Charlotte Bobcats Arena

[49er]

yes but this particular location (DD) will do good business due to location across from the transit center and the light rail stop. most street level businesses would fail if they only depended on traffic from the building they are located in.

[Spartan]

I agree with you metro. Arenas like do tend to create dead space around them, but I think there are steps that can be taken to mitigate that effect. The retail on Trade St should be commended, because its an attempt to correct that very problem. I think the type of retail that locates there will be decided by what gets built around it. I'm assuming the site accross from the arena on Trade between Brevard and Caldwell is going to be redeveloped sooner or later. If its office or whatever, it will be good for those businesses

[BUILDIT]

and an aquarium wouldnt? Not trying to drag this back up again, but any large place for the public is going to break the overall flow of downtown... besides that there was no reason for me to go that south of tryon before that was built and thats sad... soon there will be more reason. and one more argument against the aquarium idea everyone I have talked to agrees that an aquarium, though good for a city is a place you visit once maybe twice a year at the most. The arena has a lot going for it... But I respect your opinion and hope we can peacefully disagree

[Raintree21]

Do you think that when the LRT is up and running and everything around there is a little more complete, adding more people in the general area, that they will add more event to the arena line-up? They already have a good number of events but if you have a captive audience, why not cater to them.

[Andyc545]

Do you think that when the LRT is up and running and everything around there is a little more complete, adding more people in the general area, that they will add more event to the arena line-up? They already have a good number of events but if you have a captive audience, why not cater to them.

[New Name]

Outside of Monday - Friday 9-5, what purpose does anyone have to walk from the North of the Arena to the South - there really isn't much to do south of the arena. There is no shopping there, there is no strolling, no museums, no parks, nothing to see. Until we give people a reason to walk from College to Caldwell, these shops will have limited foot traffic.

[Andyc545]

Outside of Monday - Friday 9-5, what purpose does anyone have to walk from the North of the Arena to the South - there really isn't much to do south of the arena. There is no shopping there, there is no strolling, no museums, no parks, nothing to see. Until we give people a reason to walk from College to Caldwell, these shops will have limited foot traffic.

[jednc]

Also, I could see Dunkin Donuts and Five Guys (if that's the 3rd tennant) being destinations in and of themselves. Trust me, if the people living downtown now and in the next 24 mos. don't flock to Five Guys, I'll be shocked.

I just thought of something...the Burger and Fries concept could also be something like Cook Out (also not a bad place to grab a burger).

[Spartan]

and an aquarium wouldnt? Not trying to drag this back up again, but any large place for the public is going to break the overall flow of downtown...

[krazeeboi]

Marshall Park is a joke and that site is set to be redeveloped last I heard. I think the planned establishment of the retail corridor along Caldwell will definitely help with pedestrian activity in the arena area. Being that the arena borders the government district, it will take a bit more to sustain activity in that general area and I think everything planned/under construction so far helps with that.

[monsoon]

....

How do those hot dog & donut vendors do on Tryon St? If they are doing well, then something like that could might work......

[Justadude]

I agree that the issue has mostly to do with a lack of reason to walk south of the arena. The design of the arena itself really isn't half bad for pedestrian traffic, especially in that it creates a kind of natural plaza/eating area for people picking up a bite to eat. I'm not totally crazy about the way the restaurant space interacts with the street, but the proof will be in the pudding once they open for business. The missing element is a stream of foot traffic through the area, without which even the best-designed space wouldn't have much success. Once the southern parcels are redeveloped, I would expect the arena plaza area to be a pretty popular spot to hang around, maybe comparable to the Green or the Hearst courtyard.

[jfuptown]

From tonight, photo of the DD/BR:

Looks like they are working on the other retail spaces.

[rooster8]

They really should update the banners and take the Sting off.

[Raintree21]

How do those hot dog & donut vendors do on Tryon St? If they are doing well, then something like that could might work.

