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Downcity/Providence Retail

AriPVD

By AriPVD
in Providence

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Nyuszi Unincorporated Area

Nyuszi

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Andres Duany was letting a lot of information out (or perhaps starting a lot of rumours) when he did his design charrette last year. One was that a NYC grocery was scoping out Downcity and was 'very' interested in locating a store there.

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I think I remember that being contingent on a lot of things. I can't recall the details, but I think that was a case where there was some kind of three party swap/parking thing. Like, the market could only move in if a second party got the lot and was able to expand parking by overtaking an adjoining property and that owner wanted something in return.

I have to say, more than even the principles of New Urbanism, that final meeting taught me so much about the weird dealing and politics involved in development!

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Cotuit Megalopolis

Cotuit

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I think I remember that being contingent on a lot of things.  I can't recall the details, but I think that was a case where there was some kind of three party swap/parking thing.  Like, the market could only move in if a second party got the lot and was able to expand parking by overtaking an adjoining property and that owner wanted something in return.

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I think there was a rumour about a grocery being interested, and he was proposing his own plan to make it work on the space that he thought was most suited. It was the parcels where the Weybosset hill parking lots are. The one at the corner of Snow and Weybosset is owned by one guy, the parking deck at Weybosset and Empire is owned by someone else. I seem to remember him advocating the city taking one lot by emminent domain and forcing the other owner to sell that way. They're managed as one but owned by two parties and are only profitable together... it was all quite confusing!

I have to say, more than even the principles of New Urbanism, that final meeting taught me so much about the weird dealing and politics involved in development!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Indeed! :ph34r:

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Nyuszi Unincorporated Area

Nyuszi

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I'm going to be lazy about my response by ignoring what's already there and what isn't and just listing my total, ideal package:

+ Full Service Banks, ATMs

+ Pharmacy

+ take-away coffee shops

+ coffee shops/cafes that serve breakfast/lunch and have pleasant seating

+ inexpensive take-away lunch places

+ a range of lunch/dinner restaurants, including something like a Bertuccis that's a smaller chain and would lure in families and college kids

+ self-service laundromats, dry cleaners

+ sporting goods store

+ Bookstore

+ some specialty/gift stores like stationary, tech gadgets, etc.

+ 24 hour convenience (I saw this was controversial, but I think it's important)

Of course, as Duany pointed out, the presence of the mall makes all this a lot harder. So I actually think some high-end/elite/niche stuff needs to move in early as well. I think that pragmatically speaking, it would be much easier to start there and then attract businesses that would normally locate in a strip mall or shopping center than to try to convince someone like CVS or TJ Maxx that it's currently worth their while to be a pioneer.

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Garris Town

Garris

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Wow, lots of stuff here... Random thoughts...

1) The Mall: The Federated merger sucks. I hate Macy's, hate all their brands. I'll be sorry to see Filene's go... This seems like a lose-lose to everyone except the company, who gets a lot of back room savings and the ability to consolidate their advertising behind the Macy's brand. As a NJ Nets player once famously uttered, "Whoopee damn doo." Retail must be pretty brutal right now.

2) City Sports: They'll do well there is my prediction...

3) Duany: I like that list for a neighborhood. Works well...

4) Red Spa: They're behind schedule. I was going to buy my girlfriend a holiday gift there, and they said they were opening the first week of January. Oops! They've got to be thrilled to invest in the Biltmore when the Biltmore folks have been telling everyone who'll listen that they'll close shop if even one more hotel room opens in Providence...

- Garris

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Cotuit Megalopolis

Cotuit

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2) City Sports: They'll do well there is my prediction...

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I second that. And I like that even though they are a chain, they are based in New England (Massachusetts).

4) Red Spa: They're behind schedule.  I was going to buy my girlfriend a holiday gift there, and they said they were opening the first week of January.  Oops!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

There's a big ass sign on the side of the Biltmore saying they are opening in February 2005.

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Cotuit Megalopolis

Cotuit

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On the downside of Biltmore news, the Garrison Chocolates outlet there closed, did it not?

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I don't know what they were thinking about with that spot. Sure it's in the Biltmore, if you leave the building and walk around to the back alley. Not that Downcity is thriving with retail, but could they find a spot where they would have had fewer retail neighbours? Who were their neighbours on Washington, City Hall, a parking garage and a bunch of city and state social service agencies? Their closest retail neighbour was the liquor store in the narrow building.

They would have been better off with a storefront on Dorrance or in the 50 Kennedy Plaza building where the Watch Hospital is. Even the Arcade would have been better.

Maybe they'll come back Downcity in a few years when Westminster's hopping.

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pdxstreetcar Whistle-Stop

pdxstreetcar

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Now that we know a grocery store is coming to downtown Providence, do we know anymore as to who this retailer could be?

