North Hills / Midtown area developments

[ctl]

On 1/28/2018 at 9:47 PM, Jones_ said:

NH aims at upper middle class

Let's see what price tag is attached to Kane's high-rise condos, especially the upper 10 floors. We might get into a Trumpian debate about what "upper middle" is. My guess is that he's targeting rich folks for those.

Edited January 30, 2018 by ctl

[Trent Y]

Yeah the Soleil site should still be where the Westin goes. I think it was a reliable source that commented on the Raleigh Connoisseur site that said he had seen details of something around 26 floors. Which would make sense. The original 43 floors was a bit ambitious for that location maybe.

[RALNATIVE]

1 hour ago, Trent Y said:

Yeah the Soleil site should still be where the Westin goes. I think it was a reliable source that commented on the Raleigh Connoisseur site that said he had seen details of something around 26 floors. Which would make sense. The original 43 floors was a bit ambitious for that location maybe.

Yes I agree, however Kane is planning to build a 30+ story tower at NHE so maybe something around that height would be a good fit for the former Soleil site?

[Jones_]

8 hours ago, ctl said:

Let's see what price tag is attached to Kane's high-rise condos, especially the upper 10 floors. We might get into a Trumpian debate about what "upper middle" is. My guess is that he's targeting rich folks for those.

Possibly, and that's less of a problem now. The upper middle class focus in the beginning is what mattered. It built the cache that could support the high end prices now.

Like I said, the problem for Soleil was always that Crabtree sucks, and NH is better (though not a real downtown of course) when it comes to "street level" experience. NH's walkable areas are plazas and parking lots that aren't too overwhelming, but there are lots of outward facing stores to pop in to. Crabtree never ever will have a lovely area to walk around outside, that isn't the greenway along the creek. It is squarely built around the notion that you do your living in this here spot, do your shopping in there here spot, and do your outdoorsey stuff in this here spot. Nothing is integrated. Sure there are a ton of apartments there now, but I'm guessing says that the grade A money in this town isn't getting plunked down for that style of living. I think that seeing how a project like Hargett Place is nearly sold out...its fairly contemporary/conservative styling and all...is very indicative of the forever-trend. Enclosed malls and 100% separation of uses will trend downward until the sun forces us into Mars style habitat domes. Crabtree will be town down or disassembled ala NH before it ever sees a 40 story building with condos aimed at the 1%....unless we turn into Miami... 

[ctl]

I don't disagree about the future of enclosed malls, and personally yes I'd rather live next to NH than Crabtree. A friend of mine has a high-rise condo in Honolulu. I've enjoyed the easy accessibility to shopping, dining, and entertainment that it provides... although the view is a bit different.

That said, it's conjecture whether Soleil would have sold out if it had been built. There are a fair number of suburban rich folk who already live the disconnected lifestyle you describe -- apparently without regret -- and would have seen Soleil as exchanging a 4000 square foot house on a half-acre lot (e.g. 27614 north of 540) for the 39th floor of Soleil. We will never know.

Edited January 31, 2018 by ctl

[KJHburg]

The Cardinal at North Hills announces a new 15 story residential tower at Midtown at North Hills.  https://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/news/2018/03/30/new-tower-in-works-for-north-hills.html?ana=e_ae_set1&s=article_du&ed=2018-03-30&u=oAaDx%2B74FoP4qOJ%2By4AU6dhJPpc&t=1522438689&j=80778061

[KJHburg]

Here is midyear recap of North Hills and NH East.  Did not know about this 33 story tower called the Walter.  An all residential tower.

https://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/news/2018/07/25/north-hills-report-reveals-new-businesses-and.html?ana=e_ae_set1&s=article_du&ed=2018-07-25&u=oAaDx%2B74FoP4qOJ%2By4AU6dhJPpc&t=1532549281&j=82909591

[RALNATIVE]

50 minutes ago, KJHburg said:

Did not know about this 33 story tower called the Walter.  An all residential tower.

Hopefully it looks sleek and modern, unlike everything else being built these days.

[DanRNC]

6 minutes ago, RALNATIVE said:

Hopefully it looks sleek and modern, unlike everything else being built these days.

Will look great out in the burbs.

[ctl]

Reminds me of the Soleil Center. Although Kane's building will be 33 floors instead of 43, its ground elevation will be 60 feet higher.  

[Trent Y]

Predicting 300ft+ and 400+ft for tower 4 and The Walter. With those completed as well as the 15 story tower announced, North Hills will have a larger skyline then downtown Greensboro and Durham currently.

