Lil' Rhody Lounge | Off-topic posting

[runawayjim]

the content providers are only responsible for the DRM in place. they are absolutely not at all behind the itunes/ipod lock-in, that's 100% apple. the reasoning is that they don't want to license it to others because it makes more work for them to support it. boo hoo hoo. cry me a freaking river. apple has the money and the man-power to support it, they just don't want to lose their little lock-in because they know it means more sales for them.

now, while the content providers are responsible for the DRM, it can also be said that they're responsible for the pricing. but that's wrong. they tried to have scaled pricing depending on the song. apple wanted the flat rate of $0.99 per song and told the RIAA to F off and won. apple is in a unique position, if they are so anti-DRM, as the single largest digital music retailer in the world where they can basically force the RIAA to remove DRM and still sell the songs for the same $0.99. they're just not willing to do that because the DRM is what causes the lock-in.

i think what the EU is doing is honorable as they're protecting fair use and a statement that steve jobs, himself, made (which i think is still the quote in my sig).

[Cotuit]

boo hoo hoo. cry me a freaking river.

You don't like Apple's terms of service, boo hoo hoo, cry me a freaking river. Go shop someplace else and stop whining.

[runawayjim]

You don't like Apple's terms of service, boo hoo hoo, cry me a freaking river. Go shop someplace else and stop whining.

i do. and that has nothing to do with their terms of service, it has to do with their business model, which is something they give the image of being the opposite of. they're a big corporation that tries to look like a better big corporation than microsoft (another big corporation). they're on the same exact level as microsoft, no better, no worse (except that i think MS has spent more money on charities than apple).

[Cotuit]

they're a big corporation that tries to look like a better big corporation than microsoft (another big corporation).

We established that.

I should say that I basically consider Apple to be just another big company looking to maximize profits at the expense of all else.

They're not trying to look better than Microsoft in any warm and fuzzy way, they are trying to create a better product, which many agree they have.

[runawayjim]

They're not trying to look better than Microsoft in any warm and fuzzy way, they are trying to create a better product, which many agree they have.

they have... but you're locked in to buying expensive hardware when you can get the same exact hardware for a lot cheaper, but you can't run the better product (OS X) on it because apple won't let you. why buy an apple computer when you can get the same exact hardware for several hundred dollars less?

Edited April 10, 2007 by runawayjim

[Cotuit]

they have... but you're locked in to buying expensive hardware when you can get the same exact hardware for a lot cheaper, but you can't run the better product (OS X) on it because apple won't let you. why buy an apple computer when you can get the same exact hardware for several hundred dollars less?

It's an entire bundled experience. OSX works so well because Apple controls the hardware. If any goof could make a box to run OSX on, it wouldn't run nearly as well as Apple has it running now. And I am not ashamed to fork over a little extra cash for the stunning design excellence that Apple wraps their hardware in.

Hardware and software Apple wins hands down for what I want out of my computer than any other hardware/software combination I've ever invested in. YMMV.

[runawayjim]

It's an entire bundled experience. OSX works so well because Apple controls the hardware. If any goof could make a box to run OSX on, it wouldn't run nearly as well as Apple has it running now. And I am not ashamed to fork over a little extra cash for the stunning design excellence that Apple wraps their hardware in.

Hardware and software Apple wins hands down for what I want out of my computer than any other hardware/software combination I've ever invested in. YMMV.

i like to get the most for my money and don't care what the package looks like (although in a laptop, i want something small and minimalist with keys that are easy to use, which apple's laptops don't have just yet, even though the 17" one has lots of unused real estate, they cram the keys into a small area). apple just doesn't allow me to do what i want to do for the price i want to spend. i'm not interested in a very closed box product.

[jencoleslaw]

i used macs until i got into non profit work (7 years ago) and this past weekend i had the opportunity to help my mother's friend with her Mac and it was just like riding a bike...certainly there's been a lot of change since i used the MacOS but damn it was sweet. I kept looking for the hard drive to bang my knee on. THERE WASN'T ONE! even the printer, which was an HP matched the monitor and had a very small footprint. it was like dinnerware, it was so lovely. i could have easily eaten a grilled cheese sammich off it.

[Liamlunchtray]

the content providers are only responsible for the DRM in place. they are absolutely not at all behind the itunes/ipod lock-in, that's 100% apple. the reasoning is that they don't want to license it to others because it makes more work for them to support it. boo hoo hoo. cry me a freaking river. apple has the money and the man-power to support it, they just don't want to lose their little lock-in because they know it means more sales for them.

now, while the content providers are responsible for the DRM, it can also be said that they're responsible for the pricing. but that's wrong. they tried to have scaled pricing depending on the song. apple wanted the flat rate of $0.99 per song and told the RIAA to F off and won. apple is in a unique position, if they are so anti-DRM, as the single largest digital music retailer in the world where they can basically force the RIAA to remove DRM and still sell the songs for the same $0.99. they're just not willing to do that because the DRM is what causes the lock-in.

i think what the EU is doing is honorable as they're protecting fair use and a statement that steve jobs, himself, made (which i think is still the quote in my sig).

