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James Island Reincorporation


Spartan

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Opposition to property taxes in any form, or for any reason contributes to it as well. Local Governments are treated as red-headed step-children (by the state) in virtually all aspects, not just annexation.

The state constantly passes unfunded mandated onto the localities, which raise property taxes to compensate. Residents blame the local city and county councils, but the legislature forced their hands.

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One recent one was the reduction of Auto/Boat Property Taxes. The legislature put a constitutional amendment on the ballot that required property taxes on Autos and boat to be lowered from 10.5% of value to 6% of value. Of course, it passed overwhelmingly. Localities were given 4-5 years to incrementally implement it, but they received no replacement revenue. Consequently, many cities and counties had to raise the tax millage (which affects all taxable property) to compensate.

I past years there have been other mandates to build landfills with tougher (read: more expensive) environmental restrictions, add jail space, additional court requirements, etc. Money never goes with the mandates. A few months back there was an article with some excellent examples, I put under a thread on the SC Legislature, but that was a few months back.

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From JAMES ISLAND:

Hi Folks,

I saw virtually no posts on this topic from someone living on James Island, so I thought I would offer my perspective. I've seen lots of speculation regarding the reasons why "I" want to be in the Town of James Island and not in the City of Charleston.

There are many reasons, some of which include arguably more taxes. MUCH more important to me is self-determination. I've seen what the City of Charleston has done on James Island, and it is a disgrace. More importantly, we the residents didn't have a voice in these decisions. Examples include development of the Dill Sister

Edited by JimIslander
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From JAMES ISLAND:

Hi Folks,

I saw virtually no posts on this topic from someone living on James Island, so I thought I would offer my perspective. I've seen lots of speculation regarding the reasons why "I" want to be in the Town of James Island and not in the City of Charleston.

There are many reasons, some of which include arguably more taxes. MUCH more important to me is self-determination. I've seen what the City of Charleston has done on James Island, and it is a disgrace. More importantly, we the residents didn't have a voice in these decisions. Examples include development of the Dill Sister

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...There are many reasons, some of which include arguably more taxes. MUCH more important to me is self-determination. I've seen what the City of Charleston has done on James Island, and it is a disgrace. More importantly, we the residents didn't have a voice in these decisions. Examples include development of the Dill Sister's land, and recently the sale of McLeod Plantation, both of which I pass almost daily in my travels on the Island.

Can you imagine licensing your dogs, cats, and bicycles? That's a City of Charleston ordinance. I think it is ludicrous for me to have to pay for a $5 license for every dog or cat I have and a $1 license for each bicycle I own. This borders on communism in my eyes. We live in a semi-rural community, and these rules (laws!) make no sense here. Can you conceive of the arrogance it takes to poke your nose into something as personal as owning a bicycle or requiring licenses for the family pet?...

...Charleston City Council consists of 13 members, only one of whom lives on James Island. The James Island PSD Commission consists of 7 members, all of whom live on James Island and all of whom are directly elected by PSD residents. Any Town government will be subject to MY vote, instead of the entire City of Charleston population.

The bottom line is that we are a town. We may not be incorporated yet, but we are a village of people, separate from the City of Charleston. We are not a funding source for the City's projects, yet. If we don't form our own town, we'll eventually be assimilated by The City. And if our votes can carry the day, we never will be.

Hi JimIslander, and welcome to the UP! As much as I hate to do this with your first post, I have to vehemently disagree with your position. And while I do not currently live on James Island, I grew up West Ashley for 24 years, both sides of my grandparents lived on the island (where we visited and stayed quite frequently), and my sister and her family (husband and son) currently live there. So, I think I do have extensive knowledge about the island and what should be done here.

First of all, responding to your last paragraph, JI is not a town or a village. It is merely a section of the metro area of Chas which sits on a barrier island and is a collection of past-rural houses and suburban neighborhoods. My mother's grandparents lived on Woodland Shores Road for years, and there were plenty of houses built around them on the entire street. If you asked my grandparents where they lived, they would say, "Charleston", not James Island as if it were its own little town, miles away from other cities. As a matter of fact, JI is and has been historically integrated with Chas since before the Civil War.

You are incorrect with your number of Chas City Council members who represent the residents of the island. There are three council members for JI; while one council member represents JI exclusively, two others also represent other parts of the island. The island doesn't have a huge density of people within the city limits, so they can't add another city council member to represent a small portion on the Stono River side of the island. Just because somebody lives on the other side of Wappoo Cut , does that automatically disqualify them to represent the island according to the council districts?! I think this is just a petty excuse to fuel the disdain for the city. You say that residents don't have a voice with what's going on JI in the city. Well, you don't live in it. Are JI residents trying to dictate to the city what they want it to do when they don't even pay any city taxes? I'm just saying that's what it appears to be. If you want representation, get the unincorporated people to annex into the city...JI will end up getting at least one more city council member. AND if you want Mayor Riley out of office, you can vote him out! The islanders will have more voice because they would be constituents of the city rather than outsiders trying to control another entity.

You mentioned the development and growth of the island, blaming much of the influx of people on the city. This is also plain wrong. I've posted about this earlier in this thread, but I'll say it again: the majority of neighborhoods and developments were being built long before the city started annexing parcels on the island. The city started annexing land in the late 1970s, but many neighborhoods were being built or already existed, with the county providing zoning and allowing for construction. Unincorporated areas continued to be developed under very loose county ordinances, only to have the city annex the properties later, after they were completed. The blame cannot be blamed squarely on the city...the county provided the impetus for James Island to become what it is today.

