Nashville or Memphis

[northernbizzkit1]

As far as POTENTIAL, I'd say Memphis. Simply because there are so many historic places and areas downtown that just scream to be developed and/or refurbished. The companies, transportation, and people are here; it's time for Memphis to actually serve such ammenities.

[Rural King]

I prefer ummmm.......both. LOL They are so different they are not really comparable. If you want a more modern, cleaner, less gritty city with lots of economic, residential, and retail expansion then Nashville is the place to be. If you want a super vibrant and historic downtown, a city not cut up by interstates, full of soul and class, lots of grit, good economic growth, etc, then Memphis is the way to go. Its really all about what you want out of a city. I like them both, but for completely different reasons. I guess I might prefer Memphis a tad as far as visiting and going to goes (I love the architecture and history there), but would rather live in Nashville long term wise (I really like the West Meade area).

I REALLY LIKE MEMPHIS BUT THERE SKYLINE IS AWFUL I MEAN ITS LOOK LIKE PADUCAH KY,,,

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This guy is banned and all, but he is right that Paducah is an awful lot like Memphis as far as overall feel and look downtown goes, only safer and cleaner. LOL Paducah is a great little city!!! I love it. I would live there in a heartbeat.

Its one of my favorite places. So please don't get a bad impression of it, since I will assure you its one of the best little citys in the country(at least IMO).

[sleepy]

I prefer ummmm.......both. LOL They are so different they are not really comparable. If you want a more modern, cleaner, less gritty city with lots of economic, residential, and retail expansion then Nashville is the place to be. If you want a super vibrant and historic downtown, a city not cut up by interstates, full of soul and class, lots of grit, good economic growth, etc, then Memphis is the way to go. Its really all about what you want out of a city. I like them both, but for completely different reasons. I guess I might prefer Memphis a tad as far as visiting and going to goes (I love the architecture and history there), but would rather live in Nashville long term wise (I really like the West Meade area).

This guy is banned and all, but he is right that Paducah is an awful lot like Memphis as far as overall feel and look downtown goes, only safer and cleaner. LOL

[Rural King]

Funny thing is---at least for the people who are interested in this sort of thing which is generally only us city geeks ("normal people" don't care)---neither city particularly likes to be compared to each other.  Certain Memphians most likely cringe when naive Europeans say "Memphis, country music?", while certain Nashvillians most likely do the same when they hear, "Nashville, Beale Street?"

Point is, to insult everyone I'll just say that both cities are more alike than different.  Plop a Minnesotan down in either place and tell them it's either Memphis or Nashville and they wouldn't know the difference.  Same could be said of most people outside the region.

Sorta like me telling you how really, really different Austin MN is from Albert Lea MN.  Residents would tell you it's night and day.  An outsider would think they're twins.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

For non-southerners the difference might not be that different, but I think for most locals there is a distinct difference in opinion about the two cities, ie Memphis has a much more negative image then Nashville.

[satalac]

Funny thing is---at least for the people who are interested in this sort of thing which is generally only us city geeks ("normal people" don't care)---neither city particularly likes to be compared to each other.  Certain Memphians most likely cringe when naive Europeans say "Memphis, country music?", while certain Nashvillians most likely do the same when they hear, "Nashville, Beale Street?"

Point is, to insult everyone I'll just say that both cities are more alike than different.  Plop a Minnesotan down in either place and tell them it's either Memphis or Nashville and they wouldn't know the difference.  Same could be said of most people outside the region.

Sorta like me telling you how really, really different Austin MN is from Albert Lea MN.  Residents would tell you it's night and day.  An outsider would think they're twins.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

i agree, to outsiders, they are two southern cities in tennessee with music history. and i think i could tell the difference between austin and albert lea. austin is home of spam.

[sleepy]

For non-southerners the difference might not be that different, but I think for most locals there is a distinct difference in opinion about the two cities, ie Memphis has a much more negative image then Nashville.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes, a difference between the two may be image, but in a way that's what I was talking about. For outsiders, the reality may be more real than the image.