Are you just pissed that the non DRM stuff costs more? I dont think $1.29 for DRM free music is all that unreasonable. Hopefully they will be adding more material as time goes on. I say if you dont want DRM just buy it in a store and rip it yourself - whats so hard about that. Apple supports a wide variety of ripping codecs built right into their apps, and its not like the iPod requires you use DRM encoded material. I dont like DRM either, and I have never bought a track from iTunes. No big deal. I suppose I might not like the iTunes/iPod tie in, but I have never seen an MP3 Management app as good as iTunes. It is the best hands down, and it has no problem handling enormous quanities of MP3's. I suppose if you dont like having your hands tied to iTunes you could always buy a Zen or something, but then you wouldnt get the ipod interface, which is really what you are buying with an iPod...

[runawayjim]

Are you just pissed that the non DRM stuff costs more? I dont think $1.29 for DRM free music is all that unreasonable. Hopefully they will be adding more material as time goes on. I say if you dont want DRM just buy it in a store and rip it yourself - whats so hard about that. Apple supports a wide variety of ripping codecs built right into their apps, and its not like the iPod requires you use DRM encoded material. I dont like DRM either, and I have never bought a track from iTunes. No big deal. I suppose I might not like the iTunes/iPod tie in, but I have never seen an MP3 Management app as good as iTunes. It is the best hands down, and it has no problem handling enormous quanities of MP3's. I suppose if you dont like having your hands tied to iTunes you could always buy a Zen or something, but then you wouldnt get the ipod interface, which is really what you are buying with an iPod...

no, i am not pissed about that. re-read what i wrote, it doesn't say that at all. what i am saying is that apple can force them to sell DRM-free music for the same $0.99 and can force them to sell only DRM-free music. i don't like itunes because it's becoming very big brother-ish on my computer. i install it and disable all the services it installs, run it and it starts them back up, causing me to get this annoying pop up every few days asking me to upgrade itunes and quicktime. you can't get it not bundled with quicktime, which is also a pain. so while the interface might be great, the program itself sucks for the other things it does. i like my computer to do what i want, when i want it... not decide what it should do for me.

[Cotuit]

i like my computer to do what i want, when i want it... not decide what it should do for me.

Haha, you use Windows?

And I think you way over-estimate the power of Steve Jobs in relation to forcing the record companies to do anything.

[runawayjim]

Haha, you use Windows?

And I think you way over-estimate the power of Steve Jobs in relation to forcing the record companies to do anything.

yes, i use windows because the software i use regularly doesn't work in linux and there's no good alternative that does everything i need (dreamweaver, quicken, ms office). if there were real alternatives that worked well, i'd be using linux. once my fiancee comes back, i'm putting all that software on her machine and turning mine into a linux box, which i'll use regularly and do my finances on her machine. she doesn't know this yet though.

steve jobs forced the record companies into his pricing scheme when they wanted something different. now that itunes music store has become so established and is the largest retailer for digital music, i think steve can strong arm the record companies into removal of DRM.

the thing that pisses me off the most about the DRM issue is that he won't sell songs from independent artists that request no DRM without DRM because he claims the software doesn't work that way (although it should). this means that if they sell creative commons licensed music with DRM, he's violating the license.

[Liamlunchtray]

I still dont understand what the point is in getting upset about DRM when you can just buy CD's in the store. Of course I'm a huge Apple nut and TOTALLY drink the kool-aid so I cant really judge....

[Cotuit]

yes, i use windows because the software i use regularly doesn't work in linux and there's no good alternative that does everything i need (dreamweaver, quicken, ms office).

Those all work in OSX, I have them all except Office, because I find that iWork and NeoOffice work just fine for me. I'd use Quicken if Microsoft Money's proprietary system easily transfered, but it doesn't, so MS Money is the only thing I use my PC for.

Still, I'm not seeing why you think Jobs can force the record companies to do anything. Have you read any memos from the RIAA lately. If they had their way we'd be paying for each listen. They're trying to get Apple to raise the $0.99 price on DRM music. You think they're all ready to sign up for $0.99 DRM free music and Jobs is being stubborn?