[DanRNC]

14 minutes ago, Trent Y said:

Predicting 300ft+ and 400+ft for tower 4 and The Walter. With those completed as well as the 15 story tower announced, North Hills will have a larger skyline then downtown Greensboro and Durham currently.

Greensboro stopped building their skyline 70 years ago and Durham has just entered the 21st Century. 

[Trent Y]

1 hour ago, DanRNC said:

Greensboro stopped building their skyline 70 years ago and Durham has just entered the 21st Century. 

Regardless both are cities of roughly 250k-300k people. I know North Hills can be polarizing to some but i still think its pretty impressive that Raleighs second skyline will be arguably better then two other large cities in the state.

[DanRNC]

4 minutes ago, Trent Y said:

Regardless both are cities of roughly 250k-300k people. I know North Hills can be polarizing to some but i still think its pretty impressive that Raleighs second skyline will be arguably better then two other large cities in the state.

Sad, but true. However, at ground level NH is a disgrace. 

[Trent Y]

1 minute ago, DanRNC said:

Sad, but true. However, at ground level NH is a disgrace. 

Well im definitely not saying North Hills will be better then downtown Durham or Greensboro. But i think North Hills is building well for what it is. It needs to connect the two main districts better for sure. The six forks split kind of stinks but otherwise i think its a nice place. Doesnt have the culture or vibe of a downtown but its very dense, walkable, and importantly has ground floor presense with every building. Honestly, if i worked up there, i could park my cars for months and be able to do eveything i need. Thats pretty solid to me. But again its not for everybody i suppose.

[DanRNC]

I have also just seen NH as a glorified strip mall. While I give Kane credit for having some type of vision, the execution was abysmal. I will say it is better than it's runted littermate in Charlotte - the Metropolitan.  

[Jones_]

1 hour ago, Trent Y said:

Well im definitely not saying North Hills will be better then downtown Durham or Greensboro. But i think North Hills is building well for what it is. It needs to connect the two main districts better for sure. The six forks split kind of stinks but otherwise i think its a nice place. Doesnt have the culture or vibe of a downtown but its very dense, walkable, and importantly has ground floor presense with every building. Honestly, if i worked up there, i could park my cars for months and be able to do eveything i need. Thats pretty solid to me. But again its not for everybody i suppose.

My main gripe is while it is walkable within it, it does not integrate well with the rest of the city and adjacent areas, very well. I realize that is partly to offset the gripes of adjacent single family neighbors. Perhaps in time....

[DanRNC]

It's an outdated relic of the brief yet endearing faux urbanism phase (circa 2000 - 2015).  Don't worry - John Kane the 3rd will be bulldozing this place in 2055 for a self-driving car centric development just in time for Raleigh's new/old/recycled 50 times transportation plan. 

[Green_man]

geez.  sure do go out of your way to add some negativity without any substance.

[DanRNC]

5 minutes ago, Green_man said:

geez.  sure do go out of your way to add some negativity without any substance.

Satire.

[ctl]

On 7/25/2018 at 5:11 PM, DanRNC said:

Will look great out in the burbs.

Really, I wouldn't call NH the suburbs. It's only halfway between the State Capitol and the northern city limit, and in the new Wake County transit plan it will get some frequency of service. Raleigh has different areas, some of which are dominated by apartments, townhomes, and (gasp) even single-family dwellings, but we all pay the same taxes, vote for the same Mayor, etc. To me a true suburb is Fuquay-Varina, Knightdale, etc.  They weren't founded as suburbs but they have definitely fallen into that category.

[Jones_]

I would call it high density suburban. 

Contrast with Oakwood, which is low density urban. 

My own personal thoughts/feelings of course...

[Green_man]

Rendering updates...

• Walter Tower: 33-story. 10 level, 193 room Marriott Autograph boutique hotel; 22 levels, 294 luxury apartments.  Fall 2018 construction start.
• Tower 4: 20-story.  11 floors office, 325,000 sq. ft.; 8 floors parking, ground floor retail.  Summer/Fall 2018 construction start.
• Tower 5:  12-story. 300,000 sq. ft. office, ground floor retail.   adjacent connected parking deck.  No construction schedule.  Waiting for tenants.  Plans could change...

more info... https://www.newsobserver.com/news/business/article215561800.html

[Trent Y]

Did I miss a rendering for the 15 story Cardinal expansion tower?

[KJHburg]

Today at Midtown at North Hills and it appears the 20 story office tower is starting.  They were doing soiling testing or starting the footers.  this is the spot where the Tower 4 will rise.   (like the astroturf yard by Chuys that grass looking really real)   As I have said before this is the most dense mixed use project in any suburban area from DC to Atlanta.  There is nothing this densely developed in Charlotte outside of Uptown and the immediate area.