For locals, the actual differences may be marginal, yet marginal differences become magnified as a way of defining the two places. It's like two houses in the same subdivision with the same floor plan, yet one house is painted blue and the other is painted green. They become defined by their colors.

[Rural King]

Yes, a difference between the two may be image, but in a way that's what I was talking about.  For outsiders, the reality may be more real than the image.

For locals, the actual differences may be marginal, yet marginal differences become magnified as a way of defining the two places.  It's like two houses in the same subdivision with the same floor plan, yet one house is painted blue and the other is painted green.  They become defined by their colors.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I just don't know about that, at least from my point of view. I think most people find Nashville and Memphis to be quite different cities. I know I do as far a history, feel, and appearance goes. I find both to be completely different cities. Most people I know, ie ones who could care less, also tend to view them both very differently on more than marginal ways. I really do find them to be very different cities overall, but not necessarily with one better than the other. I however find major differences between people from West and Middle Tennessee, not to mention East Tennessee. I find all three "Grand Divisions" are quite unique, which IMO makes each divisions cities and communities quite different from ones in other divisions.

[showtime21]

I prefer ummmm.......both. LOL They are so different they are not really comparable. If you want a more modern, cleaner, less gritty city with lots of economic, residential, and retail expansion then Nashville is the place to be. If you want a super vibrant and historic downtown, a city not cut up by interstates, full of soul and class, lots of grit, good economic growth, etc, then Memphis is the way to go. Its really all about what you want out of a city. I like them both, but for completely different reasons. I guess I might prefer Memphis a tad as far as visiting and going to goes (I love the architecture and history there), but would rather live in Nashville long term wise (I really like the West Meade area).

This guy is banned and all, but he is right that Paducah is an awful lot like Memphis as far as overall feel and look downtown goes, only safer and cleaner. LOL  Paducah is a great little city!!! I love it. I would live there in a heartbeat.

Its one of my favorite places. So please don't get a bad impression of it, since I will assure you its one of the best little citys in the country(at least IMO).

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I agree Paducah and Memphis skylines are similar, Paducah is a nice place but I believe for a city of its size Memphis skyline should be compared to Atlanta, Charlotte not Paducah Ky,

[Rural King]

^ Well of couse. Memphis is a large city, I was refering to the look and overall feel of the two, and not actually comparing the skylines like TopTenn was. Paducah really doesn't have a large skyline, mainly just a few decent size buildings (3 of which are 10 or over) and several superb large church towers, which is not bad for a city of its size.

[sleepy]

^ Well of couse. Memphis is a large city, I was refering to the look and overall feel of the two, and not actually comparing the skylines like TopTenn was. Paducah really doesn't have a large skyline, mainly just a few decent size buildings (3 of which are 10 or over) and several superb large church towers, which is not bad for a city of its size.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, I bet you're sorry you ever brought up Paducah, having to explain it over and over. lol

[Rural King]

^ Just trying to make myself clear.

[tournashville]

Honestly I think this thread should be closed. If not already, it will lead to a big flame war. This was ridiculous to start up anyways.

[Aporkalypse]

Nashville certainly has more potential. It has become THE hotspot for young professionals from the mid-South and is experiencing roughly twice the population growth Memphis is. Downtown has been packed and can essentially only go skyward and the area around Vandy provides a nice midtown area. Vandy itself provides a massive growth catalyst as only a great university could.

Memphis' downtown renaissance over the last decade is impressive but it is shunned by the key young professional demographic as well as new corporate relocation because of crime, poor schools, and governmental mismanagement. Other than the downtown area, Memphis is experiencing an exodus out of the city and out of Shelby Co as well.

I don't think Memphis is dying but it isn't prospering as Nashville is, either. Keep in mind I'm not a Tennessean but know the area very, very well.