[runawayjim]

I still dont understand what the point is in getting upset about DRM when you can just buy CD's in the store. Of course I'm a huge Apple nut and TOTALLY drink the kool-aid so I cant really judge....

i buy CD's in the store. i don't have an mp3 player, nor do i plan on buying one (of course one was left in my office about 4 weeks ago, so i might take it home with me if no one claims it by the end of the semester).

the issue with DRM is it doesn't allow for fair use. fair use means being able to listen to the song as it was intended on whatever medium you wish. the DMCA makes it illegal (although it's unenforceable) to take the DRM off of DRM'd songs. that makes it illegal for me to burn itunes purchased songs to a CD and then rip the song (not to mention it reduces the quality even further).

i have nothing against apple computers, they're great computers. i have nothing against the ipod. i just don't like that apple tries to pass the buck. they can make their system more open if they wanted, but they enjoy the lock-in caused by their DRM. the bigger issue i have with apple and DRM is that steve jobs once said that you should be able to listen to music on any medium you want if you purchase it legally. he prevents this through his use of DRM. now even though the DRM is "forced" by the record companies, he prevents this through the fact that he won't license fairplay to other mp3 player vendors. that lack of licensing has nothing to do with the record companies.

[Cotuit]

he prevents this through the fact that he won't license fairplay to other mp3 player vendors.

Because Apple is an evil corporation out to make money, just like every other corporation. They aren't going to go all Creative Commons and Open Source. "Here we made something great that makes us millions of dollars, would everyone else like some?" Of course not.

[runawayjim]

Those all work in OSX, I have them all except Office, because I find that iWork and NeoOffice work just fine for me. I'd use Quicken if Microsoft Money's proprietary system easily transfered, but it doesn't, so MS Money is the only thing I use my PC for.

Still, I'm not seeing why you think Jobs can force the record companies to do anything. Have you read any memos from the RIAA lately. If they had their way we'd be paying for each listen. They're trying to get Apple to raise the $0.99 price on DRM music. You think they're all ready to sign up for $0.99 DRM free music and Jobs is being stubborn?

i am unwilling to pay a premium for hardware that i can get for a much lower price. that's why i want to switch to linux over OSX.

jobs already forced the record companies to his $0.99 price. they've given up that fight. i'm sure he can eventually force them into DRM free music and then $0.99 DRM free music.

[Liamlunchtray]

i don't have an mp3 player, nor do i plan on buying one

Now I'm even more confused. Why be all up in arms about how Apple sells product if its not even a product you purchase?

[runawayjim]

Now I'm even more confused. Why be all up in arms about how Apple sells product if its not even a product you purchase?

principle

[jencoleslaw]

why can't we all just get along?

[TheAnk]

Of course if your entire reason for posting is to bash apple and the left wing morons who use their products then I'll respectively bow out of this conversation and let you have your fun.

Yes, hit the nail on the head there.. Exactly.. Its the perfect storm in Ankdom, as Segal so eloquently called my world..

[jencoleslaw]

Yes, hit the nail on the head there.. Exactly.. Its the perfect storm in Ankdom, as Segal so eloquently called my world..

[TheAnk]

I find it surprising that some people on here did not know that Apple is the prefered pc/mp3 player/"good" company for the left libbies.. I thought this was widespread knowledge..

My gripes are the same as jims.. I have both a Creative MP3 player and an iPod.. The iPod was a gift, I would not have bought one on my own.. Once it is up and set to my liking, it is far better interface without question..

I have an extensive music collection.. Creative allows easy on easy off, any format, drag and drop like a removable media drive. Apple does not, and now converts your music to ID3 tags automatically, which makes renaming my collection of 200 Gb in iTunes to my desired display format pretty daunting.. (if anyone knows how to import music using the file name on your pc instead of ID3, PLEASE help me out!!)

iTunes does not handle big volumes well.. And if you buy a song there, you can only use on iPod.. Which is exactly opposite of what should be the iPod's greatest strength, synergy regardless of medium; PC, car, stereo, mp3 player, etc... Instead, Apple wants you to tote iPod to your stereo, car, etc, thus making your music collection and iPod one and the same.. I didn't know what DRM or ACC were (why ipod and itunes are exclusive).. Now I know the direct reason why I dislike the iPod and interface.. Thanks..

Sometimes you just want to burn a cd.. I'd rather pay $2 a song and be able to use as I please than pay $1 and be a slave to the ipod..

[JJK5]

For the past two weeks I've been getting an unusual amount of wrong numbers/hang ups on my caller ID. First some fence company in central falls kept calling about a fence I supposedly ordered. Probably for the spacious yard a second floor apartment usually has.. Now I keep getting calls from people with numbers originating in Central Falls/Pawtucket. If I'm actually home and pick up they just listen then hang up, or they say sorry and hang up. Very strange..

[runawayjim]

For the past two weeks I've been getting an unusual amount of wrong numbers/hang ups on my caller ID. First some fence company in central falls kept calling about a fence I supposedly ordered. Probably for the spacious yard a second floor apartment usually has.. Now I keep getting calls from people with numbers originating in Central Falls/Pawtucket. If I'm actually home and pick up they just listen then hang up, or they say sorry and hang up. Very strange..

i got a call from AAA the other day responding to a call i put in for roadside service... i never called.