[uptownliving]

In the short term I think that these restarants might not do so well but there are a lot of things happening in the area that will make it a good longer term investment. Later this year I expect to see an increase in foot traffic when the LRT line opens up and EpiCentre starts getting phased in with openings. I expect another uptick in foot traffic when the Sierra Suites Hotel opens at the Arena site in about 2 years. And then looking further out in about 5 years when the new Federal Courthouse is complete adjacent to the Arena. And also in about 5 years the YWCA site is redeveloped.

In about 5 years that section of Trade from College to Caldwell has the potential to have some good foot traffic and decent street level retail.

[Justadude]

Just an observation from tonight... came into town around 2:30 and decided to drive up College just to see what the vibe was. There were so many people at both Fuel and Pita Pit that the sidewalk was completely impassable and pedestrians were having to go into the street to walk around. This is, what, two or three blocks from the arena by foot? If the D&D were to go 24-hours on weekends like the Graham St. location, they would probably take a bite out of that crowd... IF there were a reason for that crowd to move southward instead of circulating up and down College and Tryon. Again, I really think the arena restaurants are in a good location for the long-term, if they can overcome the short-term lack of good reasons for pedestrians to pass by them.

[monsoon]

I have pointed out before that one little section, the one that contains fuel pizza and the pita place, is the only place in downtown Charlotte that is built properly for street retail. You will note that most of the rest of downtown is fairly dead including the area around the areana. It's simple street design 101 which nobody follows in Charlotte including the people were so hell bent in catering to the NBA they dropped a several acre arena right in downtown that created a dead zone. It's as if they didn't note the complete failure of the BofA stadium where the same was promised for it, and now the seek to do the same with baseball.

Evidence enough is from the posts from the nice guy from France that posts here and recently took a visit to Charlotte. Compared to other places our downtown, other than a place to get drunk at night, isn't that exciting.

[charlotte49ersuptown]

I believe the biggest reason why Pita Pit and Fuel Pizza are so swamped at night is not design, it is the fact they are OPEN. When the bars let out at 2am, the only places open Uptown are Pita Pit and Fuel Pizza, except the Dunkin Donuts on Graham Street to my knowledge. If the Dunkin Donuts was open 24 hours a day on the weekend at the arena it would help but you still have to get people down there, three blocks is a long way when you have been drinking all night and its not on the way to your place. I still can't believe that no one can make a 24/7 diner work Uptown. They would make a killing, epecially on Wed-Sat night. If someone would just build a Waffle House Uptown it would solve everyone's late night food cravings.

[Spartan]

They make a killing. Even with whatever they have to pay for their street vendors license.

Marshall Park won't exist anymore with the 2nd Ward redevelopment plan when the county officially trades their land for the stadium land.

[Justadude]

I have pointed out before that one little section, the one that contains fuel pizza and the pita place, is the only place in downtown Charlotte that is built properly for street retail. You will note that most of the rest of downtown is fairly dead including the area around the areana.

[Andyc545]

Metro, I fail to see your comment about Fuel/Pita being the only appropriate design for street retail. I think it's success is the brand, the type of food (a cheaper/non-fast food that is direct downtown serving to an incredible amount of ppl during the days and nights (because of the bars). Where The Graduate is, that seems to get a lot of food traffic to me as well and many other locations have peaks and downpeaks. Metro, what do you see in this location (Fuel/Pita) that makes this a good design for street level retail vs. other locations. I'm sorry, I just don't see it, other that location and product; but that doesn't have to do with design....

I think the design of retail on Trade for the Bobcats Arena is great. The sidewalk there is very large that you can support outdoor eating as well as safely get pedestrains pass. The only problem is the lack of pedestrians. But like others have stated, it's the long term investment that will pay off, and once there is residential, business, and hotel nearby I'd say in the upcoming few years, this area will have a good amount of people on off-event days, and be incredibly busy (also the place to be) on events.

[monsoon]

Metro, I fail to see your comment about Fuel/Pita being the only appropriate design for street retail. ......

[charlotte49ersuptown]

I have pointed out before that one little section, the one that contains fuel pizza and the pita place, is the only place in downtown Charlotte that is built properly for street retail.

[monsoon]

Metro, that is exactly what you said.