[NickR78]

if you're not living in memphis, how do you know memphis is" shunned by the key young professional demographic?" Young professionals are moving to downtown in droves! Memphis has announced more downtown residential projects than nashville, and I think the city has done a better job of developing distinct downtown neighborhoods. I lived in memphis for 5 years before moving to Knoxville two weeks ago, and I could list several residential infill developments outside of downtown, yet inside the 240 loop that would suggest the exodus from the city has slowed. Sure, Vandy is a great asset to nashville's midtown area, but are you aware of all the development going on at the UT health science campus....they're building a new pharmacy school, and a huge cancer research center. And St. Jude continues to expand in downtown, luring more young professionals downtown and to the medical center. And when West Memphis, Arkansas finally succeeds in attracting major industry, (they were recently the 2nd choice for Toyota's 6th US manufacturing facility) arkansans will move east to the memphis metro just as mississippians have moved north to DeSoto county for the distribution center jobs. I think the Memphis metro area has as much potential as nashville for long term growth and development.

[sleepy]

Nashville certainly has more potential.

[NickR78]

way to go sleepy, you tell him! ; )

[brewerw]

Its really hard to believe that Atlanta has a better crime rate than Nashville or Memphis. 2nd you cant compare ANYTHING with nashville when talking about the Medical industry. In terms of jobs Ruthersford Co. mabe rapidly growing but you are also forgetting Williamson Co. Those people are very wealthy. Finally, what Aporkalypse was saying about population growth was in the Metro. Nashville's metro growth is far beyond Memphis's. I also think percentage wise that the city is growing faster too( im not totally sure about that).

[doormanpoet]

As long as I can remember, there has been competition between the two cities. Nashville is home to country music and Memphis to blues and at the time, rockabilly. Memphis has Elvis, we have Conway and Loretta. We have the Titans, and they have the Grizzlies. Nashville has banking and healthcare, Memphis has shipping and distribution. Both cities are growing, but Memphis has done a better job with restoration and urban density. It is really hard to say who is number one. I think Nashville may have the edge because Memphis is competing with Chicago in the blues area, and Atlanta was built on shipping like Memphis. Nashville does have more modern skyscrapers and we are building more, whereas Memphis has not had a tower since Morgan Keegan some 15-20 years ago.

Radnor yards in Nashville used to be the largest train yard in the country, I am not sure anymore; but Nashville does have the State Capitol.

The state needs both cities to be vibrant. Just like Chattanooga and Knoxville are competitive, so is Nashville and Memphis. It is true that pro sports don't make a city, But the Titans helped Nashville, and the Grizzllies sure helped Memphis get weekly if not daily television coverage. Memphis was always seen as a sports town before Nashville, especially with University of Memphis basketball and NHRA drag racing.

Tennessee is lucky to have 4 vibrant cities Like Nashville, Memphis, Chattanooga, and Knoxville. If you throw in Murfreesboro, Clarksville, Jackson, and the Tri-Cities, we have 8 areas of vibrancy whereas some state only have one or two.

[brewerw]

What he said!

[Aporkalypse]

Downtown Memphis is hardly "shunned by the key young professional demographic".  According to downtownmemphis.com, downtown's 11,000 residents have an average household income of $76,000.

As far as schools go, this has been debated ad nauseum in this thread.  Suffice it to say when you compare Memphis city schools to Nashville-Davidson schools (themselves the 2nd worst in the state), you are comparing a city to an entire county.  Compare the schools in Memphis-Shelby with Nashville-Davidson.

As far as Nashville being the THE center for young professionals, I'd say that most of Nashville's growth and wealth increase in the past 25 or so years has come about through the location of skilled, high-paying, manufacturing jobs, particularly in Rutherford County.

Population exodus?  2000 census put Shelby County at 897,000 and Davidson at 569,000.  2004 estimates put Shelby County at 908,000 and Davidson at 572,000. 

As far as crime goes.  Here are 2002 crime rate rankings:

http://www.citymayors.com/society/uscities_safest.html

40 dallas

41 nashville

42 memphis

43 st. louis

44 baltimore

45 las vegas

46 miami

47 detroit

48 atlanta

Same with alleged "government mismanagement':

http://www.americancityandcounty.com/news/...s_ranked_level/

Overall, Phoenix was the most efficient city. In order, the top 10 were Phoenix, El Paso, Texas; Tulsa, Okla.; Memphis, Tenn.; Nashville, Tenn.; San Diego; Dallas; Virginia Beach, Va.; Indianapolis and San Antonio, Texas. Los Angeles was found to be the least efficient.

