorail cars a long time ago (I'm pretty sure all of the trains are about 30 yrs old.) They just hired more drivers and are running the trains faster. You're right about the trains being less crowded now (I have ridden lately) but I didn't want this to become a discussion on the amount of train cars Miami has.

It

[Aessotariq]

Paul, welcome to UrbanPlanet and I'm glad you found us. We welcome and encourage contrasting points of view. The purpose of this forum is to inform and provide a medium by which we can exchange these viewpoints in a constructive and scholarly manner, and ideally it's in this type of discourse where we have the greatest potential to effect change where it is most needed.

Consider that we are going to be gaining at least 1 million people within the next 20-30 years. Let's assume for purposes of argument that those people will be comprised of families of 4. That's 250,000 new households, with the potential for each household to have two cars. That's 500,000 new cars on the road, on top of all the 1.5 million or so cars that are already there. If we could make it possible for families to have one less car per household, OR make it more possible for people to leave their cars at home by using clean, reliable, and safe transportation, think of all the gridlock that we could reduce.

By building residences closer together, placing grocery stores and other amenities near them, you won't have to drive to get a gallon of milk or go see a movie. Build those residences near transit nodes and suddenly it's easier and more convenient to travel long distances. That's the beauty behind TOD - transit-oriented development. When you build high-density and mix uses, i.e., don't separate houses from shopping centers from offices, you have less need to travel by car from place to place to place. Take the Towers of Dadeland, for example, across from Dadeland Station. A resident will be able to get his hair cut, get lunch, buy a sofa, shop at Target, all without getting in a car, and one Metrorail stop away is Sunset Place, where he can go see a movie. This is what we're going to have to do if we are going to be able to sustain an-ever increasing population, which is showing no sign of slowing down any time soon.

We did ourselves a great favor by passing the People's Transportation Plan half-cent sales tax back in 2002. Metrorail will be expanded to cover more areas and our train cars will be completely gutted and refurbished. We follow the progress very closely here. I encourage you to read through the to see all the new improvements that are on the way. Have you seen what the new Metrorail and Metromover cars are going to look like? Click here to see the Metrorail cars, and click here to see the Metromover cars.

This is only the beginning. Watch as more mixed-use transit-oriented development is built along the Metrorail corridors, both the existing track and future. The zoning that governs the downtown Kendall urban district requires that buildings have colonnades or awnings so that pedestrians have covered walk areas, so it will be possible to wait for a bus in the shade and out of the rain (or hopefully your destination will be somewhere along a Metrorail line). It's the way that we have built in the past that makes some areas hostile to transit, with huge parking lots, building setbacks, no shade, and other design elements that are hostile to pedestrians. This will take many years to undo, but at least now we're on the right track.

So, let's hear what ideas you have: tell us what you would do if you were mayor or a commissioner and had the decision-making power to improve the system. These types of discussions are much more productive. Again, welcome to UrbanPlanet, and I look forward to your continued participation in our discussion.

[Paul]

Well, one thing I wouldn't do is expand the Metrorail out to sweetwater which is what Miami officials are planning on. They should focus on the more populated areas like Kendall, Coral Gables, and Miami Beach instead of going west all the way to 107th ave.

I've heard that Kendall's priority date for county funding in Metrorail improvements is in 30 years. With a population of about 400,000 that is rapidly growing Kendall will have the population of a major city with no real transportation to show for it.

If everyone lived in downtown dadeland than traffic will ease up for sure. However, my prediction is that when these people move into Dadeland from West Kendall or where-ever theyre from, new people will just fill in their spot.

My concern isn't 30 years from now when I may or may not be living in Miami but 5 years from now when Kendall will have worse traffic than it has ever experienced before downtown dadeland was built. In the long run the "tod" will relieve some traffic but in the short run the addition of 3500 new households to any area regardless of their access to public transportation will always increase traffic.

[dave8721]

Well, one thing I wouldn't do is expand the Metrorail out to sweetwater which is what Miami officials are planning on. They should focus on the more populated areas like Kendall, Coral Gables, and Miami Beach instead of going west all the way to 107th ave.

I've heard that Kendall's priority date for county funding in Metrorail improvements is in 30 years. With a population of about 400,000 that is rapidly growing Kendall will have the population of a major city with no real transportation to show for it.

If everyone lived in downtown dadeland than traffic will ease up for sure. However, my prediction is that when these people move into Dadeland from West Kendall or where-ever theyre from, new people will just fill in their spot.

My concern isn't 30 years from now when I may or may not be living in Miami but 5 years from now when Kendall will have worse traffic than it has ever experienced before downtown dadeland was built. In the long run the "tod" will relieve some traffic but in the short run the addition of 3500 new households to any area regardless of their access to public transportation will always increase traffic.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Or Miami's office decentralization will continue and offices will move out to West Kendall to be nearer where people live (rather than vice versa).

[Aessotariq]

^ An alarming prospect, especially when you look at what that has done to someplace like Doral. A bi-directional rush hour.