JI may have been "semi-rural" 25 years ago, but it started growing before Chas annexed alot of the island, and it is not that way now. It is a suburban, bedroom community of Chas, and the gateway to Folly Beach or "The Edge of America". Licensing cats, dogs, or any pets is essential to maintain order in an area full of people. It also defends against the spread of diseases such as rabies. Licensing a bike? That's news to me. I had a bike all the way through college at The Citadel, and I never had to do that. But here's the caveat, if you don't like that rule, you can do something about it...if you are a city resident! Calling the city communist sounds extremist to me, even some of the town founders appear that way.

I think it is very naive to think if the remainder of JI incorporated, there won't be any new taxes and the town could get by with three employees. I'm sure that's a similar message they gave when N. Chas incorporated 30 years ago. Take a look at it now...

Edited by Charleston native
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BTW, confused and islander, GREAT points. The paper ballots, the leadership, the lack of information all help further the case that this incorporation should be a big "red flag". The attitude of the town proponents seems to basically be anti-Chas and Riley-hating, certainly not attitudes of unifying the community. They provide reactionary responses to why the town should be voted for, but they do not have reasonable, logical reasons for it.

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There are many reasons, some of which include arguably more taxes. MUCH more important to me is self-determination. I've seen what the City of Charleston has done on James Island, and it is a disgrace. More importantly, we the residents didn't have a voice in these decisions. Examples include development of the Dill Sister
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I also think the pseudo-town is trying to freeload off of the county and the city. The town has mentioned no plans for more parks or recreation, most likely because the county and the city already have built numerous parks for JI. It is amazing how these people want a new town, but they don't want to even provide their own security system...just make other county people do it with their taxes!

BTW, what exactly do you mean about shutting down Ravenel? Does the town have its own police? I had no idea the state intervened with them. As far as I know, if JI's incorporation is successful, the entire island would have no land technically in the county alone. It would either be in the town or the city of Chas. A contract with the county (which would include extra tax money!) would have to be created for the sheriff's offices to continue patrols. Do people see how many complications this incorporation would bring to the area? It's just redundant bureaucracy.

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Charleston Native,

You know how a lot of these people are. They hate Charleston, but this July 4th will be right down at Sun Rise Park, which is owned by Charleston. Even if they form a new Town, they will go down to the Sun Rise park and celebrate the victory! Then the next day head downtown for breakfast and a walk around town.

My neighbor said Ravanel only had 600 people in the town, was awarded a lot of tax money when they formed, and the State came in and shut them down. He is extremely reliable, although he could have gotten his rink dink towns mixed up.

By the way the big JI vote is today. I have been by twice and it looks like mostly older, retired people are voting, and the last thing they want is higher taxes.

But the Town supporters are so hell bent on forming their own town, the last election was also a two to one vote in favor of the town, so no one knows which way it will go today.

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But the Town supporters are so hell bent on forming their own town, the last election was also a two to one vote in favor of the town, so no one knows which way it will go today.

hi everyone,

I just voted on my paper ballot in a CARDBOARD BOX VOTING BOOTH, :rofl: Placed my ballot in an old fashioned Wooden Box too! I cannot believe #1) they did not use the election commission for this election #2) That I literally had to vote inside of a makeshift cardboard box with what looked like a shower curtain (and rod) attached to it.

I have my fingers crossed until we find out the results, I will say that I did see a hec of lot more voters than I have ever seen for this type of election, Parents of children that my kids are friends with, young voters, I was impressed with what I saw at my facility at the Camp Road Fire Station.

I was wondering how we can find out EXACTLY who ran this election, since they did not use the election commission, How do we know that these people are not all Town Supporters who will happily throw all of the "no" votes away?? I know that sounds mean, but I just feel like that is the point they(town supporters) have come to and it wouldnt surprise me if something like that happened, oh well, i guess we will find out tonight!!

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Granted, 35% is better turnout, but consider that it still is a poor showing for a town that would be almost 20,000 people. Again, if this election was held on a day that most people could vote (General Election Day), more voters would have come and the outcome would have been different. I think the town supporters know this, and chose a summer day as well, when summer is a time when families are out of town for vacations and the like. These people manipulated the system, just as legislation was manipulated to allow for the town to form. :angry:

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Granted, 35% is better turnout, but consider that it still is a poor showing for a town that would be almost 20,000 people. Again, if this election was held on a day that most people could vote (General Election Day), more voters would have come and the outcome would have been different. I think the town supporters know this, and chose a summer day as well, when summer is a time when families are out of town for vacations and the like. These people manipulated the system, just as legislation was manipulated to allow for the town to form. :angry:

While I do not support James Island's incorporation and the extraordinary steps taken to allow it, I don't think this is a valid complaint. Once the petitions and paperwork is certified, the election window is like 120 days max (90 maybe?). By law, the election couldn't be held in November.

Considering a presidential election gets 50% turnout, a 35% turnout is pretty respectable. Given the one-sided outcome, I would not have expected a 40 or 45% turnout to change things. I'm sure some of the incorporation supports were on vaction as well. Remember, if 20,000 people live in the new town, several thousands of that number can't vote because they are too young, unregistered or a convicted felon.

I think this whole thing has become a grude match, and logic went out the window a long time ago. Hopefully, the Supreme Court will toss it out again.

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