Rethink your stereotypes and get some facts instead, or more importantly, question why you feel the need to raise those stereotypes.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I wasn't talking about downtown, I was talking about the city as a whole. The tiny percentage living downtown in nearly all cities other than a Chicago or New York are made up of young professionals that want to walk to the bars. Still, 11k is a tiny number. Memphis should be proud of what its done with its downtown, though, I don't want to take away from that. The area as a whole has trouble attracting young professionals.

Those knocking the skyline because it is like Paducah are missing some of the point. Downtown growth has followed a "new urbanism" pattern. Lots of residental development and storefronts and restaurants on the ground level of most streets to create a pedestrian environment. Safety is still an issue but it works well. Building behemoth office buildings does nothing to create a pedestrian downtown and Memphis' priorities on this were in the right place.

Population growth (per census.gov):

-The Nashville-Davidson MSA was ranked 38th at 1.353 million while Memphis was ranked 41st at 1.23 million. Between 2000 and 2003 Memphis' MSA grew 2.1% and Nashville by 3.5%.

-Memphis' MSA grew by 12.7% between 1990 and 2000, Nashville's MSA grew by 25% over the period (which is where my "growing twice as fast" idea came from). In fact, Memphis had a larger MSA than Nashville until the mid to late 90s and was considerably larger in 1980 and even 1990.

-Per Capita Income (2003)

Nashville MSA $33,368

Memphis MSA $30.557

Nat'l Avg $30.906

As for government mismanagement, everything I know comes from people who live in Memphis, they're all disgusted with it. Willie Herenton is a genuine disgrace to the city of Memphis. He says he was appointed by God, yet has a baby out of wedlock and tries to hide it by spending copious amts of money on it. Several city board members have been caught doing questionable things. The majority of people I know in Memphis are leaving it, at least for the suburbs but many for Nashville, St Louis, and Little Rock, because of the political situation.

Memphis' biggest asset right now is two terrific corporate citizens in FedEx and Autozone. They certainly do care. Realistically only a minority candidate will be able to win as city mayor in Memphis and hopefully Fed Ex will push a good retired African American exec for the position.

I think Marty Belz, who owns the Peabody group, would be great but unfortunately he could never get elected.

[satalac]

Realistically only a minority candidate will be able to win as city mayor in Memphis and hopefully Fed Ex will push a good retired African American exec for the position.

well aren't african americans the majority in memphis?

[sleepy]

I wasn't talking about downtown, I was talking about the city as

[ariesjow]

I'm biased since I grew up in Nashville but I honestly think, as far as being a "complete" city (economics, culture, QOL, etc.) and competitive with other mid-sized cities in the region and nation, that Nashville became Tennessee's premiere city a while ago.

[Clobber]

I really think that a lot of Nashville's perception of Memphis is skewed by the media in Nashville. I mean, I don't remember where I read the post, but some Nashville poster either here, on s-page, or s-city stated that the Nashville sports bureau/council stated that Memphis didn't get the NFL team because they were too poor and there were too many blacks in Memphis. There appears to be more unity or more of a concerted effort, either consciously or subconsciously, to tarnish the image of Memphis not just with warranted criticism, but outrageous, myopic disparagements.

I honestly think that Memphis' media is more respectful (perhaps even admiring) of Nashville than vice versa. Memphis is notoriously self-loathing as it is, and self-critical. That doesn't necessarily mean that the self-criticism is justified or warranted. Just like people who are self-deprecating. But combine all the media influences, and if you don't visit the cities for themselves with an open mind, your perspectives will be influenced.

Sometimes, I just don't understand why Memphians perceive their city the way they do. And I don't understand how Nashvillians can sometimes perceive Memphis in such a skewed perspective. Some of the perspectives contradict their claim to be the "Athens of the South," although meeting forumers here and elsewhere, I know there are many with a healthier, more enlightened view of their neighbors.

[brewerw]

Correct me if im wrong, but isnt that^ what Bud Adams said about the NFL and Memphis?