Well, one thing I wouldn't do is expand the Metrorail out to sweetwater which is what Miami officials are planning on. They should focus on the more populated areas like Kendall, Coral Gables, and Miami Beach instead of going west all the way to 107th ave.

This is one of those delicate political balancing acts that involves appeasing enough people to get everyone on board while at the same time getting the projects that will have the highest benefit done first. If the focus had solely been on Kendall et al., I very seriously doubt that the tax would have been approved by northern county residents.

With that said, however, within 4-5 miles of the FIU-Airport line is where a significant amount of office space is located (Blue Lagoon, Doral, Airport West, etc.), and where there is significant potential for heavy usage. It would also intersect with the Turnpike and the Palmetto, allowing for Park-n-Ride stations. For Kendall and Coral Gables residents who work in those areas, they will suddenly have a new option of using the metro to get downtown or to the airport area instead of taking the Palmetto and 836.

Improvements to Kendall-area (and countywide) transit in the short term will require a combination of several things: increasing headways, synchronizing traffic lights, and feeding more lines into the Busway and Dadeland South/North stations. I like to think of the rail/busway as a spinal cord with lots of tributary nerves feeding into it. Expect to see more of those 3 digit circulator routes in the future as the fleet expands.

Synchronizing the traffic lights will go a long way toward improving flow, and that's something on the pipeline within the next 2-3 years. Advanced Traffic Management System (ATMS) technology will be able to evaluate traffic conditions in real time and adjust signal phases where necessary to maximize the capacity of the intersections... With the click of a mouse an intersection could be adjusted, and a computer will eventually learn to do it automatically via Adaptive Signal Control.

Miami Beach shot itself in the foot and severely ruined its chances of getting Baylink on the docket sooner. That city's mayor was vehemently opposed to the project and slowed down its progress tremendously. Last year a majority of the city's voters effectively threw egg in his face by expressing support for the project in a non-binding straw ballot vote.

My concern isn't 30 years from now when I may or may not be living in Miami but 5 years from now when Kendall will have worse traffic than it has ever experienced before downtown dadeland was built. In the long run the "tod" will relieve some traffic but in the short run the addition of 3500 new households to any area regardless of their access to public transportation will always increase traffic.

The question is, where do you want that traffic to be? You can remain status quo and place that new housing stock somewhere out in West Kendall where they'll have to drive for everything and generate a high number of car-trips (the individual number of times a vehicle is put on the road), OR you can be proactive by placing that new stock where there will be less need to use a vehicle and people are afforded a viable alternative... With that, you are offering a choice. And as with everything, there will be short-term improvements, worsenings, and in the long-term it should all be worth it.

[Paul]

I was at Office Depot earlier today (the one next to downtown dadeland) and I realized that the whole site is seriously lacking green space. The nearest field is below the metrorail and requires crossing Kendall and the nearest park is Continental Park which a little too far to walk.

Pet owners and parents are going to have to walk across Kendall whenever their kids want to play or their dogs need to...take care of bussiness. I think the Kendall Medical Building should be turned into a park. The only problem is that the owners of that land have no insentive to do such a thing.

I also hope that the condos leave a little room for landscaping. It seems like they could leave a little room for a swale between the sidewalk and Kendall and still be "pedestrian friendly." Instead they are building directly on Kendall which is actually a little intimidating for some pedestrians.

[Aessotariq]

Somewhere in the Brickell area I've seen "dog parks" along the bayfront, with little swales and dispensers with bags..

A friend and I were talking about how it would be nice to place a park where the Medical Building is presently located and surround it by eight buildings. It would be like a "town square", like the center piece of a tic-tac-toe board. If/when that building is torn down, that would be a great place for one. Part of that parcel might be acquirable via eminent domain...

[metropolis]

The neighborhood is going to be lacking green areas, no doubt. As for the medical building, I don't think a park is in the plans, in fact, what is in the plans is knocking it down and replacing it with a new and modern high-rise medical plaza. The entrance of Metropolis Tower I is going to have a tiny little green area in front of it. You can get an idea in the computerized virtual tour at: http://www.metropoliscondos.com

[Brickell]

Some green space is desperately needed there... even a little pocket park would work wonders. hopefully somebody steps up, because it doesn't look like the county will.

[Sniper]

by the way...as far as I know one of the confirmed tenants at Dowtown Dadeland (that's the 7 buildings...7 stories each) is Krispy Kreme, so unless that has changed, then there'll be another one there.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Although I'm not 100% certain, I believe the salesperson at Downtown Dadeland mentioned that Krispy Kreme was interested in retail space early on, but had not committed and looked as though they wouldn't. Too bad, because my whole family happens to love their donuts!

As for those retail stores that will be included as the ground floor of the Downtown Dadeland complex, here's a list (from their own website):

-Pier 1 Imports

-Cargo Kids

-The Bombay Company

-Chili's

-Macaroni Grill

-Men's Warehouse

-Sprint

-Bacio

-Blue Moon Sushi

-Blu Pizzeria

[Aessotariq]

That's a pretty eclectic mix of retailers!

I was a kinda disappointed but not really surprised to learn that Office Depot was now leasing the space where Just for Feet used to be. That probably means that the strip mall next to Downtown Dadeland will be there for a while. It would make an enviable place for another project.

What I'd like to eventually see is all the tenants in that center (Office Depot, The Container Store, Old Navy, among others) relocate to a future tower somewhere in the urban district and tear down that shopping center and build it up. I'm dying to see that CompUSA building go too.

[racerxsfl]

Wow, when this whole DT Dadeland thing mania kicked off I few years ago I thought this was great as I was living on US1 between 72 and 88. I absolutely loved living in this area. For so. fl. standards to be able to actually walk to so many things was pretty rare not to mention the diversity of ethnicity and age mix. Unfortunately job relocation has moved me out of miami but I started to notice all of the "canal" apartments as I called them starting to go down one by one and new high priced developments going up or "coming soon". Sometime after moving a colleague had even told me that my old modest 2 story apartments were being converted and selling for like 200K. So my question to you guys is:

Do you think that when the projects continue to go on that ALL of the affordable housing in the area will vanish?

And if so....

Will the area lose much of what makes it differ from the rest of miami and just be a vertical Pinecrest?

[Brickell]

I think the area will still be "affordable" by Miami standards. 200k is affordable with todays prices. I think it will be much more difficult to own, but rents should stay on the lower end. Very few of the big projects are displacing homes (except in the canal area).

On the other hand, the convenience and urban living has to cost something. It's a hot area. Maybe affordable will just have to make do with West Kendall.

Once the bloom is off the boom, I think we'll start to see some places marketed towards lower price points. With easy access to UM and downtown as well as a growing retail presence, I think Dadeland will continue to grow and mature.

ps. welcome to the forum.

[Aessotariq]

TOSCANO UPDATE

NE corner of Toscano retail/office building fronting Kendall Drive is starting to be painted. Also a connecting bridge to Toscano residential tower is being constructed.

Toscano residential tower

Related UrbanPlanet.org topic: South Florida P&C: Toscano

[Aessotariq]

METROPOLIS UPDATE

Metropolis 1 now has some color

Related UrbanPlanet.org topic: South Florida P&C: Metropolis at Dadeland

[Aessotariq]

DOWNTOWN DADELAND UPDATE

Downtown Dadeland, facing south, as seen from Kendall Drive

Facing east, intersection of Kendall Drive (SW 88th Street) and Dadeland Blvd

Looking west toward Metropolis, Toscano, and Datran Center. This looks like it might become a new street.

Related UrbanPlanet.org topic: South Florida P&C: Downtown Dadeland

[Aessotariq]

KENDALL SKYLINE

[Aessotariq]

COLONNADE UPDATE

After months of permitting snags and other issues, the long-delayed Colonnade is starting to break ground.

Related UrbanPlanet.org topic: South Florida P&C: Colonnade

[metropolis]

Great pics Aessotariq!

One more update for you Downtown Dadeland fans:

I went into the sales office yesterday for Toscano Towers (located next to Saks 5th Ave. in the Dadeland Mall) and the sales person told me that the Citibank parking lot has just been sold off and a 7-story (or so) building will soon go up in that space. The first floor is already confirmed to be a City Furniture (some healthy competition for Rooms To Go, since they're going to be the first floor tenants in Toscano). The rest of the building is going to be a parking garage. I bank at that Dadeland Citibank and my only concern is that there will be a fee to park at the bank now, but I suppose this is part of city living and in the end will be well worth it.

The Toscano office was very friendly and informative; they are putting up one heck of a building with amenities that are comparable to the Metropolis Towers: 24 hour valet parking, 24 hour concierge, high rise swimming pool, fitness center, etc.

I think this area will be one of the nicest places to live in Florida in a couple of years.

[Aessotariq]

Wow, this is really cool... There certainly won't be a shortage of places to buy furniture now, will there... Add to that the Thomasville in Dadeland Station and the Macy's Home and Furniture Gallery in the mall, and there will be at least four such places within the downtown area.

When that building on the Citibank parking lot starts going up, I think that's when you're finally going to see everything come together. With two buildings on each corner, you'll have a "grand entrance" into the area. Dadeland Blvd is going to look spectacular. Can't wait.

[Aessotariq]

DOWNTOWN DADELAND UPDATE

Downtown Dadeland buildings A, B, C, and D are coming along nicely. The Downtown Dadeland project consists of seven 7-story buildings atop an underground parking garage.

and Building B (northwest corner of lot @ Dadeland Blvd and Kendall Dr.) has topped off at 7 stories.

Buildings E, F, and G will be built on top of this future parking structure:

A banner posted on the construction site indicates that the residential units are nearly sold out, only a few units remaining.

[prahaboheme]

Great update. That Downtown Dadeland project is going to be really cool. So much going on there, its crazy!