I think downtown needs more variety and they need to be open weekends and nights. There are too many sandwich, coffee, doughnut and cafe places and not much else in the way of food downtown. But I am amazed that Quiznos is open on Sundays. For retail downtown, there is only Dress Barn, CVS and that new Westminster St bookstore, oh and Design within Reach (but thats also new). Downtown needs at least one large retailer (besides that future grocery at 110), this would also attract smaller retailers to open nearby.

Downtown needs to make sure that pedestrians feel comfortable downtown. People should not feel hostility when they walk around, by that I mean streets need to be easy to cross and store fronts need to be occupied and empty lots need to filled. In Portland there are strict ordinances regarding blank walls fronting the sidewalk and also surface parking lots must have a low, punctured and decorative wall which gives the sidewalk an edge and reduces the expansive open space feeling that parking lots have. Some would say these are restrictive but they have done miracles to Portland and revived the city's core.

I have always wondered what downtown Providence could have been if instead of the mall the stores scattered around downtown on the ground floor of existing buildings with the department stores possibly building their own buildings on the site of parking lots since they need large stores. It would never have happened but wow downtown would have been awesome.

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provid Hamlet

provid

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Btw the people renting the units at peerless have told me more than once they want a grocery store in one of the Peerless retail spots.

If we did not have a mall I dont think you would find stores scattered around downtown. Providence. The mall has been a reason why alot of things have happened for downcity.

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Cotuit Megalopolis

Cotuit

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In Portland there are strict ordinances regarding blank walls fronting the sidewalk and also surface parking lots must have a low, punctured and decorative wall which gives the sidewalk an edge and reduces the expansive open space feeling that parking lots have.  Some would say these are restrictive but they have done miracles to Portland and revived the city's core.

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I think there is a lot about Portland that could be a model for Providence.

If we did not have a mall I dont think you would find stores scattered around downtown. Providence. The mall has been a reason why alot of things have happened for downcity.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I agree, I don't think anyone would be here now (retailerwise) without the mall.

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eltron Hamlet

eltron

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Btw the people renting the units at peerless have told me more than once they want a grocery store in one of the Peerless retail spots.

If we did not have a mall I dont think you would find stores scattered around downtown. Providence. The mall has been a reason why alot of things have happened for downcity.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I agree...as much as I hate the mall in concept, it really has done wonders for Providence...

on that point, I wonder why the mall here was so successful, while we read the urban malls of worcester and hartford were complete failures and are now being torn down? maybe it was the shear scale? types of stores? location and visibility (easy on and off the highway, just like a suburban mall)?

as far as the grocery store, I have heard repeatedly that a trader joes is going in somewhere, and it certainly should hurry up...I think the market for it here is already pretty huge...

also on the topic of grocery stores, I heard that a huge new wholefoods is opening in Cranston, at which time the Wayland Sq. location will close. Thats a shame, I like the little one, and hate seeing stores go suburban.

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CtownMikey Burg

CtownMikey

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Hey, my input is more for the teen- mid twenty crowd. But I would like to see high-end stores like french connection and von-dutch. YES, these are verrrryy expensive places to shop at...but Providence has the most colleges per square mile ..or college students per sq mile.. something like that-- in the entire country!!! I'm just sick of driving to newbury street and nyc for these marvelous brand names! I DESPISE BOSTON!

As far as a pharmacy-- I work for walgreens and they are still the #1 pharmacy in the country- (they have less stores than cvs and they still make more money ;) ) hah..but no really, they offer many more prescription services that would benefit those who need them. And maybe it would make the cvs' ceo, Thomas Ryan, step up and build the cvs HQ in providence. But i know the drugstore business, and walgreens loves to be on the corner of "main street and main street", and with providence getting this new mini building/population boom, a pharmacy will definately be in the mix soon!

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CtownMikey Burg

CtownMikey

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I'm sorry I have to add one more thing. Everyone who visits providence complains about the dead nightlife. I agree with previous posts that we need to have places open after 5 and 6 pm at night, like at least 10pm!! a few 24hr places would be nice..with security guards of course.. and clubs need to stay open a couple of hours later..weekdays and ends. Providence nightlife ends at 2am on weekends and 1am on weekdays!!! thats when new yorkers start to shower and go out! :P I just know a bunch of people who are turned off by it and drive to New haven or Boston and they would love to stay here if "curfews" were different

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Cotuit Megalopolis

Cotuit

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There's a proposal to allow the clubs to stay open until 4am. This will allow the clientele a chance to sober up before leaving, and could also stagger the times that people exit, instead of a mass 1 or 2am exodus. Of course we may just see a mass 4am exodus.

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Cotuit Megalopolis

Cotuit

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I remember that as Duany's proposal during the charette.  Any idea on a time frame?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm not sure what ever became of it. I believe there was a formal proposal to the city council, there was obvious resistance to it. I'm not sure if it's dead or still